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re: 2 pleas of no contest and 1 cooperating with DA in LSU Phi Delt hazing case
Posted on 9/6/18 at 1:44 pm to YeahYeah
Posted on 9/6/18 at 1:44 pm to YeahYeah
quote:
But in all seriousness there needs to be jail time for those involved
I dont have a lot of sympathy for someone who drinks himself to death. Short of these guys literally holding him down I am not sure I see a crime here.
1
Posted on 9/6/18 at 1:50 pm to Sneaky__Sally
quote:
Personal responsibility played a part, on both sides. One person has already paid with his life - the other person/people who didn't consider responsibility to the person he was in a position of authority over resulting in that persons death should face pretty severe consequences.
I point the finger at this crazy system of "semi-adults" where we call 18 year old adults children, then act thoroughly shocked when they start acting like children.
18 years are fully capable of acting like adults, perhaps its time we start treating them as such. I realize this is a startling idea to some on this board.
Posted on 9/6/18 at 1:52 pm to NYNolaguy1
quote:
Short of these guys literally holding him down I am not sure I see a crime here.
This- buncha snowflakes up in here.. "Send them to Angola", BS. This kid drank himself to death, some 21 yr old kids bought the alcohol and they felt the heat so they got together and blamed a 19 old. Now you fairies want to put them all in jail so you feel better about an idiot that drank so much he died. I'm sorry he was an idiot, but you can't hold a bunch of drunk 19-21 yr old guys responsible for someone drinking too much. THEY WERE DRUNK TOO!!!
Posted on 9/6/18 at 1:57 pm to Sneaky__Sally
I can't argue with much of what you have said. They will be held accountable.
To what extent the jury will have to decide. I just think it's not going to be as severe as many on this board are hoping for.
To what extent the jury will have to decide. I just think it's not going to be as severe as many on this board are hoping for.
Posted on 9/6/18 at 2:00 pm to tigbob
quote:
How about getting serious about this and drop a few in jail and see if it subsides!
Serious question. Back in my day we had Hell Week. All kinds of crazy shite went on but my specific part was that I got the pledges up every morning for a fun run around sorority row with some push-ups, sit ups and other PT included. It was a group morale builder and I did everything with the pledge class. The chapter Big Sisters would come out to the street with water and some of their pledges and yell shite at our guys.
If one of the pledges had dropped dead from a heart attack, should I have gone to jail? The idea of worrying about a pre-existing medical condition or heat-related illness frankly never entered our minds.
Posted on 9/6/18 at 2:06 pm to jbgleason
quote:
If one of the pledges had dropped dead from a heart attack, should I have gone to jail?
I'm not really sure where I stand on these kids being charged in criminal court, but the situation you described is not the same as supplying (and/or forcing?) alcohol to a minor who ends up dying
Posted on 9/6/18 at 2:14 pm to jchamil
quote:
alcohol to a minor who ends up dying
Just a small point of order- can we please stop calling 18+ year olds minors? They are adults. Thank you.
Posted on 9/6/18 at 2:32 pm to NYNolaguy1
quote:
NYNolaguy1
Just a small point of order- can we please stop calling 18+ year olds minors? They are adults. Thank you.
In support of the above...
quote:
Age of Majority in Louisiana
The age at which an individual is considered an adult in the eyes of the law, or the "age of majority," is 18 in most states, including Louisiana.
Posted on 9/6/18 at 2:41 pm to jchamil
quote:
I'm not really sure where I stand on these kids being charged in criminal court, but the situation you described is not the same as supplying (and/or forcing?) alcohol to a minor who ends up dying
It may not seem the same but it IS given the language of the anti-hazing knee jerk law they just passed. ANY hazing resulting in an injury is a criminal act and there can be little doubt that a "forced" morning run would be considered hazing. Hell, you can't make a pledge drive to the store and pick you up a coke these days.
Posted on 9/6/18 at 2:55 pm to jbgleason
Doing some group PT is different than telling an 18 year old to drink a shitload of everclear, continuing after he was noticeably drunk and then not realizing his situation was in need of help. Its the position of authority in which it becomes a problem.
In your example, if it was exceptionally hot and you had them out the for hours with no water OR if people were puking and falling out and you kept going and then someone died - then that would be worth charging someone IMO.
But the real point is that lots of random 19 year old kids don't know enough to be on the lookout for signs of a dangerous situation - and the fraternity system doesn't make an effort to make sure they are educated or the right people are around in these situations. Even if they did, it would be very difficult to police.
In your example, if it was exceptionally hot and you had them out the for hours with no water OR if people were puking and falling out and you kept going and then someone died - then that would be worth charging someone IMO.
But the real point is that lots of random 19 year old kids don't know enough to be on the lookout for signs of a dangerous situation - and the fraternity system doesn't make an effort to make sure they are educated or the right people are around in these situations. Even if they did, it would be very difficult to police.
Posted on 9/6/18 at 3:09 pm to NYNolaguy1
quote:
Just a small point of order- can we please stop calling 18+ year olds minors? They are adults. Thank you.
Ok, underaged adult. Better?
Posted on 9/6/18 at 3:12 pm to Maynard James Keenan
making pledges chug 190 proof. What the frick did these idiots think would happen?
Posted on 9/6/18 at 3:16 pm to Dizz
quote:
I don't think anyone joins a fraternity thinking members will keep their mouths shut and go to prison, it isn't the mob.
you obviously pledged Acacia.
Posted on 9/7/18 at 4:27 pm to tigerinthebueche
quote:
you obviously pledged AGacia.
Posted on 9/7/18 at 4:41 pm to Stexas
quote:
This- buncha snowflakes up in here..
I got to a point where I was pissed off and lost it to where no one was making me do anything without a fight. I got talked down but I think I would have been throwing up too much before getting alcohol poisioning or told them to fug right off.
Though I never really did anything harmful or as potentially harmful to anyone pledging while active although I do recall a couple of incidents on the periphery.
Now that I have a son that I love more than my own life, I will definitely instill in him the idea of being independent, even if he is within the framework of a greek organization or not.
Not sure what to do with these guys. Is "hazing" against the law? it's surely against national rules. If hazing in and of itself is against the law, I would look at it somewhat like a drunk driver getting someone called riding with them, except the driver and others insisted with threat of physical harm to coerce the person get in the car.
This post was edited on 9/7/18 at 4:43 pm
Posted on 9/7/18 at 4:43 pm to Sneaky__Sally
quote:
Doing some group PT
If you're on a sports team or in basic training, you've had a physical and have been cleared for strenuous activity. Slapdick Chauncey doesn't know about your undiagnosed heart condition when he tells you to knock put 25 pushups for not knowing the 8th letter of the Greek alphabet.
Just saying there's some risk to all this stuff, albeit small.
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