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re: Can St. George duplicate what is going on in Central?
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:10 am to hawkeye007
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:10 am to hawkeye007
quote:
elect better officals
That's the answer, thanks.
quote:
i think its crazy that a city the size of baton rouge has so many problem with education.
Not crazy a result of years of segregation, then Federal interference, and poor supervision from elected school board members.
quote:
the state voucher system is throwing in the towel on education.
Public education in the inner city of BR has failed, what else do you suggest?
quote:
if people would stop voting party lines and actually demand their canadates for office be able to fix problems the state and city would be a better place. and quit blaming north baton rouge for your problems
I don't see anyone blaming N BR.
quote:
the crime and blight has been well contanied for years its like segregation never left this city
Few people in EBR don't know of crimes committed in their neighborhoods. Sure the gang wars get all of the headlines, but unless it's Skip Bertman's home getting robbed, little is said or done with robberies elsewhere because they are too common place.
1
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:11 am to LSURussian
i am agreeing with you 100% on this one Russian. i moved here from Dallas 15 years ago and i am still stunned at the bullshite the people of this city and this state put up with from thier politicians.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:13 am to hawkeye007
It's not "unity" the status quo wants. It's to keep the dollars exactly where they're at. Finding "good" politicians to get ahead in this system is much more far fetched than a SEBR school system
This post was edited on 2/18/14 at 10:17 am
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:17 am to doubleb
the reason the federal govt had to get involved is because the state ignored the problem for years. goes back to my statement of elect better officals. i believe you cant fix inner city school problems until you fix many other problems facing inner city children. i dont even want to get into that discussion. and like most people they dont see a problem with crime until they get robbed. i lived on the wrong side of goverment for 3 years. i didnt have a problem at all. my friends thought i was crazy but i need affordable housing after Katrina and i found it. fixed up the house sold it made a little profit and got along with all my neighbors. the reason i didnt have any problems i believe is because i didnt seek them out. i didnt buy drugs and i hang out on the porch all day drinking.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:20 am to hawkeye007
quote:Of course it is. Running away and creating even more government is not the solution to the issues we face.
this city is stronger united to fix the problem not split off and weaken the city.
If it were, why don't we just let every neighborhood in the parish form their own city? Or maybe let every street become their own city.
Think how efficient THAT would be!!!
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:22 am to hawkeye007
quote:WTF are you talking about? We have the best politicians money can buy!!
i am still stunned at the bullshite the people of this city and this state put up with from thier politicians.
I mean.....
.Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:23 am to hawkeye007
quote:
Can St. George duplicate what is going on in Central?
Let's assume Central is something you want to duplicate (and that is a separate interesting question).
Best case scenario you have a low cost government, that provides minimal services. Most services would be provided by the parish (as they basically are now). No new taxes are necessary because basically you could pay the new mayor and police chief salary with a bake sale.
Congrats! You have basically re-created the status quo! The only benefit to this situation is you can go back to the legislature and say "we are an incorporated area, can you give us a few more votes? Please?"
The potential downside could either be an old city with a huge hole in its budget (that will most likely affect the police budget) or a new city that will have to raise taxes to provide no new services. No one is really sure which yet, and that scares me.
So in summary, basically no upside and possible huge downsides. Recognize this for what it is, a huge distraction. The best bet is to wait until a new legislature comes in two years and try again for separate school system OR to go come up with some compromise reforms (like a system of charters) that isn't perfect but that everyone can live with.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:24 am to doubleb
quote:
So to surmise, you are saying the bad element is going to leave us alone as long as we stay unincorporated, but if we get too prosperous look out. They will be in our new city in hordes.
Geez, we can't win can we?????
At no time has any of this been prosperous, because you exchanged valuable areas of the city for nonsense. You erected the white surrender flag and haven't stopped retreating.
When will Baton Rouge stop, lay down the surrender flag, pick up the BR flag, turn around, and fight for their own damn city? When everyone lives along perhaps Manchac and have run out of land to evacuate to?
