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re: How is it possible that some Protestant churches support gay marriage?
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:24 pm to Uga Alum
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:24 pm to Uga Alum
quote:
Someone who believes that Jesus died for our sins can still commit unspeakable acts. And I believe if they commit those acts and don’t repent, they will not achieve salvation.
No one is achieving salvation sir. It’s a gift, not a reward for something you worked for, or helped out in, or else it ceases to be a gift. No one earns salvation. Christ paid for it on the cross, and it cost Him dearly…His life sacrificed in our stead so that we can live ourselves.
2
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:27 pm to Knartfocker
quote:Sorry for my short response. As far as I'm concerned, these are Christianity 101 questions. Basics of the gospel and salvation that are seemingly less and less understood these days.
You didn't answer my question. If everything is predetermined, how do you know that you're one of the elect?
Citing a book in the Bible doesn't answer the question because the underlying question based on your worldview would be how are you certain you aren't predestined to interpret Scripture incorrectly?
Here's what I was getting at. I took this directly from this site, but it is a decent summary of what I'm getting at about 1 John being written for the assurance of the believer.
Here are 9 evidences of election/salvation:
?
quote:
1. 1 John 1:5-7 (Walking in the Light)
5 This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all. 6 If we say that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.
2. 1 John 1:8-10 (Confession of Sin)
8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
3. 1 John 2:3-4 (Obedience)
3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
4. 1 John 2:9-11 (Love for the Brethren)
9 He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. 10 He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. 11 But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.
5. 1 John 2:15-17 (Hatred for the World)
15 Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 16 For all that is in the world--the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life--is not of the Father but is of the world. 17 And the world is passing away, and the lust of it; but he who does the will of God abides forever
6. 1 John 2:24-25 (Perseverance in Doctrine)
24 Therefore let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father. 25 And this is the promise that He has promised us--eternal life.
7. 1 John 3:10 (Righteousness)
10 In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is he who does not love his brother. 11 For this is the message that you heard from the beginning, that we should love one another,
8. 1 John 4:13 (Spirit's Testimony)
13 By this we know that we abide in Him, and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit.
9. Hebrews 12:5-8 (Discipline)
5 And you have forgotten the exhortation which speaks to you as to sons: "My son, do not despise the chastening of the Lord, Nor be discouraged when you are rebuked by Him; 6 For whom the Lord loves He chastens, And scourges every son whom He receives." 7 If you endure chastening, God deals with you as with sons; for what son is there whom a father does not chasten? 8 But if you are without chastening, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate and not sons
In other words, these are evidences that we truly belong to Christ and are joined to Him by faith for our salvation.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:28 pm to Mike da Tigah
quote:
No one is achieving salvation sir. It’s a gift, not a reward for something you worked for, or helped out in, or else it ceases to be a gift. No one earns salvation. Christ paid for it on the cross, and it cost Him dearly…His life sacrificed in our stead so that we can live ourselves.
I've heard it preached before that Jesus didn't die to make "bad" men "good", he died so "dead" men could "live."
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:29 pm to Mike da Tigah
quote:
No one is achieving salvation sir. It’s a gift, not a reward for something you worked for, or helped out in, or else it ceases to be a gift. No one earns salvation. Christ paid for it on the cross, and it cost Him dearly…His life sacrificed in our stead so that we can live ourselves.
No one is arguing that you earn it, they are arguing that you can walk away from it you don’t live a Christian lifestyle. While others are arguing once you are saved it is impossible to lose your salvation.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:29 pm to jizzle6609
quote:
I love the Orthodox. I cannot wait until we reconcile.
Also, huge respect on the Lenten season sacrifices. I learned this year of what the Orthodox do for lent (at least this dude) and I have to say it’s tough stuff. True sacrifice.
Thank God!
It makes the Pasca feat that much better!
In the same spirit, this tweet from Poso during Holy Week gave me a good laugh
Loading Twitter/X Embed...
If tweet fails to load, click here.Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:33 pm to Uga Alum
quote:I'm sure you do believe that. That's not what the Scriptures teach, though.
Greek Orthodox believe it is possible for people that aren’t Christian and have never heard of Christ or the Gospel because they live in remote parts of the world to be saved.
quote:Then why preach the gospel to anyone? Why not let people be "good people" on their own apart from Christ?
They are essentially held to a different standard than Christians. God can still see that there is good in their heart and grant them salvation. God is not going to send a good person to hell if through no fault of their own they’ve never heard of Christ.
The fact of the matter is that Jesus said that He alone is the way, the truth, and the life, and that NO ONE comes to the Father except through Him (John 14:6).
John 3:16 (and 3:18) is pretty well known. Jesus saves those who believe in Him. Apparently that was a superfluous statement, because He also saves those who do not believe in Him?
Paul says in several places that are are justified by faith in Christ, not by works of the law (being a "good" person), such as in Gal. 2:16 and Eph. 2:8-9
We're also told that there is no other name under Heaven by which we must be saved except in Jesus Christ (Acts 4:12).
So no, I don't understand the Scriptural warrant for this universalistic notion of salvation, much less the logical issues that arise from preaching the gospel to people who may be saved without Christ but may be damned by rejecting Him.
This post was edited on 5/20/25 at 9:03 pm
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:37 pm to Uga Alum
I guess some denominations feel it’s their mission to minister to all people.
I didn’t
watch or listen to the entire video, so I’m not sure of everything she said about. “queering” up the church. I don’t care what that church decides to do, but if you don’t approve, just don’t attend services or support the church.
