re: Latest Updates: Russia-Ukraine Conflict

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The only credence I can give to a possible lab leak is ...

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Then you're a fricking imbecile. Sorry, but to have a medical background, access to medical journals, and research, and still contend SARS-CoV-2 was a natural zoonosis, albeit with no reasonable pretext of an originating possible vector nearly five (5) years out, is intellectually ridiculous.

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albeit with no reasonable pretext of an originating possible vector nearly five (5) years out, is intellectually ridiculous

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I mean, it's a pretty standard opinion in my world. Florian Krammer shares it, as do all my colleagues. Given the vector and how to handle that vector in vitro, the need for specialized equipment and very specific buffers to handle coronaviruses, at least if they used the latest methods published in 2016, especially if they used a plasmid with a dominant selective marker gene.

But again, we've talked about this exact subject before I'm pretty sure. The content of the lab leak theories, from what I've seen, is stupid and unconvincing. Maybe you can draw a narrative that could satisfy the requiste molecular biology lab work with the virus itself, but I have yet to read that narrative, which in my mind would be the most convincing argument.

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You don't know why the Polish invasion occurred. You should. At least you should know prior to posting as if you do.
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Delicious

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Indeed. Ignorance is bliss.

Have a cup or two. Enjoy.

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in my world

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I have a feeling that's a very special place...almost magical.

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I mean, it's a pretty standard opinion in my world. Florian Krammer shares it

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Florian Krammer traded truth for funding. Two things. (1) There is no reasonable pretext regarding a natural vector. None. (2) There are two Chinese Labs in Wuhan focused on coronavirus research. In fact, there may not be a larger repository of coronavirus on the planet than the WIV. The WIV was headed by a CCP hack. There were staffing issues, known safety issues, and funding shortfalls. Further, the Chinese have a history of multiple SARS-CoV lab leaks, leaks for which they required WHO assistance to resolve.

Given those facts, no marginally intelligent independently-thinking scientist would hold serious credence in a natural zoonosis theory. Krammer et al know better, but money in exchange for duplicity begets duplicity.

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There were staffing issues, known safety issues, and funding shortfalls

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Again, you realize we've already talked about this exact subject, where I said that the most believable theory was the improper handling of sensitive samples, with cell passaging providing a convenient way of allowing for the relative robustness of that first strain.

We can't rule out any thing definitively because of the way the Chinese handled their laboratory notebooks, but the line of argument that the virus was man-made is the least compelling argument and has never been argued convincingly to my knowledge. That said, a completely zoonotic origin will be hard to pin down, especially as techniques one would use to determine the etiology of a pathogen in the West would involve finding case reports of odd presentations of patients with pneumonia with an unclear etiology and use those to localize and triangulate a possible origin. We won't ever get access to that sort of data if it even exists due to the closed nature of China, among other reasons. I don't even go as far as Krammer, who disputes any lab interference at all, as I can admit that there are several steps in the process of isolating samples which can provide ample opportunity for zoonotic spillover. But that doesn't change my view that the lab leak theories offered in the widespread media were definitely not written for someone involved in the sciences in mind, and were not convincing to me, my own hyperbole aside.

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I don't even go as far as Krammer, who disputes any lab interference at all

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Again, such contentions are not scientifically based. Krammer (unless he has VERY deep ties to the intel world) could not possibly have an informed opinion regarding the possibility of lab "interference." The only possible scientifically based thesis he could have would be formulated on proximity of a practical indigenous animal vector, and genetics to back it up. He has neither.

You need to ask those "in your world" WTF ever happened to the question/testing elements of the scientific method.

Can ya'll go find another thread to argue stupid shite in and play childish insult games?

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Sorry, but to have a medical background, access to medical journals, and research, and still contend SARS-CoV-2 was a natural zoonosis, albeit with no reasonable pretext of an originating possible vector nearly five (5) years out, is intellectually ridiculous.

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Pure indoctrinated insanity.

The best part was them telling everyone to wear masks when everyone knew they didn’t work.

Nothing is funnier than someone vaxxed and boosted getting Covid 3-4 times

Trust the science!

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The funny part is that Bat Lady of Wuhan lab, was quite proud of her discovery of "a new an terrible coronavirus" and published it in the lab's scientific papers among other things.

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Funnier still, when she was notified of a novel virus infecting Wuhanese, her first thought ...... Lab Leak.