In almost every other city on this planet the most valuable areas to reside and that which is the highest real estate is in and close in proximity to downtown, especially when it's close to a major river the likes of the Mississippi River, and then there's LSU which is the only thing the people in the proposed St George area would consider worth investing in.. Well, maybe just Tiger Stadium. Not here and places just like it though. People here especially think it should be in Shenandoah, a place that can't even tolerate or support a damn golf course because there's too much quick money to be made, and all that damn grass and trees are a real nuisance getting in the way. We keep building bullshite, and investing in pastures, and so I have no faith in this place, save the few who do actually understand the concepts of our community being most important and worth fighting for and investing in, and I'm afraid their numbers just aren't very many to make a real lasting difference. The trend, like everything else here, is just too many years down the road, and so maybe when it does make its way here I can enjoy it from the window of my nursing home.
This post was edited on 2/18/14 at 10:33 am
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:25 am to BigJim
Jim, you make wayyyyy too much sense and intelligent comments for this topic. 
This post was edited on 2/18/14 at 10:27 am
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:36 am to Mike da Tigah
quote:
At no time has any of this been prosperous, because you exchanged valuable areas of the city for nonsense. You erected the white surrender flag and haven't stopped retreating.
When will Baton Rouge stop, lay down the surrender flag, pick up the BR flag, turn around, and fight for their own damn city? When everyone lives along perhaps Manchac and have run out of land to evacuate to?
An interesting sidenote, I just learned this weekend that the city of Zachary is experiencing a substantial outflow of homeowners who don't have children or whose children are adults and no longer are in the school system.
The reason is Zachary has increased their property taxes so much (their school taxes alone are almost double the millage of EBR) that a typical $250,000 home has an annual property tax assessment approaching $5,000.
For couples with school age children, they don't resent the taxes so much because it's still cheaper than paying for private schools. So for that demographic Zachary is an attractive location to live.
But for couples who don't have school age children, they are migrating out of Zachary. It appears their desired relocation is to either East or West Feliciana Parishes.
I wonder if we might see the same behavioral pattern for SG?
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:37 am to BigJim
quote:
So in summary, basically no upside and possible huge downsides. Recognize this for what it is, a huge distraction. The best bet is to wait until a new legislature comes in two years and try again for separate school system OR to go come up with some compromise reforms (like a system of charters) that isn't perfect but that everyone can live with.
In your opinion the status quo and your own school system isn't an upside??? That's the upside sir, and when I hear we could get the status quo and run a large surplus , it makes things even better.
The idea of the city began because the legislature basically said no city, no school system.
Now after some analysis and some digging it appears that the amount of taxes paid by unincorporated folks is not propotional to the services received. Wouldn't that pique your interests or do you believe that as long as downtown BR gets the lion share of the tax maoney everyone should enjoy the status quo as we know it?
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:38 am to doubleb
quote:
as long as downtown BR gets the lion share of the tax maoney
Why do you lie?
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:43 am to LSURussian
Zachary had 9,488 people in 1990, in 2010 they had 15,565 people. That's a 61 percent increase.
In 1990 Baton Rouge had 222,684 people and in 2010 they had 229,601 people. A 1 per cent increase.
Let's watch to see if that trend changes.
In 1990 Baton Rouge had 222,684 people and in 2010 they had 229,601 people. A 1 per cent increase.
Let's watch to see if that trend changes.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:45 am to LSURussian
quote:
I wonder if we might see the same behavioral pattern for SG?
Sounds plausible to me, especially the moving further and further out thing. One day real soon I think were all going to find ourselves living in a world we simply cannot afford because it makes no damn sense. We will be traveling absurd hours to get to work to pay for gas to get to work, and our entire lives will be living in undesirable bedroom communities with no sense of itself and no direction but further out. May want to invest in fancy double wide trailers with wheels. That probably makes more sense than a concrete foundation.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:46 am to LSURussian
quote:
Why do you lie?
I would say that this supports my opinion as "the lion's share".
According to budget documents produced by the City-Parish, the $80 million collected in St. George is placed in a separate fund called the Unincorporated Fund. The $80 million in that fund is spent in three ways:
?$17.7 million is used to pay the expenses of the constitutional offices in the parish (those agencies established by the Louisiana Constitution), such as the 19th Judicial District, Family Court, Juvenile Court, District Attorney, Registrar of Voters, and Coroner.
?$10.4 million from the fund is used to pay the expenses of parishwide agencies, such as the Parish Prison, Juvenile Services, Animal Control, Parish Health Unit, Council on Aging, Crime Stoppers, and others.
?The remaining $52 million dollars is transferred directly to the City of Baton Rouge.
