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1
Posted on 10/7/25 at 4:51 pm to FooManChoo
quote:
If I say "whosoever will dunk this basketball on a regulation-sized goal will get a cookie", does that mean everyone can get a cookie?
I’m confused by this comparison…..have i missed your intended message?
Posted on 10/7/25 at 4:51 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
Really? That's interesting. I'm willing to listen to your evidence
Where’s yours that the Bhagavad Gita or Quran are made up, man made stuff?
Posted on 10/7/25 at 4:52 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
Mary is not concerned with any people still alive.
Why not?
Posted on 10/7/25 at 5:01 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
The job of the HS in NOT to make up a bunch of unbiblical stuff like purgatory and Mary worship and praying to saints
The sects of Jews that became the original Christians trace their theological lineage back to the 1st temple polytheistic cult pre-Babylonian conquest. The 1st temple adherents worshipped many lesser deities while acknowledging the supremacy of the national deity Yahweh who was still subservient to his father El Elyon - God Most High.
They worshipped El’s wife, who was Yahweh’s mother. Her name was Asherah but some called her Wisdom and some called her the Holy Spirit. Their deities weren’t yet conceived to be all knowing and omnipresent and so the lesser deities could be used for intercession to take messages and requests up to the higher deities like Yahweh or El.
In the gospel stories - which were made to be parables to reflect the “real” celestial Jesus who was killed in the sky by the archons - Jesus who was a deity became a man, and Asherah his mother became a woman (Mary).
Purgatory is non-biblical - sort of, but it is scriptural. 2 Maccabees has a verse about praying for the dead so their sins will be loosened. The earliest Christians considered a book we call 1 Enoch as divinely inspired scripture. It didn’t make the canonical “cut” in the 2nd - 4th centuries so ended up not making it into our bibles but did make it into the Ethiopian Bible (they weren’t part of the Roman Empire). In 1 Enoch it describes pits where the dead are kept and that they can have a second chance if they repent. That’s the basis of purgatory. Most modern Christians are totally ignorant of early Christian theology and history so most don’t know or understand it. Purgatory is kept alive as a “tradition” by the Catholic Church but it wasn’t only a tradition but was scriptural until some of the Roman church didn’t like it anymore.
Posted on 10/7/25 at 5:07 pm to ValZacs
quote:I could be wrong, but since the person who made the quote from John 3:16 was responding to a statement about election and then bolded the words "whosoever will", I assumed that it was intended to be a classic rebuttal of predestination/election, highlighting the free will of man to believe.quote:I’m confused by this comparison…..have i missed your intended message?
If I say "whosoever will dunk this basketball on a regulation-sized goal will get a cookie", does that mean everyone can get a cookie?
My silly analogy was intended to highlight that as a Calvinist, I can affirm the free offer of the gospel (the call for all men to believe and the salvation of any who does) while also recognizing that not everyone has the ability to believe the gospel due to the sinfulness of man's heart (total depravity) and the need for God to make someone born again by the Holy Spirit before a person can believe. If God doesn't regenerate, no one can come to Him by faith.
The point of my analogy was to say that while everyone is invited to dunk a basketball, and anyone who does dunk a basketball will get a cookie, not everyone has the ability to dunk a basketball to get that cookie. Or, as John 3:16 says, anyone who does believe in Jesus will be saved, but not everyone can believe in Jesus for that salvation unless it is granted to him by the Father (Jn 6:65).
Posted on 10/7/25 at 5:23 pm to FooManChoo
Ok, I understand where you are coming from now. I am not Calvanist but i get it. Thanks.
