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What/Who should we aim for in a BI trade?
Posted on 1/23/25 at 1:41 pm
Posted on 1/23/25 at 1:41 pm
As we approach the deadline, I wanted to start the discussion of different BI trade configurations and goals. Looking to next year, main pieces I do not expect to move are:
PG- Murray/ Jose
SG- Herb/ (CJ)/ Hawkins
SF- Trey/ Boston
PF- Zion
C- Missi
And I think that’s a great start. I could easily see Green as a 31 year old expiring traded for a second as we try to replenish. And we will see on CJ. The guy is just too good as compared to any expected return. I’m starting to almost lock in the idea that he will be staying. But he is next most likely.
BI has to move. Trey is locked up and has entrenched himself as a starter IMO. And defensively and financially, I don’t think you can have Trey and BI.
So all that being said, sure, we all hope for draft capital, but what are some players and positions that would make sense?
For starters, I would really focus on bigger players. 4’s and 5’s ideally. I love John Collins for us. Jonathan Isaac. Lonzo Ball and his bird rights maybe. Robert Williams. Thoughts?
PG- Murray/ Jose
SG- Herb/ (CJ)/ Hawkins
SF- Trey/ Boston
PF- Zion
C- Missi
And I think that’s a great start. I could easily see Green as a 31 year old expiring traded for a second as we try to replenish. And we will see on CJ. The guy is just too good as compared to any expected return. I’m starting to almost lock in the idea that he will be staying. But he is next most likely.
BI has to move. Trey is locked up and has entrenched himself as a starter IMO. And defensively and financially, I don’t think you can have Trey and BI.
So all that being said, sure, we all hope for draft capital, but what are some players and positions that would make sense?
For starters, I would really focus on bigger players. 4’s and 5’s ideally. I love John Collins for us. Jonathan Isaac. Lonzo Ball and his bird rights maybe. Robert Williams. Thoughts?
Posted on 1/23/25 at 2:01 pm to PELsu
If we are trading him at the deadline (which we absolutely should) then we should be aiming to get a return simliar to what Toronto got last year for Siakam.
Bruce Brown (energetic bench player)
Jordan Nwora (who probably didn't hold any value)
2 late 1sts in that upcoming draft
1 future first top 4 protected from Indy
We should be getting back at least 2 1sts in any BI trade if there aren't any good players in it. And if we aren't getting that, then simply don't trade him and see what you can get in the offseason, and if you can't get anything, then you just dont' resign him and lose him for nothing, which won't happen but that's worse case.
I think we should be looking at swapping BI for MPJ
or
to the Pistons for Stewart and 2 1sts
or
to the Magic for Isaac and Anthony Black and a 1st
or
to the Spurs for Johnson, Collins and Champagnie and 2 1sts (Theis and Green go out too)
or
to the Jazz for John Collins and 3 1sts
Bruce Brown (energetic bench player)
Jordan Nwora (who probably didn't hold any value)
2 late 1sts in that upcoming draft
1 future first top 4 protected from Indy
We should be getting back at least 2 1sts in any BI trade if there aren't any good players in it. And if we aren't getting that, then simply don't trade him and see what you can get in the offseason, and if you can't get anything, then you just dont' resign him and lose him for nothing, which won't happen but that's worse case.
I think we should be looking at swapping BI for MPJ
or
to the Pistons for Stewart and 2 1sts
or
to the Magic for Isaac and Anthony Black and a 1st
or
to the Spurs for Johnson, Collins and Champagnie and 2 1sts (Theis and Green go out too)
or
to the Jazz for John Collins and 3 1sts
This post was edited on 1/23/25 at 2:04 pm
Posted on 1/23/25 at 2:15 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
If we are trading him at the deadline (which we absolutely should) then we should be aiming to get a return simliar to what Toronto got last year for Siakam.
I hope you are right, but I seriously doubt anyone is trading anything close to that value for BI.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 2:22 pm to PELsu
what would a package of Zion and BI bring?
Posted on 1/23/25 at 2:28 pm to TeddyPadillac
I unfortunately do not expect us to get a Siakim type return. A first is a must, and I hope to get two. But the market just isn’t the same, hence why I think the players coming back is important. I want to know we have a 2025/2026 rotational player on top of whatever picks we can negotiate. If not two.
