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Started By
Message
re: ITEP critics defeat ExxonMobil tax break requests Thursday at School Board
Posted on 1/19/19 at 1:59 pm to X123F45
Posted on 1/19/19 at 1:59 pm to X123F45
quote:
I've driven through 44 states a number of times and driven through almost every small town in Louisiana.
I pay attention to houses, cars, grocery stores, gas stations, schools, police stations.
It is quite shocking how poorly a lot of the country is doing. Houses that are shacks we wouldn't use for camps. The average age of cars going back into the late 90s, with newer cars being the exception rather than the norm. The largest grocery stores in towns having the selections of your average discount stores in North baton rouge. Gas stations that are still manual. Schools that are basically steps above shacks. Police stations that make the calcasieu satellite office look like a damned mansion.
If you open your eyes when you travel, you might not have such a harsh opinion of your home state.
Posters like mudminnow are some of the most ungrateful people on the planet who really don't realize how good they have it.
There are billions of people in Africa, South America, Asia and the Mideast that would kill to have the living standard that Louisiana has and he wants to make fun of Louisiana people trying to improve the state like he's making fun of a fatty at the gym?
Texas people and Louisiana leavers that has that kind of attitude can get fricked.
1
Posted on 1/19/19 at 2:01 pm to Icansee4miles
quote:
Meanwhile down the road in Ascension Parish...
These People Get It
I don't have or do facebook.
Can you post it here or at least a screenshot?
Posted on 1/19/19 at 2:07 pm to Sentrius
AP voted for ITEP exemptions for a massive Shell plant that dwarfs the Exxon investment being asked for in EBRP.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 2:10 pm to Sentrius
Mudminnow is god awful in every thread involving Tx/LA or LA in general
Posted on 1/19/19 at 2:13 pm to Cump11b
quote:
East Baton Rouge Parish School Board on Thursday voted just before midnight Thursday to reject two controversial requests for industrial tax breaks from the biggest taxpayer in the parish.
Let me first say, I am in no way affiliated with ExxonMobil. I am a resident of Baton Rouge, and hopefully soon, City of St George.
Because of this vote by our idiotic liberal Democrat EBR school board against ExxonMobil, I am now OFFICIALLY ANTI-TEACHER. I will never ever vote for a teacher pay raise ever again.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 2:15 pm to X123F45
quote:You said LA is doing better than 90% of the rest of the USA.
If you open your eyes when you travel, you might not have such a harsh opinion of your home state.
That is blatantly false, under any definition of “better” you can even come up with.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 3:05 pm to Supermoto Tiger
quote:
Because of this vote by our idiotic liberal Democrat EBR school board against ExxonMobil, I am now OFFICIALLY ANTI-TEACHER. I will never ever vote for a teacher pay raise ever again.
JBE is going to be screaming for more taxes to pay for teachers raises this coming legislative session and I say the legislature better not yield one single inch after this stunt by the EBRP school board.
Just buckle up and it's only 9 months until we can elect a new Governor that's not an illiterate retard on economics, taxes and spending.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 3:10 pm to Supermoto Tiger
quote:
Supermoto Tiger
Wait a second, aren't you one of those clueless moron republicans that voted for JBE in 2015?
How's that holier than thou attitude working out so far for you?
Posted on 1/19/19 at 3:39 pm to Overbrook
quote:When did high taxes become a feature of “free market economics”? The only free market principles going on here is EBR pricing themselves out of the market.
Oh horrors, what has happened to free market economics when the government can deny a firm its corporate welfare
Posted on 1/19/19 at 7:19 pm to lsu1919
I think alot of the people on this thread would be furious if they really had an understanding of what's been going on with ITEP and not just blindly following the party line.
I am a very conservative Republican and I am telling you, the big industry folks have been pillaging local government for decades with this particular incentive.
They 100% are submitting applications for routine and necessary equipment replacements and keeping 50+% off the tax roles and have for decades and decades.
The primary intent of ITEP is to lure green field investment. The program is a 5+5 year incentive. It was never intended to be a lifetime incentive, but that's what it has turned into and has been like this for a long time.
No one had heard of ITEP until a few years ago. It was a dirty little secret.
I have no issues with 10 years of 50, 80, or even 100% property tax abatement for new significant investment that adds jobs.
But 1 day after your 10 years is up, it's time to start paying. That was the deal.
It amazes me that most folks are afraid to hold big industry accountable. You can be a huge fan of industry AND believe in paying what you are supposed to pay.
It's ridiculous that 65% of Exxons footprint has never been on the tax roles.
That's one hell of a 10 year incentive. Call a spade a spade.
Tatman, of whom I am not a big fan, made the right vote. He's way too middle of the road for me on most issues, but he understands what has been going on and knows it's bullshite.
It's not productive for us to blindly assume that Big Industry is right and Together BR is wrong. 99% of the time, this is likely true, but in the case of ITEP abuse and possibly fraud, Big Industry has been turning in bogus applications and getting over on us for years. It's just that the commie bastards over at TBR caught it. Good for them, and shame on the politicians that turned a blind eye for so many years.