Posted on 10/7/25 at 5:58 pm to Squirrelmeister
You are equally as rigidly dogmatic and fully convinced in your own beliefs as Foo. That is why you have such a problem with him- he’s the positive to your negative. You two are equal opposites- well informed in your respective positions, unwavering in your beliefs, and unrelenting in your evangelism. Just like Foo (the most prominent Protestant apologist), and Champagne (the most prominent Roman Catholic apologist), you (the most prominent atheist apologist) absolutely cannot let one of these threads pass you by, without injecting your own brand of truth into it. It makes sense for Foo and Champagne, but it’s just dumb for an atheist to exert this much energy on something he doesn’t believe in. I don’t argue with kids who still believe in Santa. 
(which you should realize, as an atheist, that if you’re right- Christianity and Santa Claus serve the same purpose) Like I tell my children- do you want to be right, or do you want to be happy? They often contradict each other.
You are everything that you hate. I sincerely don’t mean that at as insult. I like you. All things withstanding. I just think you’re blind to the aforementioned observations. It’s kinda funny.
(which you should realize, as an atheist, that if you’re right- Christianity and Santa Claus serve the same purpose) Like I tell my children- do you want to be right, or do you want to be happy? They often contradict each other. You are everything that you hate. I sincerely don’t mean that at as insult. I like you. All things withstanding. I just think you’re blind to the aforementioned observations. It’s kinda funny.
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:05 pm to Mo Jeaux
quote:You know the Qur'an affirms the Bible as the word of God, right?
Quran
quote:Have you ever read that? Tell me what it says about creation or the source of morality. Also, tell me where it says it is the word of Krishna and not just a story about Krishna. IOW, does it attest to itself as being the divine word of the most high? It is written by eyewitnesses to God's revelation? The point is, it doesn't even claim to be the word of God. It's just an amusing story written by someone. It has no real attachment to history
Bhagavad Gita
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:07 pm to Mo Jeaux
quote:1. Why would she be?
Why not?
2. Scripture tells us that people in God's presence are no longer concerned with worldly things
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:11 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
You know the Qur'an affirms the Bible as the word of God, right?
The corrupted word of God, yes.
quote:
Have you ever read that? Tell me what it says about creation or the source of morality. Also, tell me where it says it is the word of Krishna and not just a story about Krishna. IOW, does it attest to itself as being the divine word of the most high? It is written by eyewitnesses to God's revelation? The point is, it doesn't even claim to be the word of God. It's just an amusing story written by someone. It has no real attachment to history
I don’t care what it claims to be.
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:25 pm to Prodigal Son
quote:
You are equally as rigidly dogmatic and fully convinced in your own beliefs as Foo. That is why you have such a problem with him- he’s the positive to your negative.
I hope this is in reference to opposite electrical polarity and not saying I am negative, because I think of myself as a very positive person.
quote:
Just like Foo (the most prominent Protestant apologist), and Champagne (the most prominent Roman Catholic apologist), you (the most prominent atheist apologist)
Hey, thanks I guess
quote:
It makes sense for Foo and Champagne, but it’s just dumb for an atheist to exert this much energy on something he doesn’t believe in.
I really enjoy creating persuasive arguments and I find it challenging and rewarding.
quote:
as an atheist, that if you’re right- Christianity and Santa Claus serve the same purpose
Pretty much
quote:
You are everything that you hate. I sincerely don’t mean that at as insult. I like you. All things withstanding. I just think you’re blind to the aforementioned observations. It’s kinda funny.
I like you and Champagne. You actually made me laugh out loud when I read your post.
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:27 pm to Mo Jeaux
quote:
Where’s yours that the Bhagavad Gita or Quran are made up, man made stuff?
Pardon the interruption. I couldn’t help myself.
Do you really need convincing? 
I don’t know squat about the bagdad vita. But, the Koran is so apparently man made and completely un-inspired that anyone with a junior high reading comprehension could come to that conclusion- if they desired.
But that’s not what this is about, for you. You’re just a troll. Nothing of value or substance to add to any conversation. Just catchy one liners and poor attempts at gotcha questions, born completely out of youthful ignorance (regardless of your age), with no intention whatsoever of arriving at truth. You’re just content to stew in your own prideful ignorance.
