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re: How do we change the culture of bad decision-making?
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:16 pm to Oilfieldbiology
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:16 pm to Oilfieldbiology
quote:He clearly meant 10,000 a year.
$10,000 a week to each recipient? Holy hell thats an insane amount of money!!! You do realize you are now paying them more than 99% of people make?!?!
0
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:20 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:The entire act of incentivizing bad choices would be elevated 1000-fold.
and then there are the perverse incentives. every kid you have is an extra $10k/year (if we're talking everyone like rocket said)
That may LITERALLY be the worst idea I have ever heard.
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:20 pm to SlowFlowPro
I freaking hope
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:22 pm to SlowFlowPro
Poor people do not learn from experience like people of normal intelligence. That's why they keep buying lottery tickets no matter how much they lose over the decades.
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:26 pm to Scruffy
What is interesting about UBI is that it is a safety net would force the government to play a little social darwinism.
No one is going to approve of it if dems cry at ever sob story of it not being enough or she mother of 8 blew through it in a weekend
No one is going to approve of it if dems cry at ever sob story of it not being enough or she mother of 8 blew through it in a weekend
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:27 pm to Scruffy
quote:Actually the reason conservatives (Milton Friedman) and libertarians (Hayek) was that they believed jt would decrease this.
The entire act of incentivizing bad choices would be elevated 1000-fold.
That may LITERALLY be the worst idea I have ever heard.
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:28 pm to buckeye_vol
I could see that if only the adults receive it, but if every individual, including children, received $10k, it would be a massively fricked up system.
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:31 pm to SlowFlowPro
I got into an e-argument with a guy who would sell his Xbox at the end of each month to pay rent then rebuy a new one after the first of the month. Of course, he was losing his arse off and wouldn't have to do it if he could delay gratification for a month or two, but said he couldn't because it was a "human necessity".
With some, it's not so much an issue of education as it is an issue being unable to control their immediate impulses.
With some, it's not so much an issue of education as it is an issue being unable to control their immediate impulses.
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:32 pm to buckeye_vol
I see patients every day who live in poverty because of their completely shitty choices they have made in their life - and our social welfare system continues to perpetuate those poor choices
-many people realize that these are bad things for us to do as a society but race and economic issues have morphed into such hot button issues for the left I don't think that we would ever get a majority of our country to agree on any way to address this.
we can't even discuss this rationally on a national basis now without the racist and Hitler tags getting thrown around
-many people realize that these are bad things for us to do as a society but race and economic issues have morphed into such hot button issues for the left I don't think that we would ever get a majority of our country to agree on any way to address this.
we can't even discuss this rationally on a national basis now without the racist and Hitler tags getting thrown around
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:36 pm to Dire Wolf
quote:
No one is going to approve of it if dems cry at ever sob story of it not being enough or she mother of 8 blew through it in a weekend
that is going to be the test in terms of media-politics
this is why i think they really don't promote the idea much
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:39 pm to Scruffy
quote:Maybe, but I know the one being instituted on Norway (or one of those countries) designated like half the adult income to children (something like 12,000 and 6,000).
I could see that if only the adults receive it, but if every individual, including children, received $10k, it would be a massively fricked up system.
Ideally, whatever is given, should only be enough to make ends meet. If that's the case, then the money from dependents shouldn't reinforce people to have children for the dependents alone.
Either way, if it's a fixed amount then unlike today, there is not a disproportionate value that be gained by each additional child with the various thresholds.
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:39 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:So, what is the incentive not to continue having as many children as possible?
Maybe, but I know the one being instituted on Norway (or one of those countries) designated like half the adult income to children (something like 12,000 and 6,000).
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:42 pm to Scruffy
quote:Because I've learned first hand the last 5 months, babies are expensive and tiring.
So, what is the incentive not to continue having as many children as possible?
It would be nice to have 6,000 to mitigate the costs, but that doesn't make me want to have a whole bunch more than I do now because the opportunity costs would be the same for each additional child, if not more as that's even more fatigue. Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:45 pm to Scruffy
quote:
So, what is the incentive not to continue having as many children as possible?
What about a reduction in benefits for each additional child?
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:45 pm to buckeye_vol
quote:You do realize that without UBI, there are already people in our country who are incentivized to have as many kids as possible due to the increased welfare received per child?
Because I've learned first hand the last 5 months, babies are expensive and tiring. It would be nice to have 6,000 to mitigate the costs, but that doesn't make me want to have a whole bunch more than I do now because the opportunity costs would be the same for each additional child, if not more as that's even more fatigue.
Do you see that worsening or improving if every child is an additional $6k per year?
You are seemingly intelligent. You don't fit this thread because you obviously make good decisions.
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:48 pm to CoachChappy
quote:
ETA example: If you have 1 baby, we (the government/American people) will help you out. When you have your 2nd-10th, you are on your own.
ETA2: The above example is for single mothers on welfare.
I get this line of thinking, the problem though is you're essentially punishing the kid
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:49 pm to Scruffy
quote:Improve because it's fixed. I may be wrong, but in the current system, the benefits often increase with additional children. Those entitlement cliffs are often very steep.
Do you see that worsening or improving if every child is an additional $6k per year?
This post was edited on 2/13/17 at 1:51 pm
Posted on 2/13/17 at 1:49 pm to Draconian Sanctions
The welfare system rewards single mothers who don't work or work very little. It's reinforcing poor choices.
Posted on 2/13/17 at 2:10 pm to Draconian Sanctions
quote:
I get this line of thinking, the problem though is you're essentially punishing the kid
If you don't buy birthday gifts for random kids that you do not know then you're essentially punishing the kid.
Posted on 2/13/17 at 2:16 pm to SlowFlowPro
Poor people tend to throw their trash on the ground (in their own yard) and otherwise junk up their own house. They proverbially shite in their own nest.
Ain't no "outside structural factor" causing that.
Ain't no "outside structural factor" causing that.
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