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re: How big a role did Russia play in WWII?
Posted on 5/9/20 at 6:58 pm to Darth_Vader
Posted on 5/9/20 at 6:58 pm to Darth_Vader
Russia also did a great service to USAAF pilots by taking all the P-39s we could send them.
1
Posted on 5/9/20 at 6:58 pm to scionofadrunk
quote:
80% of Russian males born in 1923 died between June 22, 1941 and May 8, 1945
Thats almost unbelievable
Posted on 5/9/20 at 7:07 pm to Zach
Zach,
The Russians did just that, produce T-34s by the thousands, to get there, do the job, or try to, and bring in another thousand.
They figured out a couple of simple things as well. Diesel freezes at a much lower temperature than gas, and instead of putting tons of extra weight on the front of the vehicle to repel shells....why not just slope the front so the shells bounce off.
Germans reverse engineered the Tiger from the t-34 in part, and typical of them, made it too complex, too big, and a gas guzzler that could not operate in close quarters of destroyed cities.
The Russians did just that, produce T-34s by the thousands, to get there, do the job, or try to, and bring in another thousand.
They figured out a couple of simple things as well. Diesel freezes at a much lower temperature than gas, and instead of putting tons of extra weight on the front of the vehicle to repel shells....why not just slope the front so the shells bounce off.
Germans reverse engineered the Tiger from the t-34 in part, and typical of them, made it too complex, too big, and a gas guzzler that could not operate in close quarters of destroyed cities.
Posted on 5/9/20 at 7:07 pm to Brosef Stalin
quote:
The Germans wouldn't have had to worry about the Russians at all had Hitler not violated their non aggression pact. Its entirely his own fault.
Both sides were planning on betraying the other. If Hitler didn’t attack Russia, Russia would have attacked Germany. Their alliance was never going to hold.
Posted on 5/9/20 at 7:13 pm to deltaland
quote:
Hitlers biggest blunder was redirecting his northern army south to Stalingrad when they had Moscow in their sights. Had he not done this, the Nazis would have taken Moscow before winter.
I’d argue invading Yugoslavia was his biggest frick up, which delayed Operation Barbarossa by 2 months.
Posted on 5/9/20 at 7:14 pm to jimdog
quote:
In it's inception up to their necks. Invading and taking territory. In fact they drove some that would have never faced off against the Brits into the NAZI camp. There is an American Ranger hero with a military installation named after him who fought the Russians in the days leading up to WWII when they invaded his Nordic country. Then joined the German SS when his country capitulated to fight the Russians again. When WWII ended he got away and sailed on a cargo ship as a worker and jumped over board in the Mobile bay and swam to shore. He found his way to an America Army post and talked them into taking him on as a private in the infantry. He volunteered for Ranger training and fought in Korea and made rank and was a selected special forces airborne ranger in Vietnam. An Army legend as a matter of fact. He died jumping into a surrounded special forces camp which was a suicide mission and he was the only volunteer. An installation here in the states bears his name.
He fought for his home country against the reds, fought for the SS against the reds then fought the bastards again in Vietnam for his adopted land, America. But yeah Russia was a bad actor in starting up WWII and was allied with Germany for a time when they thought they would get all this territory out of the alliance.
His adopted American name is Larry Thorne. He is buried in Arlington National Cemetery. He was native Finnish (Lauri Torni). He did fight against the Soviets for his native country (was awarded the Finnish equivalent to the Medal of Honor)and then fought as a officer in the Waffen SS against the soviets(was awarded the Iron Cross). He became a Special Forces SOG member in Vietnam and was actually killed in a helicopter crash. He was awarded the Bronze Star and 5 purple hearts in Vietnam! He hated communism and his story is one of the most remarkable in military history.
Larry Thorne
Larry Thorne- The Definition of a Warrior
This post was edited on 5/9/20 at 7:23 pm
Posted on 5/9/20 at 7:25 pm to Zach
quote:
My favorite piece of obscure Russian WWII history is their tanks. The philosophy was numbers, not quality.
Actually Soviet tanks in WW2 were excellent - probably the best overall of any belligerent. Even in 1941 German tanks were outclassed one-on-one by the T-34. German tank doctrine is what allowed them to slice through the Russians like a knife. Later German models like the Panther and the Tiger could handle the best Russian tanks, but their increased performance was unfortunately (for the Germans, anyway) balanced by maintenance issues which often kept them out of action. The Soviets continued to improve their tanks, too, and the late war-era IS-2 was arguably the best AFV in the world at the time it was introduced.
As far as allying with the Russians these days, that's a non-starter. Russia is not and does not want to be a member of the Western Powers club. Soviet communism may be gone, but the viewpoint of Russia's leaders is still heavily informed by the politics of that era.
Posted on 5/9/20 at 7:27 pm to FightinTigersDammit
They actually liked the P-39 
Posted on 5/9/20 at 7:29 pm to crescentcity
If this wasn't a paid ad by someone from russia I would say "hey this would make a great paid ad from russia".
Posted on 5/9/20 at 7:38 pm to TheTideMustRoll
quote:
As far as allying with the Russians these days, that's a non-starter. Russia is not and does not want to be a member of the Western Powers club. Soviet communism may be gone, but the viewpoint of Russia's leaders is still heavily informed by the politics of that era.
The Russians actually put out feelers about joining NATO, back in the day.
quote:
the viewpoint of Russia's leaders is still heavily informed by the politics of that era.
No
After the Soviet Union collapsed, Russia turned to the West, and assumed, rather naively, that they could become part of it.
Unfortunately for all involved, while Russia left the Cold War behind, the West did not. And it was largely for structural reasons. The people making policy simply didn't like Russia, and wanted to keep Russia as weak as possible. That had been the goal with the Soviets since the end of WW2 after all.
In some cases, it was simply the mindest they had been taught, and the couldn't see the war was over, in others, and Madeleine Albright is a good example of this, they just couldn't let go of their old world grievances. She was never going to forget what the Soviets did to her country.
But they all wanted Russia, broken at their feet.
And that's why they continued to push NATO expansion, into places like Ukraine and Georgia. And it's why they worked so hard to constrain Russia.
Putin is from St. Petersburg, and he was always known as an Atlanticist. Atlanticists believed Russias future was in closer ties with the West, and in copying Western norms. It was only in the middle of the least decade that he gave up (along with the rest of the Russian elite).
This post was edited on 5/9/20 at 8:38 pm
Posted on 5/9/20 at 7:46 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
They actually liked the P-39
Every P-39 sent to Russia saved one American pilot.
Posted on 5/9/20 at 8:05 pm to Lima Whiskey
Hmm. You make interesting points. Perhaps you are right.
Posted on 5/9/20 at 8:35 pm to TheTideMustRoll
The Soviets were a revolutionary power who’s very existence threatened the west, and they concluded the only way to protect the revolution, was to spread it. If Russia was the only communist country in the world, then outside powers would simply invade and destroy them. That’s why they were so active, all across the globe, supporting anyone who called themselves a communist.
By the late eighties, a strong sense of fatigue had set in. There was a sense that it was no longer worth it. They wouldn’t get any gratitude for their efforts, and it was money they didn’t have.
And that was why they held back when communist governments began to fall in Eastern Europe.
If we had Vietnam fatigue, they experienced a similar miasma.
By the late eighties, a strong sense of fatigue had set in. There was a sense that it was no longer worth it. They wouldn’t get any gratitude for their efforts, and it was money they didn’t have.
And that was why they held back when communist governments began to fall in Eastern Europe.
If we had Vietnam fatigue, they experienced a similar miasma.
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