re: Florida Surgeon General Seeks to End ALL Vaccine Mandates

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I think he's saying there are different standards of efficacy for vaccines that are offered to the public than for those mandated for the public (and I'd add yet another standard for compulsory to the public if we're going back to early 20th century smallpox).

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Exactly. A mandated vaccine offers the potential for actually eradicating a disease. That offers a tremendous amount of cost-savings. In theory, it should have a high efficacy rate and we should be able to control the transmission vectors to a reasonable degree. Influenza is a vaccine that has variable effectiveness and where we have variable control on transmission vectors.

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Really? You think the distrust earned by the medical community of experts shitting itself in slow motion was mainly due to the delivery method of the vaccine/not-a-vaccine?

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Given that people repeatedly mention the number of injections given to infants, yes, that is an important factor for the series of vaccines need to attend schools.

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No, I think that's a major part of the entire historical >200 year history of vaccine resistance and not a trivial part of this response.

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So the average Joe today, in your mind, has the same understanding of biology as someone living 200 years ago. They may not want you to inject Ebola infected blood into their arm, but if you tell them to snort it they don't know any better and they'll happily do so.

Are you serious? Do you really have that much of a God complex?

I see that differently, out of some nuance that comes from an appreciation of the wide range of efficacies different vaccines have. One thing that often gets lost in these conversations is how effectiveness works. A flu shot isn’t all-or-nothing like a seatbelt. It sometimes prevents flu completely, sometimes it just makes your case shorter and less dangerous, and sometimes it misses because the virus changed after the vaccine was made. Even “partial protection” means fewer ER visits, fewer deaths, and fewer days of missed work and school across the population.

Doctors aren’t pretending it’s perfect. They're generally trying to be transparent about the limits, but they also see, year after year, that communities with higher flu vaccination rates have less severe flu seasons. That’s why most physicians take it themselves (I take it every year).

So rather than being an example of “medicine gone wrong,” flu vaccine is a reminder of how science works in real time. We use the best available tool, we’re honest about its limits, and we keep improving.

Ahh I remember back when anti-vaxxers were beanie wearing, lesbian tree huggers. Now it’s the right wing. Time really is a flat circle.

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I detest the COVID vaccine and all the coercive activity that went with it. I’m afraid some are going to conflate that with worthwhile vaccines that have a proper risk reward.

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Someone here has a brain.

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Doctors aren’t pretending it’s perfect.

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Now do Covid.

And do doctors use the same language with their patients that’s used here? It’s not really effective enough to mandate it but there isn’t much downside? I’ve missed those PSAs.

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No, I have read histories of the anti-vaccination movement. They have the same exact arguments today that they had 200 years ago with the major exception of previous generations arguing that vaccinations were "against God's will" (or plan, etc.) and now they're the related "they're against nature, unnatural", etc. There is a lot of scientific verbiage in RFK and Mercola and these cats, but that's superficial. They don't understand it. It's for signaling purposes.

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What does that have to do with the delivery method?

There's been a fear of contamination of vaccines by injection from the beginning. Here's a cartoon of people being turned into cows by the original cowpox jab:



These fearful stories about the vaccine needle have been there from the beginning, whether it was 18th-century cartoons like this, 19th-century rumors of doctors experimenting on the poor, or 20th-century tales of dirty school needles. These weren’t just medical anxieties, but folklore about invasion and contamination.

In the internet age, it's still around and those same needle fears reappear in memes, TikToks, and conspiracies about “the jab” hiding chips or mRNA changing your DNA, poisoning you, etc. What once spread slowly through gossip now travels instantly across global networks. Today’s online conspiracies are just the old folklore of the needle, updated for the digital age.

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TigerDoc

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Imagine this wackadoodle space cadet walking into your exam room.