John Collins is the most interesting to me as a true backup to Zion finally, but also a guy that can maybe finish at the 5 in a smaller lineup. A more offensive Larry Nance if you will.
Isaac is having a very down year, but he could play the same role, and is under contract at a very modest amount moving forward.
The available cap space in FA is so sparse, I don’t think we should shy away from expiring deals for a guy that fits. I like Lonzo because he can play the wing off the bench, but also step in as a starting PG instead of asking too much from Jose. Long shot, but he and Zion fit like a glove.
Robert Williams as a backup big that could maybe take over starting role or maybe just finishing role. LA guy and low cost. Brings a lot of the things Missi does, but more experienced and better passer. Has to be healthy of course.
Many more just the ones that jump out first to me
John Collins is the most interesting to me as a true backup to Zion finally, but also a guy that can maybe finish at the 5 in a smaller lineup. A more offensive Larry Nance if you will.
Isaac is having a very down year, but he could play the same role, and is under contract at a very modest amount moving forward.
The available cap space in FA is so sparse, I don’t think we should shy away from expiring deals for a guy that fits. I like Lonzo because he can play the wing off the bench, but also step in as a starting PG instead of asking too much from Jose. Long shot, but he and Zion fit like a glove.
Robert Williams as a backup big that could maybe take over starting role or maybe just finishing role. LA guy and low cost. Brings a lot of the things Missi does, but more experienced and better passer. Has to be healthy of course.
Many more just the ones that jump out first to me
Posted on 1/23/25 at 2:51 pm to PELsu
Missi has been an awesome surprise, but getting Walker Kessler would be my priority. His improvement in ft and 3 pt shooting probably make him even more difficult to get, but that is the blueprint return for me. If BI is traded, i want a young, cheap, defensive big.
BTW, I still think Ingram would make an awesome Manu Ginobli/Andre Igoudala, jack of all trades, type player if he ever committed to it. But that's about as likely as Gayle Benson paying for a 2nd apron team.
I'm resigned to simply hoping we don't take significant future money for a perimeter player who gets us just under the tax for this year.
BTW, I still think Ingram would make an awesome Manu Ginobli/Andre Igoudala, jack of all trades, type player if he ever committed to it. But that's about as likely as Gayle Benson paying for a 2nd apron team.
I'm resigned to simply hoping we don't take significant future money for a perimeter player who gets us just under the tax for this year.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 3:03 pm to PELsu
XL bag of skittles, if they offer a regular bag I’m out
Posted on 1/23/25 at 3:11 pm to mhasen1
Love Kessler but have convinced myself he’s probably not available. Spit balling other possible names with varying interest…..
Bobby Portis
Patrick Williams (pass)
Vucevic
Dayron Sharpe
Isaiah Stewart
Clint Capella
Nikola Jovic
Brandon Clarke (if Memphis made a big move)
Jared Vanderbilt
Daniel Gafford
Naz Reid
Kevon Looney
Harrison Barnes
Duop Reath
Again, multi team BI trades where we end up with a 4 or 5 in our rotation for next year, plus picks.
Bobby Portis
Patrick Williams (pass)
Vucevic
Dayron Sharpe
Isaiah Stewart
Clint Capella
Nikola Jovic
Brandon Clarke (if Memphis made a big move)
Jared Vanderbilt
Daniel Gafford
Naz Reid
Kevon Looney
Harrison Barnes
Duop Reath
Again, multi team BI trades where we end up with a 4 or 5 in our rotation for next year, plus picks.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 3:30 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
If we are trading him at the deadline (which we absolutely should) then we should be aiming to get a return simliar to what Toronto got last year for Siakam.
Hope I’m wrong but I think you are going to be severely disappointed.
Still remember when the board thought BI held more value than Murray in the offseason. I doubt we can get a package like we gave the hawks.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 3:35 pm to mhasen1
quote:
His improvement in ft and 3 pt shooting probably make him even more difficult to get, but that is the blueprint return for me.
What?
he's taken 4 threes this year. He hasn't shown improvement in something he doesn't do.
54% from the FT line this year. It's not improvement, and even if it was, it's still horrible.
