re: How did the framers understand or define justice?

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And then victimhood when she has no other response.

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Can you link an example of me proclaiming to be a victim?

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Can you link an example of me proclaiming to be a victim?

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Oh good grief, just stop it.

Everyone here is familiar with your schtick. I have neither the time nor inclination to go back thru even your most recent posting history.

BTW, I notice you ignored the post I responded to.

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Prepare thy anus for dishonesty, feigned ignorance of common sense/ established law and anything that doesn't further the OP's world view ...

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No rights exist without the government there to enforce them, though.

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100 percent false. Every government ever created back to the dawn of man, including this one, proves otherwise.

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For example, should the son of a prominent judge who gets arrested for repeated DWIs get off every time because of who his father is? How should society respond if/when that happens?

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This is something everyone is against, and we have conflict of interest rules/policies aimed at preventing it. Obviously it still happens but its not like its something people want or will defend. Do you think this scenario is something that needs to be debated?

Do you think that there are people who believe the kids of judges should be allowed to get away with crimes?

Again just ask whatever it is you really want to discuss, its obvious you really want to shoehorn something else in once you get the right response so just skip ahead to it.

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You made a factual claim about my posting history and declined to provide an example.

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Again, not necessary. You just admitted yourself that it’s a factual claim.

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It appears from this thread that 4commies is not really a serious constitutional analysis person.

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This isn't even a thread about Constitutional analysis...

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How can a government prove that rights preexist government?

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Which one?

As far as this government, it references the founding documents that predate the republic.

In said documents, the first amendment clearly states "Congress shall make no law.....".

And to add how you were wrong... you will notice the actions of government in the past that have been clear violations of rights.... right up to Covid. And of government was the freeholder of rights..... there would be no need for federal civil rights litigation against governmental entities, right? Does it happen?

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The whole problem of slavery was a grave injustice.

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Was it really or was it a fact of every day life until Europeans ended it for European cultures alone. Slavery existed since dawn of time. Every race, ethnicity, creed, culture, etc has been victim to it. Heck, more Europeans were sold into slavery in Africa than Africans were sold into slavery to Europeans(using Europeans for tUSA as well). We need to get past that.

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but our framers didn't address it on purpose.

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Because it was acceptable globally even though a few of the FFs didn't agree with it. They already were revolutionary in governence on many fronts. I do not hold the lack of address to slavery against them.

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Natural rights are rooted in justice. If every person possesses inherent rights, then justice requires respecting those rights by virtue of our humanity, not because a government is threatening to punish us if we don't

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I agree 100%, but we are far, far away from being able to live in true anarchy. By anarchy, I mean its real definition. Orderly rule of self.

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Crime is a social construct.

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I love your threads. It’s like listening to a three-year old talk about the weather.