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Message
re: Bill Nye Debates Ken Ham
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:26 am to Cap Crunch
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:26 am to Cap Crunch
quote:
Just because God inspired them to write it down doesn't mean he told them exactly what to write. No matter what God can inspire anyone to do, it doesn't change the fact that we are still human.
So what you are saying is that the Bible is open to interpretation?
So throughout the past few thousand years how many different interpretations of the Bible occurred, how many people who were copying the Bible inserted their own views? So what make you think that the Bible now... is anything like the original manuscripts?
1
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:26 am to Roger Klarvin
quote:
So God is allowing human error to endanger the eternal souls of EVERYONE?
I don't get how you get to this point
quote:
Do you know how many people have stopped believing specifically because of biblical contradictions? This is a HUGE issue.
Of course, but most are a little bit bigger than how many people were there when Jesus resurrected
FWIW, I went to Catholic schools for 13 years and was taught that a lot of old testament stories are just that: Stories
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:27 am to tiger25
Summary of tonight
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:28 am to Cap Crunch
quote:
No, you don't know what a theory is. I saw a great post about this on Reddit yesterday, trying to find it
This will do...
LINK
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:29 am to Lokistale
quote:
So what you are saying is that the Bible is open to interpretation?
So throughout the past few thousand years how many different interpretations of the Bible occurred, how many people who were copying the Bible inserted their own views? So what make you think that the Bible now... is anything like the original manuscripts?
Yes
Its up to critical thinking and logic to determine what should be taken literally and what shouldn't
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:31 am to GeauxTigerTM
I posted it on the last page and it gives a great explanation on the difference between laws and theories
Laws are something that will happen. Gravity is a law. If an apple falls from a tree it will hit the ground
Theories are meant to explain why things happen. For example, why and how evolution occurs
Laws are something that will happen. Gravity is a law. If an apple falls from a tree it will hit the ground
Theories are meant to explain why things happen. For example, why and how evolution occurs
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:33 am to beejon
quote:
I deny Darwinian evolution because there's no evidence for it.
So is there solid evidence for the existence of a Being, this God and his zombie Son?
Solid evidence... like gravity... not faith...
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:34 am to beejon
quote:
There's evidence for gravity. There's absolutely no evidence for Darwinian evolution. None. Zero. Nada
Actually, the only real evidence of gravity is that we experience a force that we call "gravity". We truly have very little idea about what gravity actually IS.
Evolution, on the other hand, can not only be observed in action but we see all the evidence we would expect to see under the model. We see the genetic and structural homology, we see ever increasing genetic similarity as we move up the evolutionary tree, we see (and can even artificially control) the genetic changes that allow for selection to take place, etc.
Without all the effort put into studying evolution, we would not be able to keep up with microbial resistance to drugs.
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:36 am to Cap Crunch
But again, how can I put my faith solely in Jesus if I cant even know which parts of the bible are real, factual truth?
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:36 am to Cap Crunch
quote:
Its up to critical thinking and logic to determine what should be taken literally and what shouldn't
So we could use 'critical thinking and logic' to examine the truth of the Bible, but we should not use critical thinking to look for other explanations of why life exist?
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:36 am to beejon
quote:
There's absolutely no evidence for Darwinian evolution.
Now folks...if that's not a debate ender I'm not sure what is. This position is 100% false, and yet will be defended by simply saying "nuh uh" to any and all examples given.
Feel free to bat this tar baby around if you want, but there's nothing to be gained from it at all.
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:36 am to Cap Crunch
#1. This is the doublespeak that many revert to when discussing Darwinian evolution. Theory doesn't mean theory, evidence doesn't mean evidence, proof doesn't mean proof, yet those very things are demanded of those who believe in intelligent design. Suddenly theory means guess, evidence means evidence, proof means proof.
Theory means guess. Lack of evidence means there's nothing to which one can point to prove a certain viewpoint.
#2. Survival of the fittest doesn't begin to offer evidence, proof, for an increasingly diverse and complex life creation. When the elephant-pine tree split occurred several million years ago (note that this is a guess, a theory), how was that survival of the fittest? Evidence please.
#3. Who's claiming that humans descended from apes?
#4. A joke. Nobody is saying that because no one was there that Darwinian evolution cannot be proven. The truth is, there's no evidence that increasingly varied and complex (tremendously complex) life forms were created strictly by random processes in nature.
