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re: Thoughts on people who wear Che Guevara shirts
Posted on 1/23/14 at 12:17 pm to SaintCajun
Posted on 1/23/14 at 12:17 pm to SaintCajun
0
Posted on 1/23/14 at 12:22 pm to Bmath
quote:
I feel like we could flip this around on capitalism.
That's because you're an idiot.
quote:
A lot of theories about most of what goes on in the middle east essentially being proxy wars for the West. Other theories about Western nations, such as the US, keeping developing nations from rising up all for the sake of lower prices to consumers. Perhaps this is a better suited argument for the Poli board...
I hope that even on the poli board nobody thinks it's worth "arguing" over whether the fruits of communism are historically worse than the fruits of capitalism.
Are you for real?
Posted on 1/23/14 at 12:38 pm to uway
Che would execute every last one of us on this thread if he were alive and had the ability to do so. If not for being American, then for simply discussing him and his ideas. 'Mericuh, hell yeah.
Posted on 1/23/14 at 12:56 pm to RogerTheShrubber
I would imagine the people defending Che in this thread are (or were) the ones wearing the t-shirts, and now that they realize what he represented, need to justify their naïveté.
Posted on 1/23/14 at 1:02 pm to Flame Salamander
quote:
Guevara was a freedom fighter. That can be spun in either direction. But the fact remains that he tried to help liberate several countries in the Americas from brutal, thug, murdering, torturing dictators set up by the US CIA and other private capitalist corporations. He tried to return rule of these countries back to the people...in the name of justice.
Posted on 1/23/14 at 1:35 pm to GotDucks?
Reckon why nobody wears Menachem Begin shirts? Or David Ben-Gurion shirts? Or John Adams shirts? Or Moses shirts? Or Jim Jones shirts?
This post was edited on 1/23/14 at 3:29 pm
Posted on 1/23/14 at 3:25 pm to Flame Salamander
quote:
Flame Salamander
Frank and Gerry would have gotten a bang out of meeting Che.
Posted on 1/23/14 at 3:46 pm to SaintCajun
People in the 70's used to wear that Charles Manson t-shirt, the one where he's got that crazy look in his eyes.
What in the hell were they thinking?
What in the hell were they thinking?
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:00 pm to Flame Salamander
quote:
It's funny to hear all of the 12 year olds in this thread talk about Marxism as if it was a succinct evil entity. Marxism is no more evil than capitalism.
Which philosophy do you think has been more harmful to the native, first nationers, of the new world? I would think capitalism and its unbridled greed wins that award hands down...on the merits of its wholesale destruction and genocide of many complete societies.
Did you know that the original natives of the first islands that Columbus landed on were all enslaved, shipped to other islands and then eventually wiped-out to extinction? European capitalism was real good for them.
Guevara's problem is that he was on the losing side and thus gets re-written poorly.
People wear/wore shirts with his picture as a sign of rebellion and protest against the greed that is inherent in our capitalist system.
ETA...I've never seen anyone wear a t-shirt with Rumsfeld's picture on it.
Nothing grinds my gears more than people blaming capitalism for imperialism and slavery. You act as if greed only occurs in capitalist societies, when in fact it is human nature. Capitalism is only defined as an economic system in which the means of production are owned by private individuals.
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:02 pm to northLAgoomba
quote:
People in the 70's used to wear that Charles Manson t-shirt, the one where he's got that crazy look in his eyes. What in the hell were they thinking?
Yes they did...that little swastika between his eyes makes it the most absolutely complete symbol of rebellion.
Che's photo (that is on the t-shirts) is arguably the most famous photograph in the history of the world.
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:10 pm to Flame Salamander
quote:
Where have I bashed capitalism?
Capitalism doesn't equal freedom. Just look at China as an example.
Hong Kong is the only part of China that has a capitalist economy. The rest of China has been communist since Mao took over. By the way, Chinese people are begging to get into to Hong Kong. I wonder why?Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:11 pm to Turkey_Creek_Tiger
quote:
Nothing grinds my gears more than people blaming capitalism for imperialism and slavery. You act as if greed only occurs in capitalist societies, when in fact it is human nature. Capitalism is only defined as an economic system in which the means of production are owned by private individuals.
I said no such thing. I said that Marxism is no more evil than capitalism. I advocate a form of capitalism and not socialism (of which Marxism is a variant).
This post was edited on 1/23/14 at 4:12 pm
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:12 pm to CroakaBait
Meh, he didn't necessarily hate Americans,as much as he hated our system of government and our economic ways. There were a couple of Americans that fought alongside Che during the Cuban Revolution. Now today they will tell you they had no idea he was a Marxist-Leninist and what his aspirations were
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:13 pm to Turkey_Creek_Tiger
quote:
quote:Where have I bashed capitalism? Capitalism doesn't equal freedom. Just look at China as an example.
Hong Kong is the only part of China that has a capitalist economy. The rest of China has been communist since Mao took over. By the way, Chinese people are begging to get into to Hong Kong. I wonder why?
South East China, inland from Hong Kong, is now generally recognized to be practicing some form of capitalism. But it still isn't free.
This post was edited on 1/23/14 at 4:15 pm
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:18 pm to Flame Salamander
quote:
South East China, inland from Hong Kong, is now generally recognized to be practicing some form of capitalism.
China as a whole seems to be moving towards some form of capitalism. It should be interesting to see how it plays out in the next 10-20 years.
quote:
But is still isn't free.
"Where there is capitalism there isn't always freedom, but where there is freedom there is capitalism"-Milton Friedman
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:19 pm to Darth_Vader
quote:
But the truth is there is little to no difference between the Nazis or the Communists. This is true be it Himmler for the Nazis or Che for the Communist movement in the 50's and 60's. The end result was the same, wholesale murder on an industrial scale all in the name of political ideology.
Pretty accurate, home skillet!
quote:
Pinochet, Trujillo, Battista or others?
mine
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:20 pm to Flame Salamander
quote:
People in the 70's used to wear that Charles Manson t-shirt, the one where he's got that crazy look in his eyes. What in the hell were they thinking?
quote:
Yes they did...that little swastika between his eyes makes it the most absolutely complete symbol of rebellion.
It actually was an "X" to begin with. The famous images of him during the trials period all show him initially with the "x" in his forehead. Here is an example....
He and his followers all had this same "x" carved into their foreheads. it symbolized them being "x'ed out" of society. Here are some of his followers with their mark....
He later during the murder trials Manson modified his "X" into a swastika....
And if memory serves me right sometime in the 80's or 90's he had a swastika tattooed onto his forehead.
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:21 pm to Flame Salamander
quote:
I said no such thing.
you very clearly blamed the African slave trade and the European colonization of America on capitalism on the 4th page
This post was edited on 1/23/14 at 4:22 pm
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:23 pm to SaintCajun
Why don't you just go to the Wiki page for Che'. You can find info on what shaped him, his legacy and some reports to show that he wasn't always such a nice guy. You will find that the Wiki article paints a much more main stream (political) picture of him than the one-sided opinions being expressed by those OTers in your thread.
Posted on 1/23/14 at 4:24 pm to SaintCajun
To get people to start internet threads about it.
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