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Started By
Message
re: A perfect memorial for an imperfect man, Ulysses S. Grant
Posted on 3/7/20 at 4:00 pm to Sayre
Posted on 3/7/20 at 4:00 pm to Sayre
quote:
false on the second
You do not know what you are talking about. Grant personally owned a slave before going bankrupt as a farmer in Missouri. He then freed said slave at the old courthouse in St. Louis. The same courthouse where Dred Scott was told to stop whining and get back to work.
0
Posted on 3/7/20 at 4:01 pm to RollTide1987
My favorite Grant story.
When he was on his final train ride home to die.
They stopped at a station. A switchman who minded the station saw General Grant sitting on the train.
The man raised a stump where an arm used to be and said, "General Grant, thank God I seen you again. I lost this one with you at The Wilderness, and I would give the other one to see you well again."
Grant was unable to speak due to his advanced throat cancer. It said he tipped his hat to the man. Then bowed his head and wept.
When he was on his final train ride home to die.
They stopped at a station. A switchman who minded the station saw General Grant sitting on the train.
The man raised a stump where an arm used to be and said, "General Grant, thank God I seen you again. I lost this one with you at The Wilderness, and I would give the other one to see you well again."
Grant was unable to speak due to his advanced throat cancer. It said he tipped his hat to the man. Then bowed his head and wept.
This post was edited on 3/7/20 at 4:03 pm
Posted on 3/7/20 at 4:02 pm to RollTide1987
Hey OP, thanks for providing pictures!
Also Grant sucks. I have more respect for Lee.
Also Grant sucks. I have more respect for Lee.
Posted on 3/7/20 at 5:28 pm to ExtraGravy
quote:
well he beat the Confederates when no other Union general could
Grant took on Lee after cutting the CSA in half by starving out Vicksburg for complete control of the Mississippi at the same time that Lee lost 40% of the ANV at Gettysburg.
Lee inflicted double the casualties on Grant’s forces compared to his casualties during the Overland Campaign with an army half the size of Grant’s.
Think about that.
Posted on 3/7/20 at 5:55 pm to Scoop
quote:
Lee inflicted double the casualties on Grant’s forces compared to his casualties during the Overland Campaign with an army half the size of Grant’s.
Think about that.
That's not that difficult to believe when you take two things into consideration:
1) Lee was fighting on the defensive. As the Civil War showed us time and time again, it is much easier to fight on the defensive than it is on the offensive.
2) Lee's army began utilizing trench warfare on an industrial scale when fighting Grant, which made the offensive even more difficult. Lee got off one good attack against the Army of the Potomac during the Overland Campaign. That was during the second and final day of the Battle of the Wilderness. Lee's forces got massacred in front of Union entrenchments along the Brock Road. The bulk of Lee's 11,000 casualties in that battle likely occurred along that road. So it was perilous for either army to attack the other while it was entrenched.
Despite the higher casualties, Grant kept Lee on the defensive and did not allow him to maneuver his army as other Union commanders had in the past. Lee was constantly reacting to what the Army of the Potomac was doing instead of the opposite - which was par for the course before Grant arrived in theater.
This post was edited on 3/7/20 at 5:57 pm
Posted on 3/7/20 at 6:13 pm to Scoop
quote:
Lee inflicted double the casualties on Grant’s forces compared to his casualties during the Overland Campaign with an army half the size of Grant’s.
Think about that.
Ohhhhhh hell yeah. The South will rise again Brother!! Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeehaw!
Posted on 3/7/20 at 6:17 pm to HM11AU
quote:
Ohhhhhh hell yeah. The South will rise again Brother!! Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeehaw!
Thank you for your well thought out contribution to a discussion regarding military history.
Posted on 3/7/20 at 6:22 pm to Scoop
quote:
Lee inflicted double the casualties on Grant’s forces compared to his casualties during the Overland Campaign with an army half the size of Grant’s.
Think about that.
And still walked away with the L.
Posted on 3/7/20 at 6:23 pm to RollTide1987
quote:
Lee's army began utilizing trench warfare on an industrial scale when fighting Grant, which made the offensive even more difficult. Lee got off one good attack against the Army of the Potomac during the Overland Campaign. That was during the second and final day of the Battle of the Wilderness. Lee's forces got massacred in front of Union entrenchments along the Brock Road. The bulk of Lee's 11,000 casualties in that battle likely occurred along that road. So it was perilous for either army to attack the other while it was entrenched.
