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Message

re: The gloves are off regarding St. George...

Posted on 1/11/14 at 12:55 pm to
Posted by LT
The City of St. George
Member since May 2008
5163 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 12:55 pm to
quote:

You & every other home owner had better be prepared to "throw in" another 2 or 3 thousand a year just in higher property taxes to support a new city government plus a new school system that is already saying will need to build SIX new schools.


I've not seem anything like that. Can you back it up for me... Not with speculation.

As I understand it the new school district, if it happens, would be flush with cash to the tune of $30-odd million a year. That is not the city budget I'm referring to, the school budget... After reasonable legacy costs.

Bonding that could build six new schools while temp space was used.
Posted by Topwater Trout
Red Stick
Member since Oct 2010
70173 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:00 pm to
How is it flawed logic?

Serious question because I don't remember the particulars about Central but what are the differences between Central and St. George?
Posted by Antonio Moss
The South
Member since Mar 2006
49553 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:02 pm to
quote:

How is it flawed logic?

Serious question because I don't remember the particulars about Central but what are the differences between Central and St. George?


About 85,000 people.

Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
135341 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:02 pm to
quote:

So why doesn't $50 million of tax revenue from BR City get allocated to the unincorporated area? Don't

How do you know it doesn't? The parish has received the majority of the "Green Light" program funding over the past 5 years. But I'm okay with that even though I NEVER go into areas of the parish where those improvements have taken place. By sharing the fixed costs of capital improvements we are all better off in the long run.

Another layer of governmental bureaucracy NEVER decreases costs nor makes governmental services cost less.
Posted by LT
The City of St. George
Member since May 2008
5163 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:06 pm to
quote:

Another layer of governmental bureaucracy NEVER decreases costs nor makes governmental services cost less.



Government closest to the people always serves them best.
Posted by Topwater Trout
Red Stick
Member since Oct 2010
70173 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:06 pm to
quote:

About 85,000 people.


So pretty much the same situation but on a larger scale?

I guess I need to ask friends that live in central how it has affected them
Posted by Antonio Moss
The South
Member since Mar 2006
49553 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:07 pm to
quote:

How do you know it doesn't? The parish has received the majority of the "Green Light" program funding over the past 5 years


Green Light Program is EBR not BR City.
Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
135341 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:08 pm to
quote:

I've not seem anything like that. Can you back it up for me... Not with speculation.
Then you want to remain blind. I have gone through this financial mess several times on the Poli Board. The SG true believers refuse to accept anything which interferes with their plan to form their own majority white city and school system.

One fact: the Zachary city budget is almost double the proposed SG city budget on a per capita basis. The Baker city budget is 80% more than the SG budget on a per capita basis in spite of Baker being a near poverty level community on a household income basis.
Posted by Antonio Moss
The South
Member since Mar 2006
49553 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:09 pm to
quote:

Another layer of governmental bureaucracy NEVER decreases costs nor makes governmental services cost less.


Then why not dissolve BR City?
Posted by Topwater Trout
Red Stick
Member since Oct 2010
70173 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:11 pm to
quote:

How do you know it doesn't? The parish has received the majority of the "Green Light" program funding over the past 5 years. But I'm okay with that even though I NEVER go into areas of the parish where those improvements have taken place. By sharing the fixed costs of capital improvements we are all better off in the long run.


That is one project. What about the sewer improvements inside the city...not sure if any have been done outside of the city?
Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
135341 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:12 pm to
quote:

Green Light Program is EBR not BR City.

Where is most of the population and streets?

Posted by LT
The City of St. George
Member since May 2008
5163 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:13 pm to
quote:

Then you want to remain blind. I have gone through this financial mess several times on the Poli Board. The SG true believers refuse to accept anything which interferes with their plan to form their own majority white city and school system. .



Been through on the poli board... So a link should readily available to your source.

quote:

One fact: the Zachary city budget is almost double the proposed SG city budget on a per capita basis. The Baker city budget is 80% more than the SG budget on a per capita basis in spite of Baker being a near poverty level community on a household income basis


Baker and Zachary.... What kind of sales tax money per capita do they collect compared to the proposed St George ? I think it may be nowhere near the same amount. I'm just speculating here.
Posted by LT
The City of St. George
Member since May 2008
5163 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:16 pm to
quote:

Question for the SG supporters: who is the largest property tax payer in EBR? (Hint: That taxpayer's property has an assessed value equal to almost as much as the next 9 highest property taxpayers COMBINED.)


