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Started By
Message
re: My input/observation on LA Redfish
Posted on 2/13/24 at 6:30 am to lsuson
Posted on 2/13/24 at 6:30 am to lsuson
quote:
You are part of the problem. Congrats! The steam against bow fishing in Louisiana is picking up steam and it’s glorious.
You're right, in a few years they will outlaw it, that's why I believe they instituted the bowfishing permit. They are trying to have a paper trail before outlawing it. And maybe doing so will boom the redfish population and stop coastal erosion, but somehow I doubt it. But my 6 week old son will never get a chance to do it if I had to guess. Which according to some its a good thing he'll never get to do something so barbaric and "greasebally."
1
Posted on 2/13/24 at 7:03 am to TunaTime
I believe I clearly said air cooled engines shouldn't be in the marsh?
Your understanding of it (liberal use of that word) is changing.
It also killed more fish than any of us ever will.
quote:
if that's the argument, which seems to keep changing,
Your understanding of it (liberal use of that word) is changing.
quote:
Ida and other storms destroyed more marsh than a surface drive ever wil
It also killed more fish than any of us ever will.
Posted on 2/13/24 at 10:09 am to TunaTime
There are plenty of fish other than reds that can be shot with a bow; sheeps head, black drum, flounder, carp, buffalo. May not be as sexy but i would rather fry a head than red.
Posted on 2/13/24 at 11:15 am to KemoSabe65
quote:
There are plenty of fish other than reds that can be shot with a bow; sheeps head, black drum, flounder, carp, buffalo. May not be as sexy but i would rather fry a head than red.
No argument there, and I agree on the sheepshead being preferable, and also think flounder is as well as far as tablefare. So your issue with bowfishing is just shooting redfish, not so much the other factors being mentioned by others? I think I remember that you're a guide, so I'm curious as to what makes you say that.
Posted on 2/13/24 at 1:14 pm to Mr Breeze
quote:
I don't get how nighttime bow fishing is any different from shining for deer. It's the proverbial shooting fish in a barrel.
I watched one of the best snook and permit fisheries left in the Carribean be decimated by about 5 people bow fishing in broad daylight. Perfectly legal other than the short fish they misjudged which was a small number of those taken. In a year it went from thousands of permit feeding on snails in the mangrove roots over about a mile and a half of river to most days sighting 10. Snook would, at times be shoulder to shoulder and having to move out of the way of boats to seeing 100 or so a day. 5 people, a year, and almost all within the regs except for the occasional short fish they misjudged. I don't know about anywhere else but it certainly damaged that fishery.
They also shot tarpon. For some foolish reason all 5 of them thought shooting a 180 pound tarpon was great sport. I can't explain it. They did not seem to hurt he Tarpon population but a bunch of them had fuzzy growths where they had been hit with a bow.
Permit, mythical creatures in the eye of most sportsman, are very good eating, similar to Pompano. They are also VERY selective at times, making them the perfect target for fly fisherman in particular. They also fight like a demon as the Jacks they are. This same river system was chock bock full of 3 pound mangrove snapper who could be caughy by anyone at anytime and taste as good or better than a permit. Taking a permit with a bow is just not sporting at all...spearing one at least requires stalking and being in its element.
Posted on 2/13/24 at 1:54 pm to TunaTime
I really don’t care one way or the other, we don’t have many in sw La shooting fish other than my boy and his buddies. Son doesn’t shoot in marshes since most here are private.
Posted on 2/13/24 at 3:05 pm to HogsWillRiseAgain
Bow fishing definitely cant be good for the population but it is peanuts compared to the pogie fishery. their bycatch is nothing but bull reds. damn shame
Posted on 2/13/24 at 5:24 pm to shellbeachspeckzzz
So the idea is to spotlight reds in shallow water at night and shoot them with a bow?
Where's the sport in that?
Just go shoot paper targets and leave the reds alone. At least with live bait and artificial lures there's a bit more even playing field. Plus, you can catch and release.
I don't get the attraction.
Where's the sport in that?
Just go shoot paper targets and leave the reds alone. At least with live bait and artificial lures there's a bit more even playing field. Plus, you can catch and release.
I don't get the attraction.
Posted on 2/13/24 at 5:40 pm to TygerTyger
quote:
So the idea is to spotlight reds in shallow water at night and shoot them with a bow?