I am a very conservative Republican and I am telling you, the big industry folks have been pillaging local government for decades with this particular incentive.
They 100% are submitting applications for routine and necessary equipment replacements and keeping 50+% off the tax roles and have for decades and decades.
The primary intent of ITEP is to lure green field investment. The program is a 5+5 year incentive. It was never intended to be a lifetime incentive, but that's what it has turned into and has been like this for a long time.
No one had heard of ITEP until a few years ago. It was a dirty little secret.
I have no issues with 10 years of 50, 80, or even 100% property tax abatement for new significant investment that adds jobs.
But 1 day after your 10 years is up, it's time to start paying. That was the deal.
It amazes me that most folks are afraid to hold big industry accountable. You can be a huge fan of industry AND believe in paying what you are supposed to pay.
It's ridiculous that 65% of Exxons footprint has never been on the tax roles.
That's one hell of a 10 year incentive. Call a spade a spade.
Tatman, of whom I am not a big fan, made the right vote. He's way too middle of the road for me on most issues, but he understands what has been going on and knows it's bullshite.
It's not productive for us to blindly assume that Big Industry is right and Together BR is wrong. 99% of the time, this is likely true, but in the case of ITEP abuse and possibly fraud, Big Industry has been turning in bogus applications and getting over on us for years. It's just that the commie bastards over at TBR caught it. Good for them, and shame on the politicians that turned a blind eye for so many years.
This post was edited on 1/19/19 at 8:43 pm
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:18 pm to Rouge
quote:
because other places will offer the deal
The job of exxon is to maximize shareholder value, not make sure that residential property taxes are lower.
Have the jobs, housing, schools, and tax revenue from those people is more valuable that the industrial tax.
BR needs Exxon much more than Exxon needs BR. It's simple leverage that comes with big industry.
That's way oversimplifying how site selection occurs. Feedstock availability, pricing, and logistics play 1000x more into the economics of site selection than any economic incentive. This is big business. The truth is almost all the incentives are just gravy to the manufacturer.
This post was edited on 1/19/19 at 8:23 pm
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:22 pm to topdollarbill
There is a lot of truth in your post. That's why JBE was right for wanting locals to have a say again.
However, he did not have a plan in place for parishes to follow, and that has created a cluster frick. Right idea, poorly implemented.
However, he did not have a plan in place for parishes to follow, and that has created a cluster frick. Right idea, poorly implemented.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:27 pm to LSUgusto
JBE let locals have control because he was too much of a candy arse to actually fix it. He stacked the Board of Commerce and Industry with folks who will just continue to rubber stamp applications that are not inline with the intent of ITEP but are not able to be scrutinized easily. This was done to satisfy industry.
At the same time, he placated his base and TBR by allowing locals to vote on ITEP applications.
He played both sides. This mess is his fault. I hope they can all get in a room and fix it soon or we could be in a bad way.
At the same time, he placated his base and TBR by allowing locals to vote on ITEP applications.
He played both sides. This mess is his fault. I hope they can all get in a room and fix it soon or we could be in a bad way.
This post was edited on 1/19/19 at 8:29 pm
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:36 pm to Cump11b
These teachers are teaching our children? For God's sake they are stupid. It's sure is a new day for your students lady...they will have no jobs to apply for locally because you idiots dont have a clue how to keep employers who are adding tax paying, high wage jobs! You liberals are clueless.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:41 pm to LSUgusto
Look what just happend up in Zachary with Georgia Pacific. GP made a business decision to close 2 of the 3 main units up there. The timber to pulp unit and the fine paper unit.
They closed these 2 units because they ran the numbers and they can be more profitable shutting them down than running them. They arent going bankrupt. It was a business decison to increase profitability. It was the right thing to do for shareholders.
My issue is EBR has been incentivizing them for way more than the 10 year ITEP period. Like Exxon and others who have figured out the system long ago, they would turn in applications that got rubber stamped for replacing stuff that was worn out from normal use.
Over 50+% of GP was never on the tax rolls. They all employ the same lobbyists and its long been an inside joke about whats been going on with ITEP.
EBR made a significant investment with abateing these taxes with the promise that the ROI would be there in the long term.
There needs to be clawback provisions in the ITEP language that lets companies know that if they are simply closing a plant that we have abated taxes on for decades and decades for just shareholder profits, then we want some of our investment back.
It costs millions of dollars to shut those units down. You simply don't lock the gate. They should be writing us a check, but ITEP is completely broken and not a well thought out incentive.
They closed these 2 units because they ran the numbers and they can be more profitable shutting them down than running them. They arent going bankrupt. It was a business decison to increase profitability. It was the right thing to do for shareholders.
My issue is EBR has been incentivizing them for way more than the 10 year ITEP period. Like Exxon and others who have figured out the system long ago, they would turn in applications that got rubber stamped for replacing stuff that was worn out from normal use.