After getting to watch Kessler, i'm not interested in him. I get what they say about him setting picks. He sucks at it, and he's only capable of playing drop coverage on defense, and while he's a great rim protector, that simply doesn't work in the playoffs (see Gobert every single time in the playoffs). The 5 we are looking for is someone who can provide some perimeter defense if he has to switch, or at least hedge enough to slow the ball handler down and then recover back to his man.
I wouldn't be upset about getting him, but he's not the guy i'm targeting to play the 5 with Missi for the future.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 3:37 pm to PELsu
quote:
Spit balling other possible names with varying interest…..
With the exception of Williams and Barnes, I like the list based on fit/contract. But it totally depends on the balance of the trade. This is the level where it might make sense to wait for the offseason
For example, I'd be very happy with Ingram for Portis and a 2nd if Milwaukee was able to send players elsewhere and we only took back 12 million. But if we're taking back 34 million and losing future manueverability and roster spots, it would be worse than letting Ingram expire.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 3:38 pm to PELsu
Hope I'm wrong...but...I think most folks around here have BI rated FAR higher than the rest of the NBA does. Of course, it only takes ONE team to think BI would be a great addition for them in his current situation...to make our return for BI much better than I currently think it will end up being.
As I said...hope I'm wrong.
As I said...hope I'm wrong.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 3:40 pm to TeddyPadillac
Drop coverage can work in the playoffs. Just see championships by the likes of Jokic with the Nuggets and Brook Lopez with the Bucks, etc. Rim protection and rebounding still goes a long way. I know Shamit was just talking about how the numbers don’t really back up the “switchable bigs”. That being said, I do share concerns regarding Kessler. And while it sounds stupid, I do think screen setting from a big is a big deal.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 3:43 pm to mhasen1
It’s not impossible for us to wait until the offseason, but I think we should all be cautious with that idea. A trade in the next two weeks can bring back expirings that won’t be on the books for next season. A trade in the offseason will almost certainly return 2025/2026 salaries to some extent. And sign and trades very rarely return anything worthwhile. It’s very much in our best interest to get something done now.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 3:45 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
What?
he's taken 4 threes this year. He hasn't shown improvement in something he doesn't do.
54% from the FT line this year. It's not improvement, and even if it was, it's still horrible.
He couldn't hit the backboard 2 years ago. Now his shot looks normal.
It doesn't matter though because he is very unlikely to be available
Posted on 1/23/25 at 3:49 pm to mhasen1
He's going to be up for a new contract soon, so that's the biggest roadblock and the reason why Utah wants to move him and why no team is giving up anything close to their asking price.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 4:00 pm to PELsu
quote:
Just see championships by the likes of Jokic with the Nuggets and Brook Lopez with the Bucks,
Both of those guys are much better defenders than Kessler, and are surrounded by better defenders as well.
Having Giannis looming around with his 7'3" wingspan is why Brook Lopez doens't get exposed more.
Jokic moves his feet better than people think, and you can't just take him 1 on 1 just b/c you got the switch, especially in the playoffs when he really starts trying.
I want a big that can be some sort of threat from 3 more than anything.
Jonathan Isaac is what we need, assuming he's just having some slump this year due to some injury woe, although i'm sure if we traded for him he'd likely have some career ending injury.
He was #1 in the league last year at defending FG% within 6' of the basket, and defensive eFG% in isolation. And I think we could get 3-4 threes a game out of him hitting around 38%.
all this stupid 40 threes a game talk can be achieved the right way by finding a backup 4 and backup 5 that actually shoots 3's. We can't play with a starting 4 and 5, as well as their backups and get only 2-3 3's a game from those 4 guys and expect everyone else to throw up 38 threes.
This post was edited on 1/23/25 at 4:08 pm
Posted on 1/23/25 at 4:15 pm to TeddyPadillac
quote:
Jonathan Isaac is what we need,
Orlando will trade him right after they trade Paolo. They turned down 1st round picks for him when they didn't even know if he would ever play again.
Posted on 1/23/25 at 4:40 pm to mhasen1
quote:
Orlando will trade him right after they trade Paolo. They turned down 1st round picks for him when they didn't even know if he would ever play again.

He plays 16mpg for them, even with Paolo and Franz hurt, and he's having a down year. He's a backup 4.
They'd trade him for BI in a heartbeat.
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