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re: Questions on PTSD on prior War Veterans: Was it similar to current times or just not...
Posted on 11/8/18 at 5:57 pm to GCTigahs
Posted on 11/8/18 at 5:57 pm to GCTigahs
quote:
I think you’re exactly right. I bet they have CTE from all of the artillery. Need some of them to don’t their brains for study.
That and just the experience. Having your brain that jacked up for a year straight changes your brain chemistry. It end's up being permanent. These guys get back home and act just as they did in combat. Paranoia, don't sleep, highly anxious, etc.
0
Posted on 11/8/18 at 5:59 pm to ZappBrannigan
quote:
As above in WWII our boys came back after months, spending time with their units.
Nam on your own nowadays on your own or put into support groups with strangers that may have been in the same war but not same situation that eats you.
Most people deploy in and out with their entire units now. I think the individual replacement thing was mostly Vietnam era.
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:02 pm to Captain Ron
Personally I’ve always been embarrassed to have issues with ptsd because I know the shite military guys went through before my time. I wasn’t a pie taster by no means, Hell I’ve killed numerous people, watched kids burn to death from something we did, as well watch some of my best friends take their last breath. Not sure how the Vietnam and WWII guys dealt with it all. I’m not the same happy go lucky guy after my combat tours and I can’t figure out why I am how I am now. I’ve been near suicide on multiple occasions but my family and honestly the thought of me just being a pussy keep me going. My respect for those guys, some had it way worse than I could imagine.
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:06 pm to GCTigahs
I have a cousin that served in Iraq and was diagnosed with PTSD. He was manning the machine gun in a Humvee on patrol wen they were hit with a IED. Everyone in the Humvee was killed except for him, he just had scratches and bruises from being thrown clear of the Humvee. His psych problem was that he felt guilt that he was the only survivor.
He received treatment and came to terms about what happened and leads a productive life today.
He received treatment and came to terms about what happened and leads a productive life today.
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:11 pm to Drank
Antietam/Sharpsburg is infamous in the north but it was only 8th most casualties in civil war. 22,000
Ill give even money the survivors had the heebeejeebees
Ill give even money the survivors had the heebeejeebees
This post was edited on 11/8/18 at 6:12 pm
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:20 pm to CelticDog
My dad was a pilot in flying tigers China, ww2 b24 and b17 and Korea b29 (and no action in nuclear bomber later). According to my aunt he was a happy guy before ww2.
He didn't talk much about it all but when he did it stuck out. He flew 26 day sorties over Italy. They were originally told they only had to do 25. So many guys died they didn't let the survivors out of it. He was wounded on 26th flight.
See catch 22 and Memphis belle for a sense of it.
There's a great speech by col. Montgomery cliff in another one like Memphis belle. He says you guys need to grasp this: you are all going die.
He later volunteered to fly 82nd airborne in a glider predawn Normandy. From his perspective it was a piece of cake compared to doing catch 22.
He didn't talk much about it all but when he did it stuck out. He flew 26 day sorties over Italy. They were originally told they only had to do 25. So many guys died they didn't let the survivors out of it. He was wounded on 26th flight.
See catch 22 and Memphis belle for a sense of it.
There's a great speech by col. Montgomery cliff in another one like Memphis belle. He says you guys need to grasp this: you are all going die.
He later volunteered to fly 82nd airborne in a glider predawn Normandy. From his perspective it was a piece of cake compared to doing catch 22.
This post was edited on 11/8/18 at 6:21 pm
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:21 pm to northshorebamaman
Most my friends who are vets don't seem to have anyone from their Iraq and Afghanistan days. They just came and reintegrated with the old highschool and college circles. Just assumed Army was back to it's dumb ways.
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:21 pm to CelticDog
quote:
Antietam/Sharpsburg is infamous in the north but it was only 8th most casualties in civil war. 22,000
If you've ever been there you'd wonder how it wasn't higher. It is such a small and compact area (aside from the burnside's bridge action) with lots of dips and depression.
Absolute brutal day in American history
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:22 pm to Lima Whiskey
quote:
Brain injuries have been tied to PTSD.
Those injuries have become increasingly common over the last hundred years.
I call BS. There might be more diagnosed cases, with the population doing less intensive work in general no way brain injuries have declined. You're trying to tell me a world population largely sitting in front of TV's and computers have less brain trauma than during the Genghis Khan era?
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:25 pm to theantiquetiger
quote:
That's WWI
also where the term shell shock(ed) came from
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:27 pm to fr33manator
quote:
Soldiers back them were made of sterner stuff. Killing your opponent up close, by hand, looking them in the eye, feeling the resistance and the give as your blade as it plunged past leather and armor, biting into bare flesh.
