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re: Astronaut who spent 197 days on the ISS shows how hard it is to walk again

Posted on 3/23/19 at 12:06 pm to
Posted by Ross
Member since Oct 2007
47827 posts
Posted on 3/23/19 at 12:06 pm to
quote:

I think it stems from whether gravity causes the centripetal effect. I think you already acknowledged that it isn't a centripetal force. As I see it, an effect is dependent upon one of the natural forces or gravity, which is also just an effect of mass warping spacetime.


A normal force with a wall or tension can be traced back to a natural force, it just isn't gravity. It's electromagnetic forces found within the chemical bonds that make up the structures holding together the wall and "pushing" on the structures inside of it.

But it isn't gravity.

The only practical example I can think of in which centripetal force is caused by gravitational effects is literally the force of gravity we experience. The Earth is rotating and we are moving with it, and the force keeping us from maintaining our tangential trajectory is the force of gravity, which in this case is one in the same as the centripetal force. But that obviously doesn't mean all centripetal forces are caused by gravity, just that if you have a spinning object, there must be some form of external or internal force keeping the object from flying off on its own trajectory. For Earth, it's gravity. For a ball on a string, it's tension in the string (electromagnetic forces between the chemical bonds making up the string).

quote:

That was the measurement but I would contend that any margin for error in the measuring equipment would negate that as a firm conclusion.



Well you know I have no idea what type of accelerometers they were using but usually space-grade stuff is top notch.

But even if you discounted that one experiment, there is an immense amount of evidence that centripetal acceleration is a phenomena and we know exactly how it is caused and how to quantify it. The only stipulation for artificial gravity is that the rotation that causes it is now taking place in a microgravity environment and not on Earth.
This post was edited on 3/23/19 at 12:20 pm
Posted by Dick Leverage
In The HizHouse
Member since Nov 2013
9000 posts
Posted on 3/23/19 at 3:23 pm to
I see the here and now. I enjoy life on this planet with all that God has created for his creation to enjoy. The future is just....the future. I will be gone at some point and I couldn’t care less about AI that might take the place of humans in 200,500,1000,1500, or 10,000 years. I guess it’s cool to ponder but I feel no obligation to push that agenda forward.

Sorry for being snarly in the previous post. It was uncalled for and just because it’s not important to me doesn’t give me the authority to say that it shouldn’t be important to you.
Posted by DavidTheGnome
Monroe
Member since Apr 2015
31590 posts
Posted on 3/23/19 at 3:35 pm to
quote:

Einstein said that gravity is constant acceleration, and I see how he related the two. For us to exist, that constant acceleration is countered by the electromagnetic force, the strong nuclear force and the two weak nuclear forces. They hold everything together. He used the analogy of a constantly accelerating body to illustrate gravity. A person who is in a spaceship that is constantly accelerating at 1g cannot distinguish between earth’s gravity and the acceleration.



So for the purposes of the effects on the human body isn’t it one in the same? We need the constant effect of acceleration because we’ve evolved that way. Whether that effect comes from falling towards a large mass or rocket engine I wouldn’t think matters.
Posted by Cajunate
Louisiana
Member since Aug 2012
3570 posts
Posted on 3/23/19 at 3:47 pm to
But what is that old dude on the right with the camera? Looks like an alien!
Posted by Ross
Member since Oct 2007
47827 posts
Posted on 3/23/19 at 4:02 pm to
It doesn’t matter if it’s based on gravitational forces or the force of propulsion giving a constant acceleration, but you can’t sustain acceleration into perpetuity due to the theory of relativity stating that your speed can only asymptotically approach the speed of light and you’ll run out of fuel long before that’s even relevant.

That’s why the centripetal force, which only requires constant rotational speed (and therefore much less energy for much longer periods of time) is by far the most viable option to achieve a constant load and the perception of weight on the human body for space travel. Just have to tune the RPM and the radius of curvature and you’d be able to get constant loading similar to what we experience on earth.
This post was edited on 3/23/19 at 4:04 pm
Posted by Cracker
in a box
Member since Nov 2009
19317 posts
Posted on 3/23/19 at 5:20 pm to
Nooooo muscle atrophy has. I thing to do with it.
Posted by CarRamrod
Spurbury, VT
Member since Dec 2006
58613 posts
Posted on 3/24/19 at 8:51 am to
quote:

No, it can't. In weightless conditions, when a cylinder begins to spin, its contents will experience an initial acceleration in the direction of the rotation. However, their speed will catch up with that of the cylinder and they will merely rotate, weightless as ever, with it.
you really don't know about rotation do you.
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