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Started By
Message
re: Could almost anyone born after 1940 fight in WWI
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:28 pm to OMLandshark
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:28 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
I know I'd completely snap in WWI, but in WWII I could at least hold onto what I'm doing is morally righteous.
Thats what civilians never understand, morality has neither jack nor shite with what you could tolerate. Zip.
1
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:29 pm to ThatMakesSense
quote:
The machine gun was out way before WWI.
No where near to the effect that it was in the First World War.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:30 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
But by 1916 the soldiers figured this out for themselves. These people are seeing lifelong friends get annihilated in front of them by the hundreds. This wasn't what they were promised in their youth. I do think their sense of honor was the only thing that held it together. Not many Baby Boomers and their descendants think this.
I'll agree o the honor aspect. And they probably didn't have much of a choice to pack up and leave.
Also, think about the world in the early 20th century...man wants to move around and explore..see new things. There wasn't much going on back in those days. Young men wanted adventure.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:32 pm to OMLandshark
quote:LINK
Gerry Barlow was a 15-year-old who manned an anti-aircraft gun on a Navy carrier.
Barlow is one of an estimated 200,000 underage men and women who ran to enlist during World War II.
Author Ray Jackson, who joined the Marines at 16, has chronicled the history of these young veterans in a book called "America's Youngest Warriors: Stories about Young Men and Women Who Served in the Armed Forces of the United States of America."
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:34 pm to TigerFanInSouthland
quote:
I think you have to look at the mindsets from people that fought WWI differently compared to those that fought WWII and beyond. Especially at the outset of WWI, war was for the most part romanticized in those people's minds. They were brought up on "The Charge of the Light Brigade".
That's kind of my point though, is if someone with a 1945 mindset and beyond would have subjugated themselves to the bullshite that was WWI. I think mostly anyone posting on this forum would reach a breaking point where they would plan to kill their superior officers and/or make a run for it. I'm kind of thinking from a fraternity perspective what we would do if it was say our pledge trainers asking this shite from us on a more national level, and I'm sure it would be an almost unanimous decision to turn on them instead of going to face the Germans (and vice versa from the other side).
quote:
Nobody really knew the power of the artillery, machine guns
They had a preview of these two in the American Civil War and the Russo-Japanese War.
quote:
William Sherman said it best, and while I am in no way, shape, or form a Sherman fanboy, he had it right when he said, "War is hell. And its glory is moonshine."
Great quote.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:35 pm to TigerFanInSouthland
Well said
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:36 pm to TigerFanInSouthland
quote:
No where near to the effect that it was in the First World War.
Ehhhh. Cecil Rhodes commanding the British South Africa Company on what is now, Zimbabwe, mowed down about 50,000 natives using the Maxim Gun during the First Matabele War(1893-1894). Rhodes had 750 men against 80,000. Just for a point of reference.
ETA to say people were unaware of the effects a machine gun would have, especially British, is largely due to no one wanting to hear about that conflict.
This post was edited on 12/5/17 at 6:38 pm
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:37 pm to biglego
quote:
Was there a level of honor? I know about the Xmas truce but aside from that little pause in carnage?
The Christmas Truce was in 1914. They were still talking shite among each other and shouting taunts across the line thinking this was a bloody good time. None of them dreamed this war would last until 1918.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:38 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
The soldiers kind of figured this out in the middle of WWI though. There was a level of honor not really seen at all today by the masses. I think that's the only thing that prevented mass mutinies, outside of Russia of course
Agreed. France was on the cusp of a mutiny near the end of the war. Other armies feared mutiny as well.
The famous Christmas Truce occurred in WWI. That and other smaller truces nearly led to mutinies.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:39 pm to Lakeboy7
quote:
Thats what civilians never understand, morality has neither jack nor shite with what you could tolerate. Zip.
I would have PTSD for sure, but I can't think of a situation in WWII for the Americans where death was as certain as in many WWI battles.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:40 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
Could almost anyone born after 1940 fight in WWI
I doubt it.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:41 pm to Ghost of Colby
quote:
The famous Christmas Truce occurred in WWI. That and other smaller truces nearly led to mutinies.
Yeah, if they allowed the Christmas Truce to happen annually, mutiny would be certain.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:43 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
We knew how evil Hitler and the Japanese were. This was without question worth going to war over.
Such naivete.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:45 pm to ThatMakesSense
quote:
Ehhhh. Cecil Rhodes commanding the British South Africa Company on what is now, Zimbabwe, mowed down about 50,000 natives using the Maxim Gun during the First Matabele War(1893-1894). Rhodes had 750 men against 80,000. Just for a point of reference.
I know what you’re talking about but the Maxim Gun wasn’t used in the same way the machine guns were used in 1914-18. The tactics were different as well as the sheer volume of them.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:46 pm to ChewyDante
quote:
Such naivete.
I'm pretty sure we knew Hitler was a genocidal maniac due to a Jewish refugee crisis and the Rape of Nanking. I'll grant you that Hitler gave us a "hope for the best, fear for the worst" scenario in that going through with the Holocaust directly impedes with his war effort, but not with the Japanese. Tons of journalists and Western Ambassadors witnessed and recorded that, trying to get the Chinese to safety. Nanking was well documented.
This post was edited on 12/5/17 at 7:02 pm
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:48 pm to TigerFanInSouthland
quote:
I know what you’re talking about but the Maxim Gun wasn’t used in the same way the machine guns were used in 1914-18. The tactics were different as well as the sheer volume of them.
Fair enough. 20+ years of the machine gun being used in wars to obliterate is long enough, for anyone following and aware, to realize that it's only going to be more deadly.
Only point I was making.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:49 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
Rape of Nanking.
Well according to social media, it seems daily life in modern America is roughly equivalent to Nanking so I think millennials are pretty tough.
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:51 pm to ThatMakesSense
I gotcha
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:54 pm to CelticDog
Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,
Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,
Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs,
And towards our distant rest began to trudge.
Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots,
But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;
Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots
Of gas-shells dropping softly behind.
Gas! GAS! Quick, boys!—An ecstasy of fumbling
Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time,
But someone still was yelling out and stumbling
And flound’ring like a man in fire or lime.—
Dim through the misty panes and thick green light,
As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.
In all my dreams before my helpless sight,
He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.
If in some smothering dreams, you too could pace
Behind the wagon that we flung him in,
And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,
His hanging face, like a devil’s sick of sin;
If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood
Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,
Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud
Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,—
My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
To children ardent for some desperate glory,
The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est
Pro patria mori.
-Wilfred Owen
Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,
Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs,
And towards our distant rest began to trudge.
Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots,
But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;
Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots
Of gas-shells dropping softly behind.
Gas! GAS! Quick, boys!—An ecstasy of fumbling
Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time,
But someone still was yelling out and stumbling
And flound’ring like a man in fire or lime.—
Dim through the misty panes and thick green light,
As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.
In all my dreams before my helpless sight,
He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.
If in some smothering dreams, you too could pace
Behind the wagon that we flung him in,
And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,
His hanging face, like a devil’s sick of sin;
If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood
Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,
Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud
Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,—
My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
To children ardent for some desperate glory,
The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est
Pro patria mori.
-Wilfred Owen
Posted on 12/5/17 at 6:55 pm to TigerFanInSouthland
It's how you stated earlier. The romance of war, the intrigue, adventure, something new and the patriotism all factor in, no matter what the year, reason or lessons learned through history, it will always be the same.
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