Maybe you disagree, and feel this is an equitable distribution, I do not.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:50 am to Mike da Tigah
quote:
Sounds plausible to me, especially the moving further and further out thing. One day real soon I think were all going to find ourselves living in a world we simply cannot afford because it makes no damn sense. We will be traveling absurd hours to get to work to pay for gas to get to work, and our entire lives will be living in undesirable bedroom communities with no sense of itself and no direction but further out. May want to invest in fancy double wide trailers with wheels. That probably makes more sense than a concrete foundation
It is a free country, and individuals still decide where they want to live, where they want to raise their children, and where they want to work and play.
If downtown attracts people, great. I'm all for it; but it's a free country and so far people are electing to move away from town.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:55 am to doubleb
In 2000, EBR population was 412,852. In 2012 it was 444,526, an increase of over 31,000.
I'm notexactly sure what your point is. Then again, I rarely see a point to your posts.
I'm notexactly sure what your point is. Then again, I rarely see a point to your posts.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 10:55 am to doubleb
quote:
In your opinion the status quo and your own school system isn't an upside??? That's the upside sir, and when I hear we could get the status quo and run a large surplus , it makes things even better.
The idea of the city began because the legislature basically said no city, no school system
Or, they didn't want to vote for it anyway and that was a handy excuse. Between the black caucus and a few other key democrats, you are not going to reach the 2/3's mark. Maybe that will change after the next election, but you won't pick up enough votes for two years even with a city.
quote:
Now after some analysis and some digging it appears that the amount of taxes paid by unincorporated folks is not propotional to the services received. Wouldn't that pique your interests or do you believe that as long as downtown BR gets the lion share of the tax maoney everyone should enjoy the status quo as we know it?
I generally see what you mean but a few important clarifications:
1.
quote:Except that isn't paid just by the residents of the potential St. George area. These are sales taxes, mostly from perkins rowe and Mall of LA. Now maybe that is a compromise position: St. George can incorporate, but City of Baton Rouge annexxes enough land to be make whole from a revenue stand point. Still a bad idea, but at least it doesn't do tremendous harm.
taxes paid by unincorporated folks
2.
quote:To the extent that it is subsidizing City of Baton Rouge fire services I agree. But it looks like a large chunk of the funds go to the BR police. So while they don't have police patrolling St. George neighborhoods, you do have them patrolling Baton Rouge neighborhoods that probably have disproportionate number of the people that commit crimes IN St. George. That isn't without value.
Is not propotional to the services received.
But yes, in a larger sense, the wealthier parts of town subsidize the services provided to/for the poorer parts.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 11:00 am to LSURussian
quote:
In 2000, EBR population was 412,852. In 2012 it was 444,526, an increase of over 31,000. I'm notexactly sure what your point is. Then again, I rarely see a point to your posts.
I quoted the population for the city of Zachary and proved it has been increasing at a rapid rate. I posted the population for the city of BR and it has been almost stagnant.
You quote parish numbers, and again mix apples and oranges.
The point is people have not been fleeing Zachary. The point is BR has not been attracting many new residents.
You said Zachary taxes are too high for some, and that may be the case; but statistics haven't shown that it is hurting Zachary, yet.
Posted on 2/18/14 at 11:00 am to doubleb
quote:
It is a free country, and individuals still decide where they want to live, where they want to raise their children, and where they want to work and play.
Yes, it's a free country, and with freedom comes the need for people to have personal responsibility and accountability, and make smart decisions for the future of their communities they reside in.
quote:
If downtown attracts people, great. I'm all for it; but it's a free country and so far people are electing to move away from town.
That's the old guard speaking, and is a perfect example of an area going in two polar opposite directions. In most cities in this country there are huge movements to invest in their respective urban areas as the low density spreading out shite has proven to be completely bass ackwards in its conception, a failure in design, and contributes greatly to our inability to fund our own roads, and stop the mind numbing traffic problems associated with slapping shite up with no thought behind it, no zoning, fewer codes, and no look but that which soon becomes a shanty town. For reference to this, please refer to Florida Blvd, and Airline Hwy and points directly off of those surface streets, two of the very few besides our Main Street interstates that can take us from one area of the city to the other. It's because BR has become one giant ever expanding suburban sprawl and trying to operate it like its a city.
This post was edited on 2/18/14 at 11:05 am
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