Did you ever give us the answer to this? I'd like to know.
Posted by Antonio Moss
The South
Member since Mar 2006
49553 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:18 pm to
quote:

Where is most of the population and streets?


Meh, it's not incredibly lopsided. 52% of EBR lives in BR city; 48% outside. And that's not tax revenue, I'd like to see a revenue breakdown.
Posted by Antonio Moss
The South
Member since Mar 2006
49553 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:21 pm to
quote:

Did you ever give us the answer to this? I'd like to know.


I would imagine its Exxon and it's completely irrelevant. St. G isn't asking Exxon to pay taxes to fund its city.
Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
135341 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:22 pm to
quote:

What kind of sales tax money per capita do they collect compared to the proposed St George ?
SG collects ZERO sales taxes so Baker & Zachary have to collect more.

We don't know what sales taxes will be available to a new city of SG. If you think BR will let 30% of its sales tax collections walk away with the Mall of Louisiana, you don't know how the real world of government really works nor have you kept up with current events involving the annexation of the Bluebonnet retail district by BR.
Posted by LT
The City of St. George
Member since May 2008
5163 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:32 pm to
quote:

SG collects ZERO sales taxes so Baker & Zachary have to collect more.


I meant future taxes collected. C'mon bro... You knew that.

quote:

If you think BR will let 30% of its sales tax collections walk away with the Mall of Louisiana, you don't know how the real world of government really works nor have you kept up with current events involving the annexation of the Bluebonnet retail district by BR.


I've been keeping up. The shite show going on right now has really enlightened me. Stacking the st George fire department and threatening to illegally confiscate tax money for ten years. BR officials are willing to do anything to keep the cash flow.

Still waiting on the link to the poli board where you cited your source showing property taxes were going to go up $2k per year.
Posted by Beau Tie
Member since Oct 2012
951 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:33 pm to
What you fail to realize is that a per capita basis doesn't necessarily equate to a lack of funds for services. Some things that are currently being paid for are probably not needed or the amount is too high. Also, I would probably disagree with how you reached your number as well.

I think the people who spend between $8,000 and $20,000 on private schools would much rather keep this money in their pocket. So lets factor in people having more money to spend inside their own new city and more tax revenue for the city. This variable is unknown along with other variables that would make the city more efficient and growth orientated. They probably rather pay more in property tax to save thousands of dollars on private schools. Of course a lot of the private schools aren't to happy about this idea either but they will still stay afloat. They will have to learn to be more fiscally sound as well.

Basically it's an old power structure realizing they don't have the power anymore because the grass roots realizes they can achieve a goal long tied up in the courts and political ball field through a democratic process of self determination. It may be unfortunate that it leaves the actual city of Baton Rouge in a position where they have to start looking at themselves in the mirror to solve the problem.
This post was edited on 1/11/14 at 1:39 pm
Posted by Scruffy
Kansas City
Member since Jul 2011
77827 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:38 pm to
Let SG try it. If it doesn't work, it'll fail.

BR needs to fall apart anyway. That city's power structure is fricking horrible.
Posted by LSURussian
Member since Feb 2005
135341 posts
Posted on 1/11/14 at 1:41 pm to
quote:

I would imagine its Exxon and it's completely irrelevant. St. G isn't asking Exxon to pay taxes to fund its city.

Yes, it is Exxon and you're wrong. Exxon is in the city but it is not inside the city limits. The city limits are drawn around the perimeter of Exxon. The property taxes it pays are accounted for as being from the parish. The same is true for two of the other top 5 largest property taxpayers, Georgia Pacific & Formosa Plastics.

Exxon's assessed property value is almost 8% of the total assessed property value in the entire EBR city-parish. And as everyone knows, non-residential property pays property taxes based on 15% of the asessed value, not 10% like residential property is. That means Exxon is paying property taxes at a 50% higher amount compared to identically cumulative valued residential property.

I'm trying to find out exactly how much that equates to in actual property taxes paid but have been unsuccessful doing that so far.

Again, that makes the whole "who pays the most property taxes" (city or parish) silly and distorted.
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