re: Anyone else have friends that "hate" on them for being in college?

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never said it wasnt....They get the hate because they come on here bragging about the 100k when they have to work 80 hours a week to get it.

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Think I saw one guy who did this.

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No. You have to prove you can code, design, etc. Honestly the coding done in schools is shite. You can learn more and better coding on YouTube and forums. You can purchase subscriptions at 1/1000 the cost of a degree that will teach you more in a few months than you'll learn in college. We won't hire directly out of college simply because they went to college. We don't care. If you can code and you can fit into our culture, you'll be hired.

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dork

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I'm sure I am repeating what others have said, but two things. One, it is always better to be a professional, to have an office, be in the A/C, and have a better quality of life. Two, you must hang out with some trash.

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Have worked office jobs and industry jobs and manual labor jobs.

Each have there perks. Office jobs usually don't have daily risks, but are boring as shite. Industry jobs let you get around a lot more and at least get some fresh air. Manual labor is awesome, feel better about yourself, but the pay freaking sucks arse.

Ideally, my goal is for a office job that lets me do site visits. Had it before and honestly nothing compares.

Have heard that is a good gig. Just hate the idea of always having to charge time. Guess there are always ways of working in down time on the clock.

A lot of folks get hung up on the dollar figure but it only tells part of the story. I have a friend who works as an independent AC repair guy here in FL. He proudly boasted that he made $115,000 last year which is admittedly better than I did in terms of actual dollars paid.

I congratulated him for making more than I do. I have a Masters degree and he has no college education. In the back of my mind I know that he earns it by working like a slave including weekends/nights, that he hasnt taken a vacation in the last 3 years since starting his business, his family is completely uninsured and that he has zero retirement savings.

That degree got me amazing health benefits, 6 weeks of paid vacation per year and a 40 hour work week. In the end, he's happy with how his life is going and so am I. To each their own..

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No. You have to prove you can code, design, etc. Honestly the coding done in schools is shite. You can learn more and better coding on YouTube and forums. You can purchase subscriptions at 1/1000 the cost of a degree that will teach you more in a few months than you'll learn in college. We won't hire directly out of college simply because they went to college. We don't care. If you can code and you can fit into our culture, you'll be hired.

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That's all great, but if you don't have a degree in the IT world, your job security is going to be really shaky. Can you make it, sure. But you better be REALLY good at what you do.

But to say it's "the Norm" is crazy. You're not even going to get a look at any decent IT company without a degree.

And everything you said about real experience is true in damn near any field. That said, you still need to get the degree.

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A lot of folks get hung up on the dollar figure but it only tells part of the story. I have a friend who works as an independent AC repair guy here in FL. He proudly boasted that he made $115,000 last year which is admittedly better than I did in terms of actual dollars paid.

I congratulated him for making more than I do. I have a Masters degree and he has no college education. In the back of my mind I know that he earns it by working like a slave including weekends/nights, that he hasnt taken a vacation in the last 3 years since starting his business, his family is completely uninsured and that he has zero retirement savings.

That degree got me amazing health benefits, 6 weeks of paid vacation per year and a 40 hour work week. In the end, he's happy with how his life is going and so am I. To each their own..

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Very true, and my thinking mirrors yours.

I like the security that comes with being a professional and working 40 hours/week in an office setting. It runs parallel to my skillset, demeanor and personality. If manual or plant labor is a better fit for someone else's personality and desired work setting, more power to him or her.

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Consulting

It's great

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no

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I like the security that comes with being a professional and working 40 hours/week in an office setting

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Then you will likely enjoy a much lower ceiling than the business owner slaving now.

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That's all great, but if you don't have a degree in the IT world, your job security is going to be really shaky. Can you make it, sure. But you better be REALLY good at what you do.

But to say it's "the Norm" is crazy. You're not even going to get a look at any decent IT company without a degree.

And everything you said about real experience is true in damn near any field. That said, you still need to get the degree.

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I'm telling you you're flat wrong. Every single company I've worked for had the same hiring rules. Degree is nice, but can you code? Really? Here's a machine, write us x...

And the REASON software companies have adopted this is for the very reason I said. College DOES NOT teach you to code very well. My best advice to any college student is don't rely on the shite projects they give you in school. Go to codeplex or any other open source repository, learn and help out with the projects. You'll learn so much more that way. In fact, open source developers will help you MUCH more than your professors!

A college degree becomes a zero sum game after about 3-5 years of experience. It really doesn't matter after that. That's why most jobs say "a college degree or applicable experience". I don't think I've seen a software job REQUIRE a degree in the past 5 years.

Yes, MAYBE a college degree gets you the interview. But it will not get you the job. I've been part of the hiring process at every job I've had in the past 10 years. We've hired developers with and without degrees.

A software developers job security depends on two things: 1) Can you code? 2) Are you keeping up with professional development?

Do those two things and you're golden. Neglect to keep up to date with technology and you won't last too long.

And what's a "decent" software company? The one I work for is pretty kick arse. We're small but we make money and have zero debt. Been in business for the past 5 years and have grown exponentially every year. That's damn good.

Look at 37signals (well, now it's Basecamp). IMO one of the leading software companies in the US. Look at what they have highlighted here: Not concerned with...

EDIT: Just got this email from a recruiter:

Senior .NET Developer - Targeting 100k or less. Depending on past pay

Job Summary
Candidate must have extensive professional experience in full life cycle software development from design to deployment and maintenance. Superior problem diagnosis/resolution skills are a must. Ideal candidate will have designed and developed in a Web services based environment.
Summary of essential job functions
Successful candidate will have the flexibility to handle multiple projects and shifting priorities as well as have strong communication and documentation skills. Candidate must show commitment to the success of assigned projects, co-workers and the company; have a strong work ethic and be highly motivated with a positive attitude.

Minimum Requirements
• 3 plus years with strong hands on professional programming
• Working knowledge of .NET Web Development tools, ASP.net, C#.Net, WCF, MVC, JQuery
• Working knowledge of MS SQL Server, Visual Studio, SVN or similar

Notice anything missing?