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Message
re: common core continues Holocaust Hoax Assignment
Posted on 5/6/14 at 11:06 am to Antonio Moss
Posted on 5/6/14 at 11:06 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
And you can do this type of analytical exercise with just about any topic in History. Why choose something so controversial?
Why not? Its hard enough to get 8th graders to do anything. You've got to smack em' upside the head sometimes.
This post was edited on 5/6/14 at 11:07 am
2
Posted on 5/6/14 at 11:10 am to SpidermanTUba
quote:
I agree. But those are issues best determined by the school. How do I know if they have the right kind of teacher and the right kind of student?
I'd wager the average teacher and average student aren't right for the exercise in the 8th grade. But I do agree that it should be a decision tailored to the school, and the school is presumably the best authority to make that determination.
Unfortunately, given the state of public education in America, we know that won't work out in a lot of cases, but there aren't a lot of good options when it comes to determining how schools should be run.
Posted on 5/6/14 at 11:19 am to SpidermanTUba
quote:So effort required to debunk is your only consideration? No concern about how the ethnic groups who are the focus of these historical events might feel?
Considering how easily some of his statements are debunked, sure.
Do you really think African Americans would or should sit still if some ignorant common core "assignment" asked students to research and report if rape and beatings really took place during slavery in the US?
Posted on 5/6/14 at 11:22 am to SpidermanTUba
quote:Because it's offensive!
Why not?
This post was edited on 5/6/14 at 11:32 am
Posted on 5/6/14 at 11:51 am to SpidermanTUba
quote:
It is well documented by historians and book writers but not *yet* by the 8th graders doing in the assignment. You don't really get the point of this, do you?
Do you actually think we shouldn't bother to tell kids WHY the things we are telling them are true are true simply because we adults already know they are true?
Even better if we can make them go dig up the "why" on their own.
There are a lot of things you should explain to kids. Why you use a certain process in math, why evolution is universally accepted by science, why chemical reactions happen.
History isn't one of those things. These kids aren't going to prove the holocaust happened, they are going to best research it, and then go ahead and research a tone of bullshite denying it happened.
Having looked up a lot of holocaust denial material, it all basically just says every document is a lie, and everyone involved is lying. Well what is to stop these kids from just believing that?
They aren'y going to europe to see tha camps. They aren't going to be polygraphing survivors. They aren'y going to be doing analysis of any franks diary for themselves
So in the end it is the same either you believe what we are telling you or you don't. But now they have been exposed to hate filed bullshite.
quote:
Of course it will. Its important they recognize bullshite and hate. I guarantee you that students who complete this assignment will be a lot less likely to become holocaust deniers late in life because they would have done the research on their own that proves it happened.
I GUARANTEE you if you looked at people who believe the holocaust happened and people who deny it happened, a greater percentage of the deniers were exposed to denial material earlier.
This post was edited on 5/6/14 at 11:54 am
Posted on 5/6/14 at 11:57 am to darkhorse
quote:I'd agree.
One of the most important responsibilities for educators is to develop critical thinking skills in students
So why did Louisiana get blasted for doing exactly this?
quote:= Good
“An exercise asking students to question whether the Holocaust happened"
quote:= Bad
“An exercise asking students to question whether Evolution excludes God"
quote:= Bad
“An exercise asking students to question whether AGW is real"
Posted on 5/6/14 at 11:59 am to darkhorse
Common Core is such a sick bit of pedagogue being released on the nations' children from K to 12. Every year with it operating will see students being taught to take the test for the level of the students not being educated for any thing else.
This post was edited on 5/6/14 at 12:25 pm
Posted on 5/6/14 at 12:25 pm to SpidermanTUba
quote:
There is one correct answer in the holocaust assignment. The evidence for the holocaust is overwhelming. Just about every single talking point on the denialist side can be debunked.
Posted on 5/6/14 at 12:26 pm to CITWTT
it's a stupid assignment ... it will teach about as much critical thinking as an secrant thread on football ...
Posted on 5/6/14 at 12:34 pm to FT
quote:
the assignment isn't much different from what debate teams do.
except that its not debateable
it's like debating on whether or not Lincoln was really assasinated
Posted on 5/6/14 at 12:36 pm to Choctaw
quote:
except that its not debateable
it's like debating on whether or not Lincoln was really assasinated
Exactly. It's just like 9/11, evolution, or AGW. There is consensus, the science is settled.
Posted on 5/6/14 at 12:38 pm to SpidermanTUba
you would think the liberals would be up in arms over this considering they are usually scared shitless of offending anyone.
Posted on 5/6/14 at 12:41 pm to Choctaw
quote:
you would think the liberals would be up in arms over this considering they are usually scared shitless of offending anyone.
Jews aren't oppressed enough for Liberal.
They are not ant-israel. Its an apartheid state don't you know.
Posted on 5/6/14 at 12:41 pm to kingbob
quote:
Exactly. It's just like 9/11, evolution, or AGW. There is consensus, the science is settled.
actually...regarding 9/11 and the holocaust...the "science" is settled.
but why not create a bunch of 8th grade, weak minded, conspiracy theory nutjobs. that should go great
This post was edited on 5/6/14 at 12:42 pm
Posted on 5/6/14 at 12:54 pm to SammyTiger
quote:
Jews aren't oppressed enough for Liberal.
They are not ant-israel. Its an apartheid state don't you know
The Jews are liberal and are not likely to abandon them (for whatever reason) because of something so trivial.
Posted on 5/6/14 at 1:01 pm to FT
quote:
Haven't read your link, but from what I recall from this story, the assignment isn't much different from what debate teams do.
You are correct. Hypotheticals are created to develop critical thinking skills. Otherwise a debate might go like this:
Aff: "Women should not be allowed to vote."
Neg: "That will never happen."
Aff: "It doesn't matter if it will happen. Should it happen is the question."
Re: age appropriateness. Holocaust Denial/Hoax would not be appropriate for elementary school. But from age 13 through 60 it would depend on IQ.
Gifted 13 year olds can debate the issue. Idiot 60 year olds still have no clue.
Posted on 5/6/14 at 1:05 pm to kingbob
quote:Proof by consensus holds no validity as a scientific precept whatsoever.
There is consensus
Posted on 5/6/14 at 1:08 pm to Zach
quote:
Re: age appropriateness. Holocaust Denial/Hoax would not be appropriate for elementary school. But from age 13 through 60 it would depend on IQ.
Gifted 13 year olds can debate the issue.
how about we let them debate on if the Civil War really happened....or if Mount Rushmore is really just a hologram?
Posted on 5/6/14 at 1:10 pm to Zach
quote:
Gifted 13 year olds can debate the issue. Idiot 60 year olds still have no clue.
whats the debate?
The argument against the Holocaust is an insane conspiracy theory, that calls pretty much every world leader a lier.
Posted on 5/6/14 at 1:12 pm to Choctaw
quote:
how about we let them debate on if the Civil War really happened....or if Mount Rushmore is really just a hologram?
You're missing the point of the word 'hypothetical'. Could we not have a debate like this:
"Resolved: If the Confederacy had won the Civil War the U.S. would be in a better state today."
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