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re: I cannot believe you would support torture of American soldiers

Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:29 am to
Posted by Wtodd
Tampa, FL
Member since Oct 2013
67482 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:29 am to
quote:

torture of American soldiers

Has been going on for 100 yrs
quote:

torture of captured terrorists

I fully support this!! You want your enemy to be afraid of you
Posted by Jbird
In Bidenville with EthanL
Member since Oct 2012
73414 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:44 am to
You notice the troll dropped this POS then never returned, Toddy like in that respect.
Posted by Wtodd
Tampa, FL
Member since Oct 2013
67482 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:47 am to
Toddy's still alive?? Hell I thought he would have off'd himself already
Posted by Pinecone Repair
Burminham
Member since Nov 2013
7156 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:47 am to
You're right... if we're just a little nicer to terrorists they'll surely play be the rules!
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:51 am to
quote:

Of course I don't want American soldiers tortured But I don't give a shite what we do to a terrorist.


The US is a signatory to the various Geneva conventions that forbid torture. The Uniform Code of Military Justice prohibits the participation of members of the US Armed Forces in any kind of torture.

We should obey our laws and treaties.

Torturing people and making a mockery of the laws will create more terrorists, not lead to a solution.

ETA: back during the Bush Administration, they designated some persons as "unlawful combatants." The Geneva Conventions don't allow of that. Every class of combatant is covered and you cannot apply torture or coercion to any of them. That was not the least most criminal thing the Bushies did but it is up there.



This post was edited on 1/27/17 at 6:56 am
Posted by IceTiger
Really hot place
Member since Oct 2007
26584 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:53 am to
Isis has produced some fancy torture training videos, you should check them out...
Slow burning man in cage
Dipping cage full of people in swimming pool
Locking 6 people in a car and using it for rocket propelled grenade practice
Dragging people through streets until they die
Posted by Wtodd
Tampa, FL
Member since Oct 2013
67482 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:53 am to
quote:

Torturing people and making a mockery of the laws will create more terrorists

No
It
Won't

If this was the case, the US would be the leading exporter of terrorists bc assholes have been torturing our guys for a long fricking time.
Posted by DownSouthJukin
Coaching Changes Board
Member since Jan 2014
27177 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:56 am to
I didn't realize ISIS played by any rules or was a signatory to the Geneva Convention or the UN's proclamations on torture.

And we don't/didn't torture. We used/use enhanced interrogation tactics. Just because a bunch of lazy Congress persons can't handle it doesn't make it wrong. By that rationale, making a terrorist run a 5k would be torture.
This post was edited on 1/27/17 at 6:59 am
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:57 am to
quote:

Torturing people and making a mockery of the laws will create more terrorists

No
It
Won't
If this was the case, the US would be the leading exporter of terrorists bc assholes have been torturing our guys for a long fricking time.


Only a very few of our people have been taken frick nuts.

Just because "Six" is on the History Channel doesn't make it History.
Posted by StraightCashHomey21
Aberdeen,NC
Member since Jul 2009
125393 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 6:59 am to
quote:

That's why they receive SERE training.



The majority of the military takes a CBT that's it

That shite isn't going to help.
Posted by Mulat
Avalon Bch, FL
Member since Sep 2010
17517 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 7:01 am to
quote:

Cept islamists aren't adhering to those rules...


anymore than the Japanese and Vietnamese did
Posted by Jbird
In Bidenville with EthanL
Member since Oct 2012
73414 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 7:01 am to
Yes the bottom comes in drops something like, I just read Trump drowns puppies, then leaves.
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 7:01 am to
"Two days after the September 11 attacks, Young was inspired by President George W. Bush to enlist in the United States Army. There he hoped to earn money for college through the G.I. Bill and, in his words, "exact some form of retribution"[3] on those who caused 9/11."