#5. Of course Darwin was wrong. Neo-Darwinists will admit that. Something I've asked for several times but never received an answer is for Darwinists to list how Darwin was wrong....and why. And why the errors of Darwin aren't listed and pointed out in school textbooks.
Theory means guess. Lack of evidence means there's nothing to which one can point to prove a certain viewpoint.
#2. Survival of the fittest doesn't begin to offer evidence, proof, for an increasingly diverse and complex life creation. When the elephant-pine tree split occurred several million years ago (note that this is a guess, a theory), how was that survival of the fittest? Evidence please.
#3. Who's claiming that humans descended from apes?
#4. A joke. Nobody is saying that because no one was there that Darwinian evolution cannot be proven. The truth is, there's no evidence that increasingly varied and complex (tremendously complex) life forms were created strictly by random processes in nature.
#5. Of course Darwin was wrong. Neo-Darwinists will admit that. Something I've asked for several times but never received an answer is for Darwinists to list how Darwin was wrong....and why. And why the errors of Darwin aren't listed and pointed out in school textbooks.
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:37 am to Roger Klarvin
I personally view the bible as a guide, not an argument to convince anyone.
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:39 am to Lokistale
quote:
So is there solid evidence for the existence of a Being, this God and his zombie Son?
Solid evidence... like gravity... not faith...
Nope, both Darwinism and belief in God are faith based beliefs. I could present the tremendous variety and infinite complexity of life as evidence for God but that would just be my faith based belief. Others have faith in the creative ability of trillions of random events to create an increasingly varied and infinitely complex life forms.
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:43 am to beejon
quote:
Theory means guess.
When you trot this out, you move from simply being wrong to being an outright liar. It's not that you're ignorant to what a scientific theory is, it's that you think that if you lie about it enough you'll confuse some folks.
If I actually thought my actions were being judged by some deity that held my eternal future in its hands, I'd try not to be such a tool. Or is it ok if you're lying on what you perceive to be his behalf?
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:44 am to beejon
Why do you keep calling evolution random?
Mutations are random, evolution and selection are the very antithesis of random.
Mutations are random, evolution and selection are the very antithesis of random.
This post was edited on 2/5/14 at 12:45 am
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:45 am to beejon
quote:
Theory means guess
Then you really don't want to know all the things you take for granted that are just "theories" in science.
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:45 am to Roger Klarvin
quote:
But again, how can I put my faith solely in Jesus if I cant even know which parts of the bible are real, factual truth?
Well you kinda answered yourself, that's where the faith part comes in
If small details being changed is what makes you not believe, go for it, that's your decision.
I have formed my own beliefs over the length of my life. I don't believe everything the Catholic church teaches. I don't believe everything my parents believe.
My beliefs come from my personal experiences, critical reasoning and thinking, but a lot of it just comes down to faith. That might seem stupid to some, but as I said, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs.
But no religion exists without taking a leap of faith. I have no way of knowing exactly what happened 2000 years ago. But that doesn't mean I can't believe somethings about it.
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:46 am to Lokistale
quote:
So we could use 'critical thinking and logic' to examine the truth of the Bible, but we should not use critical thinking to look for other explanations of why life exist?
I never said we shouldn't
Posted on 2/5/14 at 12:48 am to beejon
quote:
#1. This is the doublespeak that many revert to when discussing Darwinian evolution. Theory doesn't mean theory, evidence doesn't mean evidence, proof doesn't mean proof, yet those very things are demanded of those who believe in intelligent design. Suddenly theory means guess, evidence means evidence, proof means proof.
Theory means guess. Lack of evidence means there's nothing to which one can point to prove a certain viewpoint.
#2. Survival of the fittest doesn't begin to offer evidence, proof, for an increasingly diverse and complex life creation. When the elephant-pine tree split occurred several million years ago (note that this is a guess, a theory), how was that survival of the fittest? Evidence please.
#3. Who's claiming that humans descended from apes?
#4. A joke. Nobody is saying that because no one was there that Darwinian evolution cannot be proven. The truth is, there's no evidence that increasingly varied and complex (tremendously complex) life forms were created strictly by random processes in nature.
#5. Of course Darwin was wrong. Neo-Darwinists will admit that. Something I've asked for several times but never received an answer is for Darwinists to list how Darwin was wrong....and why. And why the errors of Darwin aren't listed and pointed out in school textbooks.
Alright, clearly you're just a troll
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