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Started By
Message
re: Part of the new Hard Rock Hotel collapses (NOLA) 3 dead, Cranes Down-ish
Posted on 10/12/19 at 6:58 pm to cgrand
Posted on 10/12/19 at 6:58 pm to cgrand
quote:
all of those thin concrete slab edges you see in the pictures that are bent over like slices of bread are the primary hazard. They’ll have to be individually removed
Yea, my impression was there is worry about more substantial than that being a possibility. It’s all second hand, so grain of salt, but the evacuation zone might get stretched a few blocks.
On a busy Saturday night in the quarter it’d be an interesting task... so probably won’t happen unless very imminent risk of a big fall.
1
Posted on 10/12/19 at 6:59 pm to cgrand
quote:
just say “I have no idea what I’m talking about” and be done with it
So they won't be sued?
I have no idea the underlying legalese, but I am willing to bet they are sued.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:02 pm to fightin tigers
no, hard rock will not have liability if they had no professional involvement in the design or construction of the building, as they say. They would not have been a party to any contract having to do with the facility to this point
in simple terms, their name is not on the paper
in simple terms, their name is not on the paper
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:07 pm to cgrand
So they won't be sued.
Got it.
Got it.
This post was edited on 10/12/19 at 7:08 pm
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:22 pm to NoSaint
quote:
Yea, my impression was there is worry about more substantial than that being a possibility.
There's also the question of damage to (and structural soundness of) the surrounding buildings that were struck from falling debris.
That little white building in the foreground of that video and the building across the street got whacked. They've got to make sure they've good as well and any damage to them will be the responsibly of the owners of the hotel as well.
This post was edited on 10/12/19 at 7:23 pm
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:22 pm to Nicky Parrish
quote:
Man I’m getting old. Thanks for the memories!
Yeah, I'm getting long in the tooth too. Got out of high school in 70 with a 50 year reunion coming up next spring I would think.
The city has changed a lot over the years. Stores, shops, restaurants, neighborhood movie houses, etc. come and go. When that happens, all you have left is the memories.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:25 pm to fightin tigers
quote:
So they won't be sued.
They'll be sued... but dismissed from the suit.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:28 pm to jamboybarry
quote:
Steel structure with concrete pan slabs
That seems like one of those things that has a lot of economic advantages but is easy to mess up.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:33 pm to Unknown_Poster
quote:
They'll be sued... but dismissed from the suit.
Just admit you don't know what you are talking about
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:34 pm to USMEagles
quote:
That seems like one of those things that has a lot of economic advantages but is easy to mess up.
how so?
This post was edited on 10/12/19 at 7:35 pm
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:35 pm to USMEagles
quote:
That seems like one of those things that has a lot of economic advantages but is easy to mess up.
Not really. Every major city is full of buildings like this. When this kind of stuff happens it’s usually a shoring or loading problem.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:41 pm to jamboybarry
Yeah it’s pretty much the standard for commercial steel multilevel buildings.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:44 pm to cgrand
quote:
how so?
I'm definitely a layman here, but that sounds to me like you're building a steel structure that's designed to support concrete. You have big, relatively thin sections of steel that exist to hold up concrete. That seems like a big metallurgical challenge. You end up with something that looks like a concrete structure, but it's really just an Erector Set that someone said was strong enough to hold up concrete.
Again, this is just my take as a layman. I am sure it's an oversimplification. But the damned thing did fall down.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:45 pm to USMEagles
Slabs are thin. Weight is supported by steel trusses.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:45 pm to AUsteriskPride
quote:
You get CNN notifications and openly admit it? Wow.
Well it did work.
It's better than openly admitting that you fail at Google.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:48 pm to USMEagles
it fell down because something pulled it down.
lightweight concrete over a metal deck is how nearly every building you see that has multiple stories was built.
lightweight concrete over a metal deck is how nearly every building you see that has multiple stories was built.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:49 pm to USMEagles
I always assumed the steel acted more as a form with some additional support. Like you I am a layman there though.
Have seen this in industrial settings where the metal was completely rusted/gone and the concrete structure was fine.
Have seen this in industrial settings where the metal was completely rusted/gone and the concrete structure was fine.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 7:50 pm to thermal9221
quote:
Slabs are thin. Weight is supported by steel trusses.
Makes sense. I'm not sure what the alternative would be for a really high building anyway.
What about failure mode? I was thinking you might see more dramatic failures with this sort of design than with other concrete designs.
I know there have been some pretty dramatic concrete collapses, like that Sampoong Department Store in Korea. That structure was developing pretty dramatic cracks that just got ignored, though.
Posted on 10/12/19 at 8:42 pm to cgrand
If the structure wasn’t cross-braced, moving or loading weight across the slabs could cause the frame to rack. I’ve seen that happen up close.
This post was edited on 10/12/19 at 8:44 pm
Posted on 10/12/19 at 8:51 pm to fightin tigers
quote:
Just admit you don't know what you are talking about
Why do you keep parroting that? I wasn't even privy to the prior exchange you had with the other poster that set you off. And, as far as the law goes, I know what I'm talking about. A plaintiff's lawyer will name every single possible entity potentially involved. And over the course of pre-trial procedure the actual defendants will be winnowed down.
This post was edited on 10/12/19 at 8:54 pm
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