On April 4, 2004,[1] five days after being sent to Iraq, Young was shot while riding in an open, unarmored truck during an ambush staged by rebels in Sadr City. One of the bullets pierced his spine and left him paralyzed from the chest down.[4]

The Last Letter[edit]


"I write this letter, my last letter, to you, Mr. Bush and Mr. Cheney. I write not because I think you grasp the terrible human and moral consequences of your lies, manipulation and thirst for wealth and power. I write this letter because, before my own death, I want to make it clear that I, and hundreds of thousands of my fellow veterans, along with millions of my fellow citizens, along with hundreds of millions more in Iraq and the Middle East, know fully who you are and what you have done. You may evade justice but in our eyes you are each guilty of egregious war crimes, of plunder and, finally, of murder, including the murder of thousands of young Americans—my fellow veterans—whose future you stole.
—Tomas Young, The Last Letter [5]
In March 2013, Truthdig columnist Chris Hedges published an interview with Young about his worldview and circumstances.[1] Young was in hospice care at the time of the interview, which was conducted at his home in Kansas City. Although he has contemplated suicide on various occasions, he decided "to go on hospice care, to stop feeding and fade away. This way, instead of committing the conventional suicide and I am out of the picture, people have a way to stop by or call and say their goodbyes."[1] He later changed his mind, saying "I want to spend as much time as possible with my wife, and no decent son wants his obituary to read that he was survived by his mother."[2]

That same month, on the tenth anniversary of the Iraq War, Truthdig published "The Last Letter"[6] by Young directed towards George W. Bush and Dick Cheney. In the letter, Young accused Bush and Cheney of war crimes; says that millions of Americans and Iraqis know "who you [Bush and Cheney] are and what you have done"; condemned "the inadequate and often inept care provided by the Veterans Administration" saying: "I have, like many other disabled veterans, come to realize that our mental and physical wounds are of no interest to you, perhaps of no interest to any politician. We were used. We were betrayed. And we have been abandoned." He further stated his belief that he and other veterans were viewed as expendable by the Bush Administration and ended by expressing hope that U.S. leaders will have the courage to apologize for the damage wrought by the war."[6]

LINK

Posted by Mid Iowa Tiger
Undisclosed Secure Location
Member since Feb 2008
18579 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 7:02 am to
You are off base of you think our enemies (AQ, ISIS, et al) will treat put soldiers better if we treat theirs better. We do our best and go out of our way to not kill their civilians - how's that being reciprocated?

Also, we treated Japense POWs pretty well in WWII how was that reciprocated?

How did we treat POWs in Vietnam? How'd that work out?

Korea?

I think you can see the point. Also remember what is being called "torture" wasn't considered so until recently. Plus, every airman, sailor, soldier, and Marine who goes through SEERs training has been interrogated with these techniques during training. I was up in Washington. It sucks arse but I would not call it torture.
Posted by Jbird
In Bidenville with EthanL
Member since Oct 2012
73414 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 7:03 am to
quote:


The majority of the military takes a CBT that's it

You mean the majority of the armed forces that will never be in a position of needing SERE techniques.
This post was edited on 1/27/17 at 7:05 am
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 7:07 am to
quote:

If this was the case, the US would be the leading exporter of terrorists bc assholes have been torturing our guys for a long fricking time.


You might want to investigate asymmetrical warfare. That is the mode by which our enemies strike at us because they don't have our technology.

The United States has killed more innocents than every nation in the world combined.

I would guess that more innocents were killed on Obama's order than were killed on 9/11.



"In that speech, King called the US government "the greatest purveyor of violence in the world today", as well as the leading exponent of "the deadly Western arrogance that has poisoned the international atmosphere for so long" (is there any surprise this has been whitewashed from his legacy?). He emphasized that his condemnations extended far beyond the conflict in Southeast Asia: "the war in Vietnam is but a symptom of a far deeper malady within the American spirit." He insisted that no significant social problem - wealth inequality, gun violence, racial strife - could be resolved while the US remains "a nation that continues year after year to spend more money on military defense than on programs of social uplift" - a recipe, he said, for certain "spiritual death". For that reason, he argued, "it should be incandescently clear that no one who has any concern for the integrity and life of America today can ignore the present war." That's because:

"If America's soul becomes totally poisoned, part of the autopsy must read Vietnam. It can never be saved so long as it destroys the deepest hopes of men the world over."