Grant was trying to get between Lee and Richmond and Lee got there first to set up defensive positions. That in itself was Lee outdoing Grant.
Posted on 3/7/20 at 6:35 pm to SavageOrangeJug
quote:
My favorite Grant story.
When he was on his final train ride home to die.
They stopped at a station. A switchman who minded the station saw General Grant sitting on the train.
The man raised a stump where an arm used to be and said, "General Grant, thank God I seen you again. I lost this one with you at The Wilderness, and I would give the other one to see you well again."
Grant was unable to speak due to his advanced throat cancer. It said he tipped his hat to the man. Then bowed his head and wept.
A good Grant story told in Ken Burns’ Civil War about his and Sherman’s brief conversation at Shiloh.
Johnston (who was killed) and Beauregard had given them hell all day and in the middle of the night Sherman found Grant under a tree trying to get out of the rain, smoking a cigar, and said something like, “Well, we’ve had the devil’s day, haven’t we Grant?” Grant simply replied, “Yeah, lick em tomorrow though.”
With Johnston’s death, and reinforcements arriving for Grant, that was pretty much the beginning of the end for our Southern ancestors.
Posted on 3/7/20 at 7:45 pm to Strannix
quote:
Grant would have been better off retiring instead of becoming the worst president ever
You misspelled Carter.
Posted on 3/7/20 at 8:05 pm to mdomingue
quote:
Grant would have been better off retiring instead of becoming the worst president ever
quote:
You misspelled Carter.
You both misspelled LBJ and Obama (it's a tie)
Posted on 3/7/20 at 8:09 pm to agdoctor
quote:
Grant had overwhelming forces and supplies. His strategy was he could afford the deaths Lee couldn’t.
Grant is like Zapp Brannigan.
He just threw wave after wave of his own men at the south until they were defeated.
Posted on 3/7/20 at 9:06 pm to Strannix
quote:
He was a drunk and a buffoon
Wrong. Study some non-revisionist history. Yes, he did drink, but was NOT a drunk. He most certainly was not a buffoon.
Sorry Strannix, but you are dead assed wrong on this one.
Posted on 3/7/20 at 10:33 pm to RollTide1987
He was a piece of shite. One of the most scandal-ridden presidencies in history.
Posted on 3/8/20 at 12:27 am to blueboy
Won the war as an American.
Can't say the same for Lee.
Sherman would have made a great PotUS, too.
Can't say the same for Lee.
Sherman would have made a great PotUS, too.
Posted on 3/8/20 at 7:40 pm to Scoop
quote:
Grant was trying to get between Lee and Richmond and Lee got there first to set up defensive positions. That in itself was Lee outdoing Grant.
Not really. It is much easier for a smaller force to move great distances in a short period of time compared to a larger force. Grant had to move slowly enough to allow his supply train to keep up with the army. And this was a big arse supply train. If it would have been allowed to form a single file line unimpeded, it would have stretched from Fredericksburg all the way to Richmond. That's a distance of about 60 miles.
The only reason the Battle of the Wilderness took place in the Wilderness is because the Army of the Potomac had to halt in the thickets to allow their supply wagons to catch up. Lee reacted slowly to Grant's move across the Rapidan. Had Grant taken a firmer hand with Meade/Humphries from day one, the Union army would have gotten behind Lee on day one of the campaign.
This post was edited on 3/8/20 at 7:43 pm
Posted on 3/8/20 at 7:47 pm to RollTide1987
I grew up three blocks from Grant's forward observation post for the battle of Missionary Ridge.
Orchard Knob Ave. was the cross street with my block.
Orchard Knob
Orchard Knob Ave. was the cross street with my block.
Orchard Knob
Posted on 3/8/20 at 8:10 pm to agdoctor
quote:
Grant had overwhelming forces and supplies. His strategy was he could afford the deaths Lee couldn’t. He was correct. Previous Generals couldn’t stomach the slaughter. Staying drink made Grant immune
Grant lost less men than Lee during their battles.
And he didn't drink a drop during the civil war.
Lost Cause history is fake news.
Posted on 3/8/20 at 8:24 pm to magildachunks
quote:
And he didn't drink a drop during the civil war.
Wrong!
"Grant" by Ron Chernow. The book praises Grant but also documents the general’s drinking bouts.
“Liquor seemed a virulent poison to him, and yet he had a fierce desire for it,” one military officer said. After one glass of liquor, Grant’s speech would become slurred, “and two or three would make him stupid.” But another official said Grant never drank when it might imperil his army.
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