Where's the sport in that?
Just go shoot paper targets and leave the reds alone. At least with live bait and artificial lures there's a bit more even playing field. Plus, you can catch and release.
I don't get the attraction.
1) Simply put, yes.
2) If you've ever done it, you would know that its not as easy as it looks, shooting 50% would be considered pretty darn good (or maybe my normal crew just sucks)
3) It's not as "lopsided" as you think.
4) If you've never done it, you should at least try it once. If you hate it, at least you can say you've tried it.
Posted on 2/13/24 at 5:42 pm to shellbeachspeckzzz
quote:
Bow fishing definitely cant be good for the population but it is peanuts compared to the pogie fishery. their bycatch is nothing but bull reds. damn shame
I would agree with this. Back to a point I made earlier tho, is any fishing, rod and reel or bow, good for the population?
Posted on 2/13/24 at 5:58 pm to TunaTime
quote:
Back to a point I made earlier tho, is any fishing, rod and reel or bow, good for the population?
Yes, with sustainable limits from the commercial fisherman and removal of oversight by NOAA. This also includes elimination of the Menhaden fishery from Louisiana.
Win, win, win.
Posted on 2/14/24 at 6:32 am to TunaTime
quote:
I would agree with this. Back to a point I made earlier tho, is any fishing, rod and reel or bow, good for the population?
Sportfishing is very beneficial to fish and wildlife because the more taxpayers there are involved in an activity the more funds that activity will receive. I am not familiar with inshore fishing on the Louisiana coast as I have not done much of it but the inshore and offshore fishing on both coasts of Florida is as good right now as it has been in probably 40+ years because sportfishing is intensely managed by the state due to the amount of revenue sportfishing drives. It is a PAIN IN THE arse to fish inshore or offshore in Florida because of this but the fishing is spectacular. When I was a kid in the late 70s and early 80s I knew people who had fished around Tampa their whole lives who had never caught a snook, for example. Anyone who can chunk a live bait fish in the surf can catch a snook that would have been a PB for almost anyone in the 50s and usually catch several a day when they are on the beaches. Sportfishing is very beneficial to fish populations.
Posted on 2/14/24 at 6:51 am to Novastar
quote:
Yes, with sustainable limits from the commercial fisherman and removal of oversight by NOAA. This also includes elimination of the Menhaden fishery from Louisiana.
Win, win, win.
Sportfishing is infinitely more beneficial to fish populations and the economy than commercial fishing. I saw a study once that said a pound of red snapper caught in state waters in Florida by sportfisherman added like $80 to the states economy. The same poung of fish caught commercially added like a $1.50 because of the costs associated with managing the commercial fishery. This is a pretty well established fact in all commercial fishing. The only reason commercial fishing still exists in any form is, and you can ask any commercial fishing professional organization and any agency that promotes or regulates commercial fishing, to protect a traditional way of life in those areas. That is a laudable goal but it would the same if we propped up the typewriter industry to maintain the traditional way of life for typewriter repairmen. Just about all products produced by commercial fisherman can be farm raised just like cattle and chickens....no one is out netting wild cows and chickens as an industry...it is insane. Those products that can not be farmed can be caught recreationally....but that requires the consumer to be actively involved and is cost prohibitive for most people. SO what? True Wagyu beef is also out of the price range of most of the world...that don't mean they can't buy groundbeef at walmart.
Commercial fishing is hard work but it is easier than consistently putting idiots with little or no fishing experience (or even worse old boy who thinks he knows everything) on fish that it is to drag a net in the same areas that have been drug for years and years and years. A lot of commercial fisherman aren't cut out for running sportfishing charters...they do not know how to catch fish consistently without doing so with a net. Many could learn to do so, though, have far lower operating costs and manage their own revenue instead of depending on a buyer to cheat the shite out of them when they return to the hill.
The one caveat is hook and line commercial fishing. Florida has a pretty extensive hook and line commercial fishing industry. It is pretty sustainable by all accounts. It is HIGHLY regulated. It keeps the price of seafood up which makes it a viable industry (at times dolphin hook and line boats will catch so many dolphin the price drops...happens pretty frequently). Why it is uncommon for those with the license to take sportfisherman on those trips fo a price is beyond me...I have asked some of the people i know who have the license and they don't want anyone on the boat who is not very good at what they do, namely snatch fish after fish over the transom that have been chummed into a feeding frenzy. I get that, but the majority of the cost of running a commercial boat is fuel, boat maintenance and crew. If you covere those costs with sportfishermen it seems like you could make as much money catching fewer fish.