Working against US imperialism was, he said, "the privilege and the burden of all of us who deem ourselves bound by allegiances and loyalties which are broader and deeper than nationalism and which go beyond our nation's self-defined goals and positions." For King, opposing US violence in the world was not optional but obligatory: "We are called to speak for the weak, for the voiceless, for victims of our nation and for those it calls enemy . . . ." The entire speech is indescribably compelling and its applicability to contemporary US behavior obvious. I urge everyone who hasn't already done so to take the time to read it."

LINK

We must destroy the Dark State and the Military Industrial Complex. It may be too late.
This post was edited on 1/27/17 at 7:08 am
Posted by StraightCashHomey21
Aberdeen,NC
Member since Jul 2009
125393 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 7:07 am to
What are you say light oak leaf
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 7:13 am to


"1984" is a best seller again.

George Orwell’s ‘1984’ Is Suddenly a Best-Seller
By KIMIKO de FREYTAS-TAMURAJAN. 25, 2017

George Orwell’s classic book “1984,” about a dystopian future where critical thought is suppressed under a totalitarian regime, has seen a surge in sales this month, rising to the top of the Amazon best-seller list in the United States and leading its publisher to have tens of thousands of new copies printed.

Craig Burke, the publicity director at Penguin USA, said that the publisher had ordered 75,000 new copies of the book this week and that it was considering another reprint.

“We’ve seen a big bump in sales,” Mr. Burke said. He added that the rise “started over the weekend and hit hyperactive” on Tuesday and Wednesday morning. Since Friday, the book has reached a 9,500 percent increase in sales, he said.

He said demand began to lift on Sunday, shortly after the interview Kellyanne Conway, an adviser to Donald J. Trump, gave on “Meet the Press.”

LINK

ETA: Orwell wrote ‘1984’ in 1948, having lived through the propaganda of WWII.

I read ‘1984’ In High School and I haven’t read it since. One incident I remember was when the proles were at a giant rally and screaming their heads off for war with Eurasia or maybe Oceania. I forget. During the rally it was announced that Oceania was now the ally and Eurasia was now the enemy. The screaming was just as fervent.

That really happened in the real world. Nixon went to China and played the ‘China card’ with the mass murderers in Peking and no one thought it the least bit odd.


This post was edited on 1/27/17 at 7:19 am
Posted by RandySavage
Member since May 2012
30814 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 7:15 am to
quote:

After reading the comments on this board about Trump's support of torture of captured terrorists, the majority opinion is that you don't care because the torture will be of terrorists, and either (A) they deserve it, or (B) we just might learn something useful after the torture, and maybe, just maybe, save lives down the road.
But, I would ask you to think of it from the American soldier's viewpoint. If the United States soldier, airman, sailor or marine is captured, what will be their fate? Will they suffer 'enhanced interrogation,' also known as torture, because their captors think they deserve it, they might learn something useful and maybe they can save lives on their side of the battle.
Because so few Americans are now serving in the military, and so few of the military are in front line combat missions, the number of people who understand this stark reality are few. Having been in that front line (admittedly a long time ago), I believed and still believe, that if we treat enemy combatants taken prisoner humanely, that the other side will be motivated to do the same.
If, however, we endorse torture as our routine practice, then we can expect that to happen to our servicemen and women, who are taken prisoner. All it takes is for a helicopter part to go bad, or an engine to go sour, and BAM, down you go behind enemy lines. It's what our servicemen and women face every time they undertake the mission. We citizens, sitting here in our peaceful homes at our computers, should think about those who risk their lives, and declare that we are NOT for torture, in the hopes that our nation will not be seen as barbaric, and therefore our servicemen and women will not be subjected to the same evil practices.


Obama, is that you?
Posted by Jbird
In Bidenville with EthanL
Member since Oct 2012
73414 posts
Posted on 1/27/17 at 7:18 am to
Tip of the spear Homey tip of the spear!
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