Over 50+% of GP was never on the tax rolls. They all employ the same lobbyists and its long been an inside joke about whats been going on with ITEP.
EBR made a significant investment with abateing these taxes with the promise that the ROI would be there in the long term.
There needs to be clawback provisions in the ITEP language that lets companies know that if they are simply closing a plant that we have abated taxes on for decades and decades for just shareholder profits, then we want some of our investment back.
It costs millions of dollars to shut those units down. You simply don't lock the gate. They should be writing us a check, but ITEP is completely broken and not a well thought out incentive.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:53 pm to topdollarbill
Tax “roles” highlights the stupidity of the rest of your post that’s not in any way based on fact. Fraud? Pillaging local government?
Do you have proof or a link to someone supporting the BS you’re spouting? You are patently wrong about ITEP. It’s to attract and RETAIN industry.
You are as much a conservative Republican as our Governor. Actually, you sound like a typical TBR paid terrorist. Posting total falsehoods about Baton Rouge’s largest employer AND taxpayer. Did someone tip your group off to this discussion taking place on TD? It will be nice when St. George withdraws and you carpetbaggers leave to go ruin some other community.
Do you have proof or a link to someone supporting the BS you’re spouting? You are patently wrong about ITEP. It’s to attract and RETAIN industry.
You are as much a conservative Republican as our Governor. Actually, you sound like a typical TBR paid terrorist. Posting total falsehoods about Baton Rouge’s largest employer AND taxpayer. Did someone tip your group off to this discussion taking place on TD? It will be nice when St. George withdraws and you carpetbaggers leave to go ruin some other community.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 8:59 pm to topdollarbill
You illustrate very well the problems with the old ITEP.
But, I think the clawback provisions already exists in law. It's just that local governments rarely enforce it, because they know little about it.
But, I think the clawback provisions already exists in law. It's just that local governments rarely enforce it, because they know little about it.
Posted on 1/19/19 at 9:09 pm to Icansee4miles
Yeah man, I'm about as far as you can get from TBR.
I've donated in excess of $100k in political contributions to Republicans over the last 10 years, with exactly ZERO going to Democrats.
Nothing I've written in these ITEP posts is false. I've personally reviewed dozens and dozens of ITEP applications in detail. I used to get paid to do so in fact. Did you?
And I am an ardent supporter of STG. Signed it the first time, and signed it the second time. And will vote in favor, and prolly call everyone I know that lives in that area to do the same. If asked, I will drive the busses and pickup strangers to go vote in favor. I absolutely hate the city parish as it exists today.
I just happen to know a great deal about ITEP, market dynamics, the manufacturing sector, and general business sense. A great deal more than you, it would seem.
But I'm willing to learn. Explain to me why approx 65% of Exxon Refinery is off the tax rolls and has never been on the rolls. I'm ready to hear it. Remember, ITEP is a 5 year statutory incentive with a 5 year local option. Go.
I've donated in excess of $100k in political contributions to Republicans over the last 10 years, with exactly ZERO going to Democrats.
Nothing I've written in these ITEP posts is false. I've personally reviewed dozens and dozens of ITEP applications in detail. I used to get paid to do so in fact. Did you?
And I am an ardent supporter of STG. Signed it the first time, and signed it the second time. And will vote in favor, and prolly call everyone I know that lives in that area to do the same. If asked, I will drive the busses and pickup strangers to go vote in favor. I absolutely hate the city parish as it exists today.
I just happen to know a great deal about ITEP, market dynamics, the manufacturing sector, and general business sense. A great deal more than you, it would seem.
But I'm willing to learn. Explain to me why approx 65% of Exxon Refinery is off the tax rolls and has never been on the rolls. I'm ready to hear it. Remember, ITEP is a 5 year statutory incentive with a 5 year local option. Go.
This post was edited on 1/19/19 at 9:28 pm
Posted on 1/19/19 at 9:14 pm to Icansee4miles
Let me really get your head spinning.
I am also an incentive beneficiary, and I'm telling you that's what my consultants and lobbyists do for me, and dozens of others that I am aware of.
I am also an incentive beneficiary, and I'm telling you that's what my consultants and lobbyists do for me, and dozens of others that I am aware of.
This post was edited on 1/19/19 at 9:20 pm
Posted on 1/19/19 at 9:24 pm to LSUgusto
I am unaware of any clawback provisions allowed in ITEP statutes but I could be wrong. I haven't read them in a few years and reading state law is about as fun as anal rape to me. (Which is to say, NOT FUN in case you were wondering)
I hope they add them if they aren't in there, and if they do already exist, if I were EBR / Zachary, I would enforce them to the fullest extent. Not to punish GP of course, but to get what I could of my investment back. If the provision is in there, they should exercise it.
I hope they add them if they aren't in there, and if they do already exist, if I were EBR / Zachary, I would enforce them to the fullest extent. Not to punish GP of course, but to get what I could of my investment back. If the provision is in there, they should exercise it.
This post was edited on 1/19/19 at 9:25 pm
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