The warm gout of blood that spurted forth from the wound. The sticky red wetness that coated you.
Not quite the constant concussions of the artillery bombardment, but a horror of its own.
I think there is something to your point, in that life was more brutal back then, death more constant, and war was up close and brutal. So if PTSD is caused in part by fear and stress, then I agree.
But I think there’s a link between PTSD and brain injury. And concussive forces have increased due to explosives. And the fear and stress is still there, but different.
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:29 pm to ZappBrannigan
quote:
Most my friends who are vets don't seem to have anyone from their Iraq and Afghanistan days. They just came and reintegrated with the old highschool and college circles. Just assumed Army was back to it's dumb ways.
Are they still in the Army? You generally deploy as a unit and return as a unit. Now, if they're separating from service or on orders to somewhere else, they'll eventually move on but there's usually a mandated time where the unit does reintegration classes and everyone gets a chance to take leave.
Posted on 11/8/18 at 6:31 pm to CelticDog
quote:
flying tigers China
quote:
ww2 b24 and b17
Flying Tigers were 3 fighter squadrons, they flew P-40s
Posted on 11/8/18 at 7:24 pm to northshorebamaman
They're out
Posted on 11/8/18 at 7:26 pm to Captain Ron
PTSD is real for all combat veterans
Posted on 11/9/18 at 9:36 am to lake2280
quote:
Personally I’ve always been embarrassed to have issues with ptsd because I know the shite military guys went through before my time.
I know what you mean but it's important to remember that PTSD isn't some measuring stick to compare experiences. It's post traumatic stress, that's it, that's all it is. It's become synonymous with combat but it can come from any traumatic event and manifests itself differently in different people. There's no "This causes this, which causes you to behave like this." and there's no shame in having issues with it or seeking out help for it.
I hate the stigma that's become attatched to PTSD that leads to threads like this. No, being a combat veteran with PTSD doesn't mean you're unhinged walking around thinking you're back in the war. I have trouble sleeping some nights and I might be a hyper-vigilant at times or react a certain way to certain triggers (sounds, smells, etc) but that's about it. And that's true of most of the guys I served with as well.
Posted on 11/9/18 at 9:40 am to Captain Ron
quote:\
Did it not get the coverage like PTSD today because of the lack of technology to actually cover it?
Well, the whole concept of shell shock came from WWI
Posted on 11/9/18 at 10:44 am to Captain Ron
Seems like awareness is much, much higher in today’s world. While awareness is a great step, it can be a double-edged sword for a lot of folks. Being more aware of a problem can be like a virus, that just spreads in the mind and becomes an even worse problem. I had this very discussion with my great uncle, who was in Korean War, and he told me this. He said he was blessed that he put his past behind him years ago before current times, when settling things with God was enough to settle things with yourself. Now it’s much more complicated.
I think everyone here makes really great points/examples, and this is just what I gained from talking to my GU. It’s interesting because my grandpa was smarter about the war and enlisted in the Air Force, so he never saw combat and spent his time in Maine at a AEC/SAC base. The experience for both of them was literally night and day difference.
I think everyone here makes really great points/examples, and this is just what I gained from talking to my GU. It’s interesting because my grandpa was smarter about the war and enlisted in the Air Force, so he never saw combat and spent his time in Maine at a AEC/SAC base. The experience for both of them was literally night and day difference.
This post was edited on 11/9/18 at 10:49 am
Posted on 11/9/18 at 11:10 am to Captain Ron
I have an older brother who seen extensive action in Vietnam and he still struggles with PTSD, not as bad as he did in past years. His faith has helped him considerably in dealing with it.
Posted on 11/9/18 at 2:41 pm to fr33manator
quote:
Killing your opponent up close, by hand, looking them in the eye, feeling the resistance and the give as your blade as it plunged past leather and armor, biting into bare flesh. The warm gout of blood that spurted forth from the wound. The sticky red wetness that coated you. Not quite the constant concussions of the artillery bombardment, but a horror of its own.
Interesting discussion. But another difference with that "up close and personal' warfare you describe, was they would fight it out and then could get away from the danger and relax a bit. Basically they knew when they were in danger and when they weren't. in modern warfare, especially ww1 and later, there's always a risk of artillery coming, or sniper fire, or land mines, etc. Basically you can never let your guard down and relax, constant stress might actually be worse for PTSD.
Im certainly no expert on the subject, just another comparison.
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