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Message
re: Nobody wants to work anymore
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:18 am to Taxing Authority
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:18 am to Taxing Authority
quote:
He didn't live up to being anything other than an expense.
Maybe you are a good employer IRL and you just characterize it poorly here (as you said, it is late) but it never hurts to re-examine possible blind spots. You may not use the same rhetoric at work that you do online, but it hints at a certain mindset that may be holding you back.
1
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:19 am to EarlyCuyler3
quote:Nah. If you need the obvious explained to you, it's not really my job.
The mother of all deflections.
quote:My business has never been better, nor healthier, How's yours doing?
The wrong one apparently, but it's your business, not mine.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:21 am to msutiger
quote:
I never know where to fall on this issue. Young graduates are entitled shitheads but also frick most corporations who don’t really give a shite about their employees.
These things obviously feed into each other. When businesses are shitty to their employees and give employees no reason to be loyal to them, employees do the absolute minimum to get by and don’t care about the job that they know they could lose at a moment’s notice through no fault of their own. When employees do the absolute minimum to get by and don’t care about the job, businesses see no reason to treat them well or show them loyalty and consider them replaceable.
So which came first? The young graduates are under 30. The companies have been shitty for far more than 30 years…
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:22 am to Taxing Authority
quote:
Nah. If you need the obvious explained to you, it's not really my job.
Let me spell this out for you real simple like. You made a claim (multiple actually) and I questioned it's validity. Therefore, it is upon you to prove said claim, not me. When you attempt to dismiss it by referencing thermodynamics, that is TEXTBOOK deflection.
Are you up to speed now?
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:22 am to Slagathor
quote:Maybe? But it's pretty clear some presumptions were also made by others.
Maybe you are a good employer IRL and you just characterize it poorly
But have a look at what others (including those making presumptions of it being all the employers fault) about how apt employees are to jump ship up the thread. Yet when it happens... it's all the employer's fault.
quote:Ya reckon anyone around here does that?
You may not use the same rhetoric at work that you do online
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:22 am to OKBoomerSooner
quote:
These things obviously feed into each other. When businesses are shitty to their employees and give employees no reason to be loyal to them, employees do the absolute minimum to get by and don’t care about the job that they know they could lose at a moment’s notice through no fault of their own. When employees do the absolute minimum to get by and don’t care about the job, businesses see no reason to treat them well or show them loyalty and consider them replaceable.
So which came first? The young graduates are under 30. The companies have been shitty for far more than 30 years…
Pretty good take IMO.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:23 am to Taxing Authority
quote:Hm yet he was immediately able to get a job elsewhere for more?
Nope. We knew the market precisely, because so many of those guys work contract. We had hired him direct from his contract position with a uplift 6 months before this. So he was already above market. Plus 25%.
quote:What don't you get about this? You are here saying that's exactly how you treat employees. Why would you expect anything else?
He didn't live up to being anything other than an expense.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:25 am to Korkstand
quote:
What don't you get about this? You are here saying that's exactly how you treat employees. Why would you expect anything else?
It's like he's holding up a sign at a wrasslin' match that says "I'm an a-hole to work for" and then swears he isn't holding up that very sign.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:29 am to EarlyCuyler3
quote:No it's not. It's demonstrating absurdity with absurdity. I do not like explaining the obviuos. But if that's what you need, I'll be kind and try. Once.
When you attempt to dismiss it by referencing thermodynamics, that is TEXTBOOK deflection.
If you think ONLY my employees are the only ones that have ever drug up for a nominal amount for no other explicable reason. That is obvious to anyone that has ever employed people. You wanting "proof" of that is silly. It's like asking for proof that water is wet. It's absurd ot ask proof of something so obviuos.
Anyone that has ever employed peple knows that happens. And that's why you don't over-value employees. Because even when overpaid--there is often no loyalty there.
Are you up to speed now?
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:35 am to Taxing Authority
quote:
Because even when overpaid--there is often no loyalty there.
Leaving doesn’t automatically constitute disloyalty
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:38 am to Taxing Authority
quote:
for no other explicable reason.
Oh we've identified the reason.
quote:
And that's why you don't over-value employees. Because even when overpaid--there is often no loyalty there
You mean the guy you knowingly underpaid for God knows how long?
Go to sleep. There's a whole new day tomorrow for you to remind your employees what burdens they are on the company.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:38 am to Korkstand
quote:Yea a whole 1% for an employee we were paying almost 30% above contract rates.
Hm yet he was immediately able to get a job elsewhere for more?
I'm not blaming him. If he can get it, he should go for it. I've never been mad at an employee for taking a better deal. But there's no reason to pretend he left because he was an "asset" that was undervalued and mistreated.
If employees are going to make those kinds of business decisions, why shouldn't employers?
quote:What don't you get about this? I'm telling you how employees act in irrational manner with zero loyalty so they shouldn't be considered assets. Why would you expect employers to treat them any different?
You are here saying that's exactly how you treat employees. Why would you expect anything else?
I mean, there's the chicken-and-egg problem here. But I laid out the timeline for you.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:42 am to Slagathor
quote:No, it doesn't. And I've never taken it personally. But that wasn't the point... Square the demand of "loyalty" with the earlier responses in the thread about how people say companies have not loyalty to employees because they aren't willing to pay them over market rates.
Leaving doesn’t automatically constitute disloyalty
It goes both ways.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:42 am to Taxing Authority
quote:It's explicable...
If you think ONLY my employees are the only ones that have ever drug up for a nominal amount for no other explicable reason.
quote:And there's the explanation. You can't buy loyalty. You have to earn it. But you really don't seem interested in doing either. You seem to just expect it.
Because even when overpaid--there is often no loyalty there.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:44 am to EarlyCuyler3
quote:You've made up stories in your head.
Oh we've identified the reason.
quote:^ an example!
You mean the guy you knowingly underpaid for God knows how long?
quote:Can't. Waiting for a model to finish running. It's so easy being the company owner. Everyone should try it!
Go to sleep.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:46 am to Korkstand
We're also glossing over how he was knowingly and willingly paying the guy less than market value for an unknown length of time. Not saying it's wrong, but how do you think the employee feels about that?
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:47 am to Taxing Authority
quote:
It's so easy being the company owner. Everyone should try it!
Haven't seen that said one time in this thread. It does sound like you don't deal with the stress of it well though.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:48 am to Korkstand
quote:100% CORRECT!!!! That was the entire point. Yet earlier in the thread (maybe you missed it) everyone was saying how employees aren't loyal because employers don't pay enough or are too demanding for the pay.
And there's the explanation. You can't buy loyalty.
quote:
You have to earn it. But you really don't seem interested in doing either. You seem to just expect it.
You have zero basis for that. I haven't hired anyone in a long time. Because we are staying small (by choice) and I haven't had anyone quit. My last resignation was someone that decide to be a stay-at-home mom. I guess I'm an a-hole for not paying her until her kid is 18? Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:50 am to EarlyCuyler3
quote:Literally, covered that. Try again.
We're also glossing over how he was knowingly and willingly paying the guy less than market value for an unknown length of time.
quote:
We knew the market precisely, because so many of those guys work contract. We had hired him direct from his contract position with a uplift 6 months before this. So he was already above market. Plus 25%.
Posted on 9/7/22 at 12:52 am to EarlyCuyler3
quote:So you never claimed ownership and upper managers are overpaid? You sure?
Haven't seen that said one time in this thread.
quote:
It does sound like you don't deal with the stress of it well though.
I love my work. That's why I'm here doing it. 
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