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Started By
Message
re: $9.6M "stolen" by "cheating" at casino
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:04 am to Robin Masters
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:04 am to Robin Masters
quote:
Dude cheated plain and simple. Call it "outwitting" or whatever you want but he knew what the cards were and used it to his advantage. If you were playing Phil and he used this to beat you instead of skill you'd call it cheating too.
And they knew as well. Their JOB is to know the cards he asked to use. There are literally people there for only that reason. Same with dice. They are supposed to rigorously inspect any objects put into play. There are strict protocols.
quote:
If you were playing Phil and he used this to beat you instead of skill you'd call it cheating too.
How is knowing how to inspect cards not a skill? The casino had the same opportunity and they had EVERY opportunity to deny his request or not deal to him....it is on them.
Now, if he walked in and pulled a deck out of his pocket and said, let's use these,....then yes, I see your point. The cards were at the casino and therefore they were the casino's responsibility.
1
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:29 am to GeeOH
quote:
And they knew as well. Their JOB is to know the cards he asked to use. There are literally people there for only that reason. Same with dice. They are supposed to rigorously inspect any objects put into play. There are strict protocols.
Having strict protocols to catch cheaters does not make cheating acceptable if they don't catch you.
quote:
How is knowing how to inspect cards not a skill? The casino had the same opportunity and they had EVERY opportunity to deny his request or not deal to him....it is on them.
Now, if he walked in and pulled a deck out of his pocket and said, let's use these,....then yes, I see your point. The cards were at the casino and therefore they were the casino's responsibility.
Because the casino didn't catch him cheating its on them? He exploited a flaw to cheat. Doesn't matter who should have fixed the flaw, it's still cheating. Rationalize it anyway you want but it's cheating.
If Nick Saban found a way to decipher LSUs calls before you ran them you better believe EVERYONE on the planet would call that cheating.
This post was edited on 10/9/14 at 8:32 am
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:34 am to Robin Masters
You might actually be the dumbest poster here.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:36 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
You might actually be the dumbest poster here.
Be that as it may, it's still cheating. Also, the British courts agree with me and I'd bet the NJ courts will as well.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:36 am to Robin Masters
quote:
Also, the British courts agree with me and I'd bet the NJ courts will as well.
You say this as if it means something. Are are you one of these types that think courts get everything right 100% of the time?
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:39 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
You say this as if it means something. Are are you one of these types that think courts get everything right 100% of the time?
I'm one of those people that knows it doesn't matter what you or anyone thinks is "right or wrong". What matters is what the law says and what you can prove. Your opinion isn't worth dick, big boys and girls have to deal in reality.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:41 am to Robin Masters
quote:
I'm one of those people that knows it doesn't matter what you or anyone thinks is "right or wrong". What matters is what the law says and what you can prove. Your opinion isn't worth dick, big boys and girls have to deal in reality.
Ok, so since some corrupt politician says it's cheating, it's cheating. Thanks for validating my other post about you.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:43 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
Ok, so since some corrupt politician says it's cheating, it's cheating. Thanks for validating my other post about you.
What the hell are you talking about? What corrupt politician? Prove they were corrupt. You just talk shite and have nothing to back it up.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:47 am to twoliter
By the casino's logic it cheats everytime a customer overimbibes, creating a "defect" in his ability to reason.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:50 am to Robin Masters
quote:
Robin Masters
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:51 am to Tallerthansaban
Are you sure the same betting strategy would apply to baccarat - or however you spell it - as it does with counting cards in blackjack?
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:52 am to Robin Masters
Children. Children. Everybody calm down, shake hands and go back out on the playground. I watched this on 60 Minutes Sports last night and was undecided until they revealed how Ivey pre-requested all of the details. Like card type, dealer ethnicity, companion, etc.
Those conditions actually tilted me to be in his corner. If the casino was so greedy that they couldn't see what was coming once he made those specific requests then it is on them. When he requested the card brand, you better believe I would have looked into that. I also like how they didn't complain until after he whipped their asses. If he had lost, they wouldn't have minded his techniques one bit.
Those conditions actually tilted me to be in his corner. If the casino was so greedy that they couldn't see what was coming once he made those specific requests then it is on them. When he requested the card brand, you better believe I would have looked into that. I also like how they didn't complain until after he whipped their asses. If he had lost, they wouldn't have minded his techniques one bit.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 8:53 am to Robin Masters
quote:
What corrupt politician?
Are there non-corrupt politicians?
quote:
You just talk shite and have nothing to back it up.
Says the guy who says a court said so therefore it must be right.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 9:01 am to jbgleason
quote:
Those conditions actually tilted me to be in his corner. If the casino was so greedy that they couldn't see what was coming once he made those specific requests then it is on them. When he requested the card brand, you better believe I would have looked into that. I also like how they didn't complain until after he whipped their asses. If he had lost, they wouldn't have minded his techniques one bit.
So cheating is OK as long as they don't catch you first? Gotctya.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 9:02 am to Robin Masters
quote:
So cheating
You've yet to explain how it is cheating since the casino knew the terms Ivey wanted to play with and agreed to them. Phil hid nothing from them.
That doesn't fit any definition of cheating no matter how many times you claim it does.
ETA: I guess I should claim the casino is cheating any time I lose. I mean they set up the terms of the game I agreed to play, so clearly they cheated me out of my money.
See how stupid that sounds?
This post was edited on 10/9/14 at 9:04 am
Posted on 10/9/14 at 9:03 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
Says the guy who says a court said so therefore it must be right.
Courts opinion vs the opinion of anonymous message board poster?
Yeah, I think the courts opinion will be a little more valid.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 9:04 am to Robin Masters
quote:
Yeah, I think the courts opinion will be a little more valid.
I bet it would blow your mind if an appeal is won on this. One court said one thing, and another said something different.
How will your pea brain process that?
Posted on 10/9/14 at 9:08 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
You've yet to explain how it is cheating since the casino knew the terms Ivey wanted to play with and agreed to them. Phil hid nothing from them.
That doesn't fit any definition of cheating no matter how many times you claim it does.
Ive already posted the NJ statute on cheating in this thread. Pretty clear that what Ivey engaged in was a "fraudulent scheme" as evidenced by his careful selection of playing partners, card brand and dealers, oh and his knowledge of what the cards were. It is the responsibility of citizens to know the law so actually Ivey should have known what he was doing was wrong. The courts have a long history of siding with the casinos when there are errors in the machines/equipment.
Posted on 10/9/14 at 9:13 am to Robin Masters
I don't play cards in casinos, but does asking a dealer to flip cards a certain way or shuffle only one way as to align all the cards not tip a dealer off to something?
Does that happen frequently at tables? Superstition?
Does that happen frequently at tables? Superstition?
Posted on 10/9/14 at 9:13 am to LNCHBOX
quote:
I bet it would blow your mind if an appeal is won on this. One court said one thing, and another said something different.
How will your pea brain process that?
What is the basis for appeal?
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