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Message
re: Midland (TX) Police Officer killed by man who thought his home was being burglarized
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:39 am to kywildcatfanone
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:39 am to kywildcatfanone
quote:
With that said, isn't the alarm company required to contact the owner prior to calling police, and I guess he could have had his phone on silence.
Yes. But the homeowner not answering is NOT legal grounds to enter.
The police can only enter if they have evidence the homeowner’s life is threatened. And the state defends that. Not the homeowner.
1
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:40 am to cyarrr
quote:
Exigent circumstances can justify a warrantless entry. We are missing a lot of facts regarding whether it was reasonable for them to enter the house in the manner that they did.
I totally agree.
But even then, knowing that this can sometimes be the result due to miscommunication, you can't possibly charge the homeowner unless the homeowner should have reasonably known that they were actual cops and not burglars.
This is just one of those unfortunate situations that everybody just kind of has to walk away from. But in typical law enforcement fashion, 'somebody has to be charged with something'.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:41 am to theunknownknight
quote:
I never said it wasn’t a “real” thing. I’m saying the burden of proof when using this reasoning falls on the state not the homeowner. Why is that so difficult to understand?
You said no warrant = an invasion. That's simply incorrect.
However, the burden of proof for exigent circumstances does in fact fall on the state. That's correct.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:41 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
yeah if probation isn't involved why the hell were cops busting in this random door?
That’s my question. There’s only one reason in this case and it’s on the state to prove it.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:41 am to munchman
quote:
His probation officer....This won’t end well.
You think you can shoot your probation officer and only get 2nd degree manslaughter? There'd be a list of other charges. Whether it's felony or misdemeanor probation, they're kinda sticklers for the no firearms thing. Plus his bond was only 75k, you don't get that for killing your p.o., while illegally armed. Or i could be wrong af, but the known facts aren't lining up for this being correct.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:41 am to theunknownknight
Well I’m not playing your little game of bullshite hypothetical. A “team” isn’t breaking down a door for an alarm call. In fact, officers don’t enter a home on an alarm call unless there is obvious signs of forced entry. In that situation they secure the perimeter, try to make contact with the home owner, then secure the inside.
Nothing indicates the officer was inside the home or forcing entry into the home. I’d bet the officer was in the yard walking the perimeter checking for forced entry and was shot through a window.
And shooting someone with a flashlight on your porch, in your yard, etc that you haven’t even identified is not justifiable. If for some reason you look out the window and see someone with a flashlight in one hand and a gun in the other, you should also be able to see a uniform
Nothing indicates the officer was inside the home or forcing entry into the home. I’d bet the officer was in the yard walking the perimeter checking for forced entry and was shot through a window.
And shooting someone with a flashlight on your porch, in your yard, etc that you haven’t even identified is not justifiable. If for some reason you look out the window and see someone with a flashlight in one hand and a gun in the other, you should also be able to see a uniform
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:42 am to slackster
quote:
You said no warrant = an invasion. That's simply incorrect.
However, the burden of proof for exigent circumstances does in fact fall on the state. That's correct.
It’s one and the same. Exigent circumstances give the police the right to invade. But THEY have to prove those circumstances. Not the homeowner.
This post was edited on 3/7/19 at 7:43 am
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:42 am to theunknownknight
quote:
Yes. But the homeowner not answering is NOT legal grounds to enter.
The police can only enter if they have evidence the homeowner’s life is threatened. And the state defends that. Not the homeowner.
You're getting carried away here.
Danger to life is not the only reason they can enter, for starters.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:44 am to slackster
quote:
Danger to life is not the only reason they can enter, for starters.
Preserving evidence would be a hard sell here.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:44 am to TigersSEC2010
He reasonably feared for his life..or does that only work when a cop kills someone.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:46 am to FelicianaTigerfan
quote:
Amazing how many people support firing a gun at an unidentified target.
Bunch of paranoid pussies ready to blast anything that goes bump in the night.
In your own home?
Do drunk people wander into the wrong home? Yes. Do little kids go into the wrong door? Yes. Do old people with Alzheimer's walk into to the wrong house? Yes. Do cops serve no-knock warrants and bust through people's doors? Yes.
BUT, the assumption in society is that anytime you enter someone's home without permission, regardless of the reasons why, regardless of intent, regardless of whether or not it was an accident, that entry is made with the assumption that your life is going to be in the homeowners hands. A man's house is his castle. It's the most legally protected property in our society.
The onus is not on the homeowner. It's not the homeowner's responsibility to place his own life and the life of his family at risk in order to determine whether or not the invading party has ill intent.
Unless you live in California
This post was edited on 3/7/19 at 8:01 am
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:47 am to BuckyCheese
quote:
I'll be very surprised if there is any proof they "loudly" announced themselves.
Nah they will have proof. Each of them will testify almost identically about how it went down.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:50 am to FelicianaTigerfan
quote:
Amazing how many people support firing a gun at an unidentified target.
Amazing how the very people who find any reason to excuse police from facing legal consequences for killing someone are the very people looking for any reason to charge the man in this situation.
quote:
Bunch of paranoid pussies ready to blast anything that goes bump in the night.
The same could be said of many police officers.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:51 am to dgnx6
quote:
Cops are in a lose lose. I actually hope something happens to the people bashing police and these guys actually need an officer at their home and no one shows up
I don't need cops in my life. Never have never will. That's what the Second Amendment is for. Law enforcement has cause nothing but grief in my life and I've always been a law-abiding citizen.
It's the same with any other government employee. I'd like to minimize their numbers as much as possible, take care of my own shite and save money in the process.
Protect and Serve is a pipe dream of days going by. Annoy and Harass is more accurate.
This post was edited on 3/7/19 at 7:52 am
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:51 am to MoarKilometers
quote:
Preserving evidence would be a hard sell here.
Pursuit of a suspect would apply. Texas also allows deadly force to protect property, so I wouldn't be surprised if something like that extends to LEOs in presumed burglary situations.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:52 am to TigersSEC2010
Yeah. It’s a sad deal. First officer death on duty in like 60 years over here. Apparently the police were responding to an alarm. The house he walked into is worth well over a million. Not like this happened in the ghetto.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:53 am to nola000
Ill change my opinion when its reported that they forced illegal entry into the home, didn't announce who they were and barged in blinding the guy with light and he feared he would be killed
No where in the article I read did it state they were even attempting to make entry into the home, much less were inside it.
No where in the article I read did it state they were even attempting to make entry into the home, much less were inside it.
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:54 am to midlandtexastiger
quote:
The house he walked into
So it’s confirmed they entered on an alarm call?
This post was edited on 3/7/19 at 7:55 am
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:56 am to FelicianaTigerfan
quote:
Nothing indicates the officer was inside the home or forcing entry into the home. I’d bet the officer was in the yard walking the perimeter checking for forced entry and was shot through a window.
I said in another post that if he shot from inside the home outside at the cops then he’s screwed. What’s so difficult to grasp here?
Posted on 3/7/19 at 7:56 am to GetCocky11
quote:
The article goes on to say that the officer who was killed was a Field Training Officer
Train better.
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