You are what Paul describes in Romans as “vessels of wrath” which God “endures with much patience.”
Good news though- it ain’t over til it’s over. I pray that the Lord opens your eyes. You will still have to accept it though. And the longer you travel this road you’re on, the harder that may be. There’s good reason why pride is an abomination, and also the common denominator among all atheists.
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:28 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
The job of the HS is to testify to Christ, as in "this is what a Christ like life looks like"
The job of the HS in NOT to make up a bunch of unbiblical stuff like purgatory and Mary worship and praying to saints and transubstantiation and on and on and on
This is clearly in opposition to Scripture.
John 14:23-26
Jesus replied, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them. 24 Anyone who does not love me will not obey my teaching. These words you hear are not my own; they belong to the Father who sent me.
25 “All this I have spoken while still with you. 26 But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.
This post was edited on 10/7/25 at 6:40 pm
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:29 pm to Squirrelmeister
quote:You again?
Squirrelmeister
quote:
The sects of Jews that became the original Christians trace their theological lineage back to the 1st temple polytheistic cult pre-Babylonian conquest
At no point in scripture was polytheism acceptable to the people of God. It was ALWAYS preached against and there were consequences, sometimes severe for idol worship. Do you know why the Israelites were carried off to Assyria and why the Judeans were carried off to Babylon? Let me guess, you've been watching that buffoon Dan McClellan quote:
They worshipped El’s wife.....
oh my. You should get together with Dorothy Murdock. Look, you can believe that crap if you want. But it's crap. Ahistorical garbage for fools.
quote:Not canonical ergo, not biblical
2 Maccabees
quote:Oh yeah? Name names
The earliest Christians considered a book we call 1 Enoch as divinely inspired scripture
As for the Jews, what page of the Tanakh or the Septuagint does Enoch appear on?
quote:Given your ridiculous AcharyaS lunacy, you probably shouldn't be casting stones
Most modern Christians are totally ignorant of early Christian theology and history so most don’t know or understand it
quote:You will be hard pressed to prove that even mainstream ancient Jewish scholars considered Enoch to be canonical or authoritative meaning, appealing to it to show that purgatory was considered reliable is spurious
it wasn’t only a tradition but was scriptural until some of the Roman church didn’t like it anymore
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:33 pm to Prodigal Son
quote:
well informed in your respective positions
Squirrel is full of garbage. The idea that the Jews/Hebrews/Israelites weren't always thoroughgoing monotheists is laughable. They were polytheists
Explain
Well, they removed those parts from their scriptures
How convenient
BUT BUT - EL!!
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:35 pm to Mo Jeaux
quote:Eh. It's duplicitous on that issue. But you knew that didn't you? So reliable
The corrupted word of God, yes
quote:Then why even appeal to it? Your juvenile response totally undermines it as a counterfactual
I don’t care what it claims to be
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:36 pm to Prodigal Son
quote:
Prodigal Son
Dismissive attitude. Openly celebrating your ignorance. You’ll forgive me if I don’t really care what you think about me. You don’t have an inquisitive mind.
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:36 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
quote:
Again, I ask, where is this? You attack your opponents' premise without proving your own
?? You're asking me to prove that God's word is authoritative? Have you not read the words of Jesus? What about false teachers? Unbelievable.
I asked you to provide Scriptural text stating that all authority is found only in Scripture.
Either you (a.) didn't read my initial (and follow-up) question carefully, or (b.) you are evading answering.
Either way, be charitable and a good example for nonbelievers that may be reading. Remember your mission as a follower of Christ.
Posted on 10/7/25 at 6:38 pm to somethingdifferent
quote:
somethingdifferent
Just like Prodigal Son, you resort to name calling, and you don’t even attempt to address the question. You answer the question just by proclaiming that you’re right and everything and everyone else is wrong. Talk about juvenile responses. It’s the intellectual equivalent of “nuh-uh”.
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