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The Athletic: Pels lineup most disappointing in the league?
Posted on 3/14/23 at 2:58 am
Posted on 3/14/23 at 2:58 am
Analyzing the most used lineups for every NBA team, The Athletic noted this:
————
Lineup: CJ McCollum | Trey Murphy III | Brandon Ingram | Herb Jones | Jonas Valanciunas
Stats: 142 minutes | -20.6 net rating | 107.3 offensive rating | 127.9 defensive rating
I am stunned at how bad this lineup has been this season. The Pelicans have dealt with a ton of missed games, and you?d love to see Zion Williamson be in their heaviest used lineups. That?s just not the case. This is their most used lineup. Just 18 games and 142 minutes. And it?s been atrocious. There is too much talent in this lineup to be this bad. The defense shouldn?t be that bad. Neither should the offense. The Pelicans have spiraled out as the season has gone on, and they don?t get a rush of health to make it easier. But this lineup is one of the most disappointing in basketball.
————
Lineup: CJ McCollum | Trey Murphy III | Brandon Ingram | Herb Jones | Jonas Valanciunas
Stats: 142 minutes | -20.6 net rating | 107.3 offensive rating | 127.9 defensive rating
I am stunned at how bad this lineup has been this season. The Pelicans have dealt with a ton of missed games, and you?d love to see Zion Williamson be in their heaviest used lineups. That?s just not the case. This is their most used lineup. Just 18 games and 142 minutes. And it?s been atrocious. There is too much talent in this lineup to be this bad. The defense shouldn?t be that bad. Neither should the offense. The Pelicans have spiraled out as the season has gone on, and they don?t get a rush of health to make it easier. But this lineup is one of the most disappointing in basketball.
This post was edited on 3/14/23 at 4:43 am
Posted on 3/14/23 at 3:31 am to New City Champ
quote:
I am stunned at how bad this lineup has been this season
Lines up with the eye test, this unit gives up e-z buckets, particularly in the paint. Asking Herb or TM3 to play the PF with Val backing them never was a good idea, yet Pels continued to run with it and lost at least six winnable games during the losing streak.
No matter the dog in them, you cant give up 20-45lbs nightly at the 4 on top an imobile 5 to help protect the paint. Having CJ guard the point doesn’t help matters as the defense at the top was also easily compromised. Losing Nance and Dyson to injuries hurt a lot worse than is let on.
Folks pointing out the shooting woes have valid concerns, but pulling the ball out of the net and having to face set defenses constantly is just as much, if not more, attributable to the Pels offensive woes during the period, particularly with this lineup.
Posted on 3/14/23 at 5:34 am to Pistol44
quote:
No matter the dog in them, you cant give up 20-45lbs nightly at the 4 on top an imobile 5 to help protect the paint. Having CJ guard the point doesn’t help matters as the defense at the top was also easily compromised.
100%
Posted on 3/14/23 at 6:31 am to New City Champ
quote:
The defense shouldn?t be that bad.
Based on what?
It was always going to be a problem with the first unit if your plan was "Herb guard the ball and everyone else take notes"
Posted on 3/14/23 at 6:48 am to New City Champ
quote:
But this lineup is one of the most disappointing in basketball.
HeAin'tLying.jpg
Posted on 3/14/23 at 7:23 am to New City Champ
Now replace Jonas with Nance and that same lineup jumps to a +4.3
Still not great, but that is a 24 net rating swing. Defensive rating drops to 105 and off rating climbs to 110.
Still not great, but that is a 24 net rating swing. Defensive rating drops to 105 and off rating climbs to 110.
This post was edited on 3/14/23 at 7:24 am
Posted on 3/14/23 at 7:26 am to Bronc
I just don’t get how a team with Zion goes multiple years without a backup PF on the roster. That is hall of fame negligence.
Posted on 3/14/23 at 7:28 am to PELsu
quote:
I just don’t get how a team with Zion goes multiple years without a backup PF on the roster. That is hall of fame negligence.
Whats frustrating is we had Lonzo for Lauri Markkannen all lined up and Griff recoiled and ended up taking Temple and Sato in it's place, then gave up a first for Graham, who required assets to get off a season later.
Also, not sure why we refuse to use the Hayes/Val combo that was a +8 last season. We literally have 0 minutes with that lineup on the court this year. Despite it being the obvious way of bringing size and overcompensating for the lack of rim protection by using Jax in a free safety type of role.
This post was edited on 3/14/23 at 7:33 am
Posted on 3/14/23 at 8:18 am to Bronc
quote:
we had Lonzo for Lauri Markkannen all lined up
I’ve heard the money/cap reason on this and we have the benefit of hindsight on Lauri’s Allstar season, but I struggle to figure out what Griff thought the alternative plan was instead.
Trey had always been a guy that played smaller than his size (he is doing better than ever this year but still), BI certainly isn’t known as a banger or some defensive stalwart, and that leaves Herb, who is only about 200lbs and although he can play some spot minutes out of position, he is clearly not going to be an effective PF in extended minutes against physical opponents. All 3 of those guys are really SG/SFs. Naji is a SF as well. Temple, nope, another SF.
Everyone else is either under 6’3” or Willy only plays them as a 5…what was Griff’s plan?
Posted on 3/14/23 at 8:24 am to Bronc
That’s not even getting into the fact that Lonzo being on the roster stopped us from taking Darius Garland. Just a brutal series of events.
Posted on 3/14/23 at 8:27 am to BamaPelican
quote:
I’ve heard the money/cap reason on this and we have the benefit of hindsight on Lauri’s Allstar season, but I struggle to figure out what Griff thought the alternative plan was instead.
The money/cap argument only really makes sense if you were going to get a big fish in FA, which, thankfully we didn't hit our targets cause this era would have been dead before it started if Lowry had accepted our monster offer.
Even if Lauri was a rental he'd be a movable one come the deadline.
Posted on 3/14/23 at 8:30 am to PELsu
quote:
That’s not even getting into the fact that Lonzo being on the roster stopped us from taking Darius Garland. Just a brutal series of events.
Yeah I remember that being a rationalization when I called us moving back and not taking him a mistake. "we have Jrue and Lonzo, that's our backcourt!"
But even then we knew Lonzo wasn't a sure thing, and Jrue was ultimately not on our timetable. One or both was unlikely to be here forever. And taking Garland meant he gets to be developed slowly as a 6th man. Where he likely would have thrived and gave us the most formidable guard trio in the league.
Posted on 3/14/23 at 10:25 am to Pistol44
quote:
Folks pointing out the shooting woes have valid concerns, but pulling the ball out of the net and having to face set defenses constantly is just as much, if not more, attributable to the Pels offensive woes during the period, particularly with this lineup.
Agree...overall for this entire season, defensively, we are
#1 in defense against the 3-pt shot allowing only 33.9%
#29 in defense against the 2-pt shot allowing 57.2%
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