I didn’t
watch or listen to the entire video, so I’m not sure of everything she said about. “queering” up the church. I don’t care what that church decides to do, but if you don’t approve, just don’t attend services or support the church.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:38 pm to cssamerican
quote:
No one is arguing that you earn it, they are arguing that you can walk away from it you don’t live a Christian lifestyle. While others are arguing once you are saved it is impossible to lose your salvation.
20 For no matter how many promises God has made, they are “Yes” in Christ. And so through him the “Amen” is spoken by us to the glory of God. 21 Now it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed us, 22 set his seal of ownership on us, and put his Spirit in our hearts as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come.
That's pretty clear that God is responsible for keeping us saved. If it was left up to us we would eventually all wander away at some point. The fact that a believer wakes up every day and continually has God on his mind is not his own doing. God is following through to deliver all that that have come to faith in his son. He will never forsake us. He will not lose one that his Father has given him. How does someone walk away from that? You can't.
2 Timothy 1:11-13
11 And of this gospel I was appointed a herald and an apostle and a teacher. 12 That is why I am suffering as I am. Yet this is no cause for shame, because I know whom I have believed, and am convinced that he is able to guard what I have entrusted to him until that day.
This post was edited on 5/19/25 at 6:42 pm
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:41 pm to FooManChoo
That’s not what the Gospel teaches according to your subjective interpretation. Being Orthodox, or Christian, is like wearing a seatbelt. You can still survive a car crash if you do t wear a seatbelt, but it is far less likely.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:41 pm to FooManChoo
I'm asking how you know you're elect in your worldview. I'm familiar with 1 John and Hebrews. What I'm not familiar with is how you're (or anyone for that matter) certain you've been chosen and haven't been predestined to have the rug pulled out from under you on judgement day.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:43 pm to Uga Alum
quote:
That’s not what the Gospel teaches
What is the gospel?
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:44 pm to Uga Alum
quote:Excuse me, but I've been peppering my responses with Scriptures almost the entire time in this discussion. If you think I'm taking something out of context, please let me know and defend your reasoning for it. Just saying my interpretation is "subjective" because you don't agree with it doesn't cut mustard for me. Let's have a cordial discussion if you disagree, and show me how I'm wrong from the Scriptures.
That’s not what the Gospel teaches according to your subjective interpretation.
quote:Where in the Bible does it teach that? I've provided several verses where we're taught that Christ is the only door to walk through in order to be saved. Where can I read about those who are not in Christ also receiving the benefits of salvation only found in Christ?
Being Orthodox, or Christian, is like wearing a seatbelt. You can still survive a car crash if you do t wear a seatbelt, but it is far less likely.
This post was edited on 5/19/25 at 6:49 pm
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:44 pm to Canon951
Where does it say that we get the seal through faith alone in that verse?
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:45 pm to Knartfocker
quote:God cannot lie and He has promised that if I am trusting in Jesus Christ by faith to cover my sins that my sins are forgiven and I have eternal life. He has given me evidences of this promise in His word that I can cling to, and I provided several of those evidences from 1 John.
I'm asking how you know you're elect in your worldview. I'm familiar with 1 John and Hebrews. What I'm not familiar with is how you're (or anyone for that matter) certain you've been chosen and haven't been predestined to have the rug pulled out from under you on judgement day.
I know whom I love and trust in, and I see the evidences of the Spirit's work in my life. I trust God's promises, and His promises are better than a done deal, because He cannot lie.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:45 pm to Knartfocker
quote:
'm asking how you know you're elect in your worldview. I'm familiar with 1 John and Hebrews. What I'm not familiar with is how you're (or anyone for that matter) certain you've been chosen and haven't been predestined to have the rug pulled out from under you on judgement day.
Have you not been reading all of the scripture that has been posted?
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:47 pm to Uga Alum
Ephesians 1
quote:
13 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:47 pm to Canon951
Your interpretation of scripture is subjective. Anyway, it was good speaking with all of you. But I have to retire for the evening. God bless.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:49 pm to cssamerican
quote:
No one is arguing that you earn it, they are arguing that you can walk away from it you don’t live a Christian lifestyle. While others are arguing once you are saved it is impossible to lose your salvation.
I’m arguing that God does not leave you or forsake you, and salvation is not performance based on our part. People often confuse relationship with salvation, as much as they do salvation and discipleship, mostly because they don’t dig into who is talking to who, and about what is being discussed when rightly dividing the word. Repentance is quite scriptural. Repentance from sins however is simply not found in scripture, yet that doesn’t stop people from saying it’s scriptural. Also not found is a prayer for salvation. What is in scripture regarding salvation however, and relentlessly throughout it is to “BELIEVE UPON JESUS” for salvation.
If your performance dictates your salvation rather than accepting the free gift offered us through faith in Jesus alone, and since God’s measure for entry is perfection only, then that’s not good news for mankind. None of us will make it, and that is why works of righteousness play no part in our salvation, and are intended to be an outward manifestation of God within our hearts as a witness to unbelievers, not a test of our sincerity or salvation.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:49 pm to Uga Alum
quote:Have good evening
Your interpretation of scripture is subjective. Anyway, it was good speaking with all of you. But I have to retire for the evening. God bless.
Posted on 5/19/25 at 6:50 pm to Uga Alum
How is it possible that some Protestant churches support gay marriage?
Answer = SIN
Answer = SIN
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