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Message
Amendment No. 2 - Unanimous Jury
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:54 pm
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:54 pm
Amendment No. 2
Questions about this amendment on the ballot as I have no idea how it does or does not affect trials.
Why is this amendment on the ballot?
Is there a particular issue that needs to be resolved?
Will this result in more mistrials?
Does it make it tougher for the prosecution to get a conviction?
quote:
Do you support an amendment to require a unanimous jury verdict in all noncapital felony cases for offenses that are committed on or after January 1, 2019? (Amends Article I, Section 17(A))
Questions about this amendment on the ballot as I have no idea how it does or does not affect trials.
Why is this amendment on the ballot?
Is there a particular issue that needs to be resolved?
Will this result in more mistrials?
Does it make it tougher for the prosecution to get a conviction?
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:55 pm to Zephyrius
quote:
Will this result in more mistrials?
Does it make it tougher for the prosecution to get a conviction?
Obviously, if verdict is 12/12 instead o 10/12 the answer to the two questions above are yes.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 12:59 pm to Zephyrius
This is an issue that I’ve been torn over and it really comes down, for me, to principles versus pragmatism.
From a principled standpoint, I always want to limit government power and having a 10/12 system gives the State more power to convict a nonguiltu party.
But from a pragmatic standpoint, I know that the jury system is a relic that needs to be rethought given the realities of today’s criminal investigations and a 10/12 allows room for errors in jury selection.
I think I’m voting no
From a principled standpoint, I always want to limit government power and having a 10/12 system gives the State more power to convict a nonguiltu party.
But from a pragmatic standpoint, I know that the jury system is a relic that needs to be rethought given the realities of today’s criminal investigations and a 10/12 allows room for errors in jury selection.
I think I’m voting no
Posted on 11/4/18 at 1:05 pm to Zephyrius
I have wanted to serve on a Jury as far back as I can remember but have never even made it to voir dire.
My wife, on the other hand, has sat on several juries. Her stance on this is that she has sat on juries for cases before where one person held out despite overwhelming evidence just because they could.
Keeping the law as-is lessens the impact of such actions.
Remember, this doesn't just impact guilty verdicts, it impacts not-guilty verdicts as well (meaning you don't have to have a unanimous not-guilty verdict).
My wife, on the other hand, has sat on several juries. Her stance on this is that she has sat on juries for cases before where one person held out despite overwhelming evidence just because they could.
Keeping the law as-is lessens the impact of such actions.
Remember, this doesn't just impact guilty verdicts, it impacts not-guilty verdicts as well (meaning you don't have to have a unanimous not-guilty verdict).
Posted on 11/4/18 at 1:11 pm to WPBTiger
ok... why is this even on a ballot? What is the ammendment trying to remedy? Appears to open up for abuse of the jury selection as the above post mentions?
Posted on 11/4/18 at 1:15 pm to Bard
I've sat on juries before. All I can say is that the system sucks. Bench trials suck. There is no good option.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 1:19 pm to Zephyrius
Every good boy will be able to go to college now instead of jail :)
Posted on 11/4/18 at 1:22 pm to Zephyrius
quote:
Why is this amendment on the ballot?
Because 2/3 of the Louisiana legislature voted to put the measure on the ballot.
quote:
Is there a particular issue that needs to be resolved?
Yes, in a non-unanimous verdict paradigm, there is no duty/reason to even discuss the case with one's fellow jurors if they go back and have at least 10-2 in agreement. Forcing that discussion is superior.
quote:
Will this result in more mistrials?
According to the study circulated among the state District Attorney's Association, the rate of mistrials (currently very, very low) would increase by 6%. In real terms, this is an extremely, extremely small increase in the number of cases that would be declared mistrials and would need to be retried.
quote:
Does it make it tougher for the prosecution to get a conviction?
Technically, it makes it a little bit more difficult for any jury to reach a verdict, whether guilty or not guilty. However, in my experience, jurors holding minority positions can usually be swayed if necessary. It's simply currently not necessary.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 2:10 pm to Zephyrius
quote:Because the Legislative Black Caucus, the Southern Poverty Law Center, the ACLU, most of the state's newspapers and the Louisiana Bar Association want to make it more difficult to convict defendants in non-capital punishment felony cases.
ok... why is this even on a ballot?
The Louisiana constitution already requires a unanimous jury verdict to convict (and acquit) a defendant on trial in a capital punishment felony case.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 2:11 pm to LSURussian
quote:
Because the Legislative Black Caucus, the Southern Poverty Law Center, the ACLU, most of the state's newspapers and the Louisiana Bar Association want to make it more difficult to convict defendants in non-capital punishment felony cases.
You keep saying that. Do you have a response for why the Louisiana Republican Party has come out in favor of the amendment, as well?
Posted on 11/4/18 at 2:31 pm to arcalades
quote:
There is no good option.
Professional juries
Posted on 11/4/18 at 2:48 pm to Antonio Moss
quote:
Professional juries
I'm not inherently opposed, but the devil would be in the details. It would certainly save me a tremendous amount of time from having to explain "reasonable doubt" to laymen
Posted on 11/4/18 at 2:52 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
I'm not inherently opposed, but the devil would be in the details. It would certainly save me a tremendous amount of time from having to explain "reasonable doubt" to laymen
Or having people who barely made it through high school try to decipher complex opinions on dna testing, accident reconstruction, medical procedures, etc.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 2:52 pm to Zephyrius
Vote no.
You get one SJW on the jury and you’ll never get a conviction.
The people who want this passed want to make it harder to send their shitbag friends to prison.
You get one SJW on the jury and you’ll never get a conviction.
The people who want this passed want to make it harder to send their shitbag friends to prison.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 2:54 pm to TigersSEC2010
Why do people keep ignoring my question about why they think the Louisiana Republican Party has endorsed the amendment?
Posted on 11/4/18 at 3:02 pm to Zephyrius
quote:
Is there a particular issue that needs to be resolved?
yes, too many guilty criminals are going to jail so they hope stupid people fall for this BS and allow even less guilty people to be sent to jail.
its very simple, in a perfect world it sounds good, but we dont live in a perfect world and it hard to find 12 honest people who wont let criminals go free just because they hate cops
Posted on 11/4/18 at 3:06 pm to keakar
This bullshite = the way 48 other states do it and the way entire federal system works
As I've mentioned on other threads on the subject, I find it fascinating that the officials who defend the current paradigm in public swear up and down that it has nothing to do with racism, yet the majority of people I've seen defend it on this board do so because they believe black people won't convict other black people, so we need to have a system that means they won't frick things all up
As I've mentioned on other threads on the subject, I find it fascinating that the officials who defend the current paradigm in public swear up and down that it has nothing to do with racism, yet the majority of people I've seen defend it on this board do so because they believe black people won't convict other black people, so we need to have a system that means they won't frick things all up
Posted on 11/4/18 at 3:33 pm to Joshjrn
48 other states don’t have the “culture” we do
Posted on 11/4/18 at 6:35 pm to Joshjrn
I'm for it. I'd rather 10 guilty people go free than 1 innocent person go to jail. This limits government power and I'm all for it.
Posted on 11/4/18 at 6:39 pm to Joshjrn
quote:
Why do people keep ignoring my question about why they think the Louisiana Republican Party has endorsed the amendment
The downvotes this keeps getting is genuinely hilarious
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