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re: FBI officially Investigating California shooting as a act of terrorism
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:19 pm to Ace Midnight
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:19 pm to Ace Midnight
quote:
Of course, now this is an object lesson and teaching point for cells for future operations. A bunch of "no way" stuff happened with this attack. There was tactical training going on about a mile away? There were response teams there in less than 5 minutes? They had the name and DOB within a short period of time?
Have you called the FBI since you have it figured out? There are significant unknowns about the "wife" as well as the mysterious middle eastern men who were frequenting his apartment. My understanding is the woman had only been here since this summer.
This post was edited on 12/3/15 at 3:21 pm
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Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:20 pm to Ace Midnight
I do not know for sure but am guessing they were ID'ed by license plate, either from a witness or one of the many cameras on their way in/out.
I have a little more food for thought. They are saying he got mad, left, went home, got dressed up, loaded up for bear, drove back and opened fire, all within 30 minutes. His ammo stash/condo was six miles away, through traffic.
The timeline is all wrong. He must have had the Paki and things in the SUV in the parking lot. 5 minutes out, twenty to get dressed and strap up, 5 minutes back in.
Does anyone know if there are video cameras on property? I know there are four at the traffic signal at the entrance to the grounds.
I have a little more food for thought. They are saying he got mad, left, went home, got dressed up, loaded up for bear, drove back and opened fire, all within 30 minutes. His ammo stash/condo was six miles away, through traffic.
The timeline is all wrong. He must have had the Paki and things in the SUV in the parking lot. 5 minutes out, twenty to get dressed and strap up, 5 minutes back in.
Does anyone know if there are video cameras on property? I know there are four at the traffic signal at the entrance to the grounds.
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:20 pm to Ace Midnight
quote:
This attack does betray a lack of hands on leadership and a weakness in this decentralized cell organizational structure
I don't think that at all.
It shows quite the opposite. Inspire people online to grab some guns and shoot some people is a lot easier then trying to set up some complicated campaign to take down an airplane or whatever. 9/11 was an impressive feat and very very difficult to achieve.
quote:
And even with all that, the mission has to be considered a success for the terrorists.
Exactly. Easy peasy in comparison to other plots.
This post was edited on 12/3/15 at 3:23 pm
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:23 pm to Festus
quote:
Where did he go immediately following the attack, and why in the hell was he only like a mile or 2 away from the shootings when they found him? That baffles me.
I thought they found him at his house, which started the car chase that ended only a few miles from the original attack?
Im curious why it took a few hours to check out this guys house, after we heard his name over the scanner no more than 30 minutes after the original attack
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:23 pm to Hangit
quote:
am guessing they were ID'ed by license plate, either from a witness or one of the many cameras on their way i
A witness IDed the shooter. They got the car wrong, so it's unlikely they got a plate. Early scanner activity had them in a Tahoe or Yukon and they were in fact in Ford Expedition (I think).
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:23 pm to Teddy Ruxpin
You gotta wonder if this is going to be the new terrorist strategy. Avoid the major cities. Hit the smaller subarbs with much less security around. And attack the most helpless in that group.
Get the average people, who never really spend time in the big cities, and make up the vast majority of the country, in a fear frenzy.
Get the average people, who never really spend time in the big cities, and make up the vast majority of the country, in a fear frenzy.
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:25 pm to MrPappagiorgio
quote:
Im curious why it took a few hours to check out this guys house, after we heard his name over the scanner no more than 30 minutes after the original attack
I don't think it took that long for the police to stakeout the house. It took the shooters that long to return to the house.
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:27 pm to Festus
quote:
Get the average people, who never really spend time in the big cities, and make up the vast majority of the country, in a fear frenzy.
Shooting up a mall in Lexington, KY or a high school football game in TX would have far more of an effect than the Northeast centric attacks have had. But it's tougher to radicalize the Muslims there without direct contact. Just my guess.
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:27 pm to Festus
quote:
Where did he go immediately following the attack
Almost certainly they went directly to the residence in Redlands. Maybe they took a circuitous, surveillance detection route, but the evidence will probably come out on that, as most traffic is filmed in urban Southern California.
quote:
why in the hell was he only like a mile or 2 away from the shootings when they found him?
They spooked them at the apartment and they rabbited. Now, they headed back into San Bernadino. My best guess is they were trying to get to the 10/15 intersection to leave the area. More coincidence they passed near the scene of the crime, I would think.
