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Message
re: Casualty in the War on Drugs
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:37 am to Artie Rome
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:37 am to Artie Rome
quote:
street level stereotypical drug dealers don't have a skill set to do anything else
So they broke the law to support themselves, and now their industry is made legal, making them obsolete. What are they going to do to support themselves now?
1
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:37 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
They're not crimes? Do you think gang members willing to kill another person would all of the sudden become doctors, lawyers, attorneys, teachers?
i don't care what they become
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:38 am to NIH
That's the problem, chances are they'll become criminals in some other capacity
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:38 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
What are they going to do to support themselves now?
I have absolutely no idea what your point is.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:42 am to Artie Rome
That by taking a way a crime that they break to support themselves, chances are they would just start committing other crimes to support themselves
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:43 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
That by taking a way a crime that they break to support themselves
Why are you advocating making robbery legal? That's retarded.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:43 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
That by taking a way a crime that they break to support themselves, chances are they would just start committing other crimes to support themselves
So just leave everything as is. Got it.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:45 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
That by taking a way a crime that they break to support themselves, chances are they would just start committing other crimes to support themselves
there's no crime as lucrative money wise as drug dealing. none. it also attracts a lot less media attention when you sell a crack rock to Tyrone Biggums than when you rob Capital One Bank.
even if the dealers move to a different crime, they are more likely to get busted as there will be more police focus on violent and major case work.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:49 am to SlowFlowPro
quote:
well a draconian system of punishment, especially for a first offense without any victims, and the ensuing societal scarlet letter of a felony, is kind of a disproportionate price to pay (again, for possessing a natural substance that caused no direct injury to others)
this
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:50 am to NIH
I am just asking what jobs will these guys get. We have a low unemployment rate as it is... a certain percentage of the population will never work...cut out the WOD and I am sure that will involve job losses...stop incarcerating people for illegal drugs will cause jobs.
Like I stated earlier for every action there is an equal or opposite reaction...so where do all these jobs come from to make these criminals stay away from illegal activities? Do we just put more people on welfare?
Like I stated earlier for every action there is an equal or opposite reaction...so where do all these jobs come from to make these criminals stay away from illegal activities? Do we just put more people on welfare?
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:53 am to Topwater Trout
quote:
Like I stated earlier for every action there is an equal or opposite reaction...so where do all these jobs come from to make these criminals stay away from illegal activities
A whole new legal market for growing, manufacturing, packaging, distributing, and selling the formerly illegal drugs would be created. That's one place to start.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:55 am to Topwater Trout
they can live on the streets for all i care
Posted on 7/31/14 at 10:59 am to Topwater Trout
quote:
Do we just put more people on welfare?
It may be cheaper than prison and at least there is a chance, however slight, that they become contributing citizens and perhaps even dads.
It costs an average of $17,500 to keep a man in prison for a year in Louisiana. I don't know that they would receive that in assistance benefits.
Yet another discussion.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 11:10 am to Artie Rome
I am not saying we shouldn't legalize drugs I am only saying there will be impacts that no one has answered what they will be. I personally can't see the common street thug becoming a productive member of society one way or the other.
For many people that are scared to break laws they will never try illegal drugs and can't become addicts...with them being legal i think that will change.
I also asked should all drugs be legal or just select drugs...no real answer given.
For many people that are scared to break laws they will never try illegal drugs and can't become addicts...with them being legal i think that will change.
I also asked should all drugs be legal or just select drugs...no real answer given.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 11:12 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
chances are they'll become criminals in some other capacity
not all dealers are the thug criminal type.
Some just like easy money, like day traders and pyramid schemers.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 11:13 am to Thib-a-doe Tiger
quote:
Isn't overall crime in the US falling?
Yet drug use and abuse has increased
The war on individual liberty hasn't worked. We tried this almost 100 years ago and it failed then.
LINK
quote:
Prohibition, which failed to improve health and virtue in America, can afford some invaluable lessons. First, it can provide some perspective on the current crisis in drug prohibition--a 75-year effort that is increasingly viewed as a failure.
Repeal of Prohibition dramatically reduced crime, including organized crime, and corruption. Jobs were created, and new voluntary efforts, such as Alcoholics Anonymous, which was begun in 1934, succeeded in helping alcoholics. Those lessons can be applied to the current crisis in drug prohibition and the problems of drug abuse. Second, the lessons of Prohibition should be used to curb the urge to prohibit. Neoprohibition of alcohol and prohibition of tobacco would result in more crime, corruption, and dangerous products and increased government control over the average citizen's life. Finally, Prohibition provides a general lesson that society can no more be successfully engineered in the United States than in the Soviet Union.
Prohibition was supposed to be an economic and moral bonanza. Prisons and poorhouses were to be emptied, taxes cut, and social problems eliminated. Productivity was to skyrocket and absenteeism disappear. The economy was to enter a never-ending boom. That utopian outlook was shattered by the stock market crash of 1929. Prohibition did not improve productivity or reduce absenteeism.[55] In contrast, private regulation of employees' drinking improved productivity, reduced absenteeism, and reduced industrial accidents wherever it was tried before, during, and after Prohibition.[56]
In summary, Prohibition did not achieve its goals. Instead, it added to the problems it was intended to solve and supplanted other ways of addressing problems. The only beneficiaries of Prohibition were bootleggers, crime bosses, and the forces of big government. Carroll Wooddy concluded that the "Eighteenth Amendment . . . contributed substantially to the growth of government and of government costs in this period [1915-32]."[57]
In the aftermath of Prohibition, economist Ludwig von Mises wrote, "Once the principle is admitted that it is the duty of government to protect the individual against his own foolishness, no serious objections can be advanced against further encroachments."[58] The repeal of all prohibition of voluntary exchange is as important to the restoration of liberty now as its enactment was to the cause of big government in the Progressive Era
Alcohol use decreased initially, then rose again as supplies increased and prices dropped. During prohibition, average citizens became criminals, government expanded and the prisons didn't depopulate as predicted.
I used to be a big "drug warrior" myself but don't find it surprising people still cling to failed policy.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 11:13 am to Topwater Trout
quote:
try illegal drugs and can't become addicts
people can be addicted to legal drugs? What's the issue?
Some people are addicted to breathing in freon in air duster cans.
Posted on 7/31/14 at 11:13 am to Topwater Trout
quote:
I am only saying there will be impacts that no one has answered what they will be.
whelp, we know what kind of impact the WoD has.
quote:
I also asked should all drugs be legal or just select drugs...no real answer given.
i say all...the government should not be in the business of saving people from themselves. now, what is allowed in a clinic and what is sold over a counter is a different story. i'd probably sell things like weed, mushrooms, and acid over the counter. maybe some party drugs in small amounts. harder drugs in the clinic.
^ basically all the stuff people murder, steal, and suck dick for.
This post was edited on 7/31/14 at 11:15 am
Posted on 7/31/14 at 11:17 am to NIH
quote:
whelp, we know what kind of impact the WoD has.
i have heard everyone talk about the impact it has but w/o knowing what would have happened over the last 30 years we truly do not know if the impact was for the good or bad...do we?
quote:
basically all the stuff people murder, steal, and suck dick for
there goes the $5 crack head bj's
Posted on 7/31/14 at 11:20 am to Topwater Trout
quote:
good or bad...do we?
are you saying we still don't know the impact of the war on drugs?
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