Posted on 2/14/24 at 7:01 am to TunaTime
yes because you are not going to catch them every single cast or every time you go. the classic saying "thats why they call it fishing and not catching" whereas pogie boats are CATCHING and CATCHING everything
Posted on 2/14/24 at 7:14 am to shellbeachspeckzzz
I’ve been bowfishing 4 times, before I had a change of heart about it. It doesn’t appeal to me and I do think it’s harmful. As far as limits being a sure thing, every single trip I went on, when it was looking like the customers were terrible at shooting, the deck hands and captains would pick up their own personal bows and easily sticks a few reds to help reach the limit. The reason I had a change of heart was because I realized that when I go fishing, I throw back any fish over 24”. Just a personal preference…can’t do that bowfishing.
Posted on 2/14/24 at 7:54 am to VanRIch
Thanks for all the comments. Just to be clear, I agree that commercial fishing is much more "harmful" than recreational. I worked on trawl boats with my uncle growing up and have seen first hand the by-catch that is discarded. The amount of small flounders (just one example) that were caught and killed while trawling was sad. That same uncle has in the past, and has continued to argue to this day, that commercial fishing, including pogey boats, are not nearly as harmful to the fishing industry as something like bowfishing. That's just something i cant agree with. I say that just to show how different opinions can be and how people's backgrounds affect their opinions. And everyone thinks their opinion is the right one at the end of the day.
Posted on 2/14/24 at 10:44 am to VanRIch
quote:
I’ve been bowfishing 4 times, before I had a change of heart about it. It doesn’t appeal to me and I do think it’s harmful. As far as limits being a sure thing, every single trip I went on, when it was looking like the customers were terrible at shooting, the deck hands and captains would pick up their own personal bows and easily sticks a few reds to help reach the limit. The reason I had a change of heart was because I realized that when I go fishing, I throw back any fish over 24”. Just a personal preference…can’t do that bowfishing.
With rare exceptions bag limits on fish and game are individual bag limits...not boat bag limits and not me catching and keeping 20 when the limit is 10 and my buddy catching none. When I was a young and stupid man I worked as a duck guide for a lodge in Arkansas. There were 2 things about doing so that was appealing...duck hunting every day of the season and killing a blind limit when the morons who were paying could not hit the broadside of a barn if they had been standing inside it and the doors were closed. I was taught to do this but it did not take much teaching or convincing me it was the way things were done. I would not have lasted long as a guide had I not done it. No matter the reason that is a problem. I have never been on a guided fishing trip where keeping fish was the plan that this was not the way things work...a boat limit. With rare exceptions boat or group limits are not the norm legally but they are always the norm in practice, in my experience. Thats a problem the guiding industry should be taking to task for.
As far as size limits and spearing, gigging and bow shooting most folks starting out can't tell how long a fish is in the water...not down to the level where 1/4" difference means its legal or not. I am sure that ethical folks do not take a fish that is marginal but I am equally certain that newbies and those who ought to know better do it with regularity. When it is done at night the odds of being checked by the man is far lower than it would be in daylight. I am also sure those same people will simply throw a short fish back. I am also certain they will shoot any fish no matter if taking it by bow is legal or not.
It is also not easy to stick a fish with an arrow. When starting out most people miss by a bunch but they get good at barely missing...many of those barely misses result in the fish being injured and dying later.
Posted on 2/14/24 at 10:23 pm to TunaTime
the land loss started in 1906 when the Corps of engineers dammed off the Bayou Lafourch entrance from the Mississippi River . Within 5 years salt water intrusion had backed up the bayou as far as the sugar mill at raceland. In the 1960 period there were dead oak trees along the road all the way to grand isle .
Posted on 2/15/24 at 6:20 am to Trevaylin
quote:
the land loss started in 1906 when the Corps of engineers dammed off the Bayou Lafourch entrance from the Mississippi River . Within 5 years salt water intrusion had backed up the bayou as far as the sugar mill at raceland. In the 1960 period there were dead oak trees along the road all the way to grand isle .
Agreed, in my opinion that has been by far the main factor, with hurricanes being the second biggest factor.
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