I would be curious to see how long into the pursuit they actually attempted to pull them over.
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:29 pm to Festus
quote:
Where did he go immediately following the attack, and why in the hell was he only like a mile or 2 away from the shootings when they found him? That baffles me
People do strange things once they decide to die.
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:30 pm to Hangit
quote:
The timeline is all wrong. He must have had the Paki and things in the SUV in the parking lot. 5 minutes out, twenty to get dressed and strap up, 5 minutes back in.
I agree with this - they came prepared to conduct the operation. He made sure the soft target was still valid, then kitted up in the vehicle. I don't buy he went back to Redlands, got ready, then returned. That doesn't make a lot of sense - I assume they're going to pick up the vehicle on traffic cameras and construct some sort of timeline.
Unless SB county roads are not as heavily photographed as in L.A. county.
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:31 pm to Festus
quote:
You gotta wonder if this is going to be the new terrorist strategy. Avoid the major cities. Hit the smaller subarbs with much less security around
This has been my fear. Coordinated attacks scattered across the country in cities with little resources (less than 10k people). The feds and state help would be scattered very thin
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:32 pm to Ace Midnight
Plus they were reporting earlier today they dropped the child off at the parents house claiming to be going to the dr. This was planned.
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:33 pm to Ace Midnight
I should be so lucky. I lost mine at Chernobyl.
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:34 pm to Teddy Ruxpin
quote:
I don't think that at all. It shows quite the opposite. Inspire people online to grab some guns and shoot some people is a lot easier then trying to set up some complicated campaign to take down an airplane or whatever. 9/11 was an impressive feat and very very difficult to achieve.
I didn't mean that - the barebones of the operation were sound. The terrorist strategy is sound. In this particular case, what I meant was that a strong, objective leader would have said, "No. This would be a good target but they know you there. You will be identified quickly and your name is all over the documents, this residence and so forth. If we conduct multiple attacks in the same day, we can, maybe, strike this one last in the sequence."
That's what I meant. He impulsively hit this target and was quickly identified, as would have been easily predicted.
This post was edited on 12/3/15 at 3:40 pm
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:34 pm to the808bass
quote:
But it's tougher to radicalize the Muslims there without direct contact. Just my guess.
That and there is just less Muslims outside of bigger urban areas to work with. You need a big recruiting pool to pull out the 1% that will actually carry something out.
I could see them traveling out though to an attack site.
Muslims congregating in Gonzales or something may bring attention to themselves if they set up shop too far beforehand, being they would be noticed for sticking out.
This post was edited on 12/3/15 at 3:39 pm
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:36 pm to Teddy Ruxpin
Less but it only takes a couple 7-11 owners and they are everywhere.
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:38 pm to Langston
quote:
Less but it only takes a couple 7-11 owners and they are everywhere.
Well fortunately for us that requires a 90% radicalization rate of a local group while in the real world, not every Muslim is going to have the determination or will to carry out an attack.
But yes, you could theoretically get one guy somewhere to do something random but that's pretty much true for anything.
This post was edited on 12/3/15 at 3:40 pm
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:39 pm to Ace Midnight
They absolutely came ready to do this. They dropped off the daughter off with grandma stating "they" had Dr appointments. Key word there is "they" meaning that they were both together before this happened.
Time wise there is absolutely no way they could have gotten home, armed/dressed out, and back in that amount of time. His wife was waiting in the suv with all the gear for this attack. He went in to case the scene, and show face at the party that he was expected to be at.
Add in how fast CAIR had a presser with the BIL in attendance, in my mind seems to lean that they knew something was up. This was right after the media released the name of the husband. Too many coincidences.
Time wise there is absolutely no way they could have gotten home, armed/dressed out, and back in that amount of time. His wife was waiting in the suv with all the gear for this attack. He went in to case the scene, and show face at the party that he was expected to be at.
Add in how fast CAIR had a presser with the BIL in attendance, in my mind seems to lean that they knew something was up. This was right after the media released the name of the husband. Too many coincidences.
This post was edited on 12/3/15 at 3:42 pm
Posted on 12/3/15 at 3:40 pm to biohzrd
I haven't seen anyone arguing it wasn't planned anymore.
They are now arguing semantics if it was workplace violence or terror.
It was clearly both.
They are now arguing semantics if it was workplace violence or terror.
It was clearly both.
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