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re: Why the hell is Joe Cocker not in the R&R HOF?

Posted on 5/11/23 at 11:01 am to
Posted by Pvt Hudson
Member since Jan 2013
4680 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 11:01 am to
quote:

I'm perfectly fine that she's in.


Thank you. My response had considerably more sweat words.
Posted by Cdawg
TigerFred's Living Room
Member since Sep 2003
61515 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 12:16 pm to
quote:

Quick...name me one of his songs other than a Beatles cover. No Googling.


I'll just leave this here and you figure out the song no googling.

Posted by AlxTgr
Kyre Banorg
Member since Oct 2003
86383 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 1:26 pm to
Songs written by Joe Cocker reminds me of Ole Miss National Championships.
Posted by DaleGribble
Bend, OR
Member since Sep 2014
6821 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 1:42 pm to
quote:

I also like Bob Dylan so take my opinion for what it is worth.



Neil Young's voice was tolerable to me for a year or two in the 90s, then I started hating it again. Dylan's not that bad, but definitely an acquired taste that I've never acquired.
Posted by stratman
NOLA
Member since Apr 2013
977 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 2:20 pm to
quote:

Quick...name me one of his songs other than a Beatles cover. No Googling.


Feeling All Right
Unchain My Heart
Leave Your Hat on.
Posted by stratman
NOLA
Member since Apr 2013
977 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 2:21 pm to
quote:

Because all he did was cover other's songs.



Is it a pre requisite that you only sing or play songs that you write?
Posted by Kafka
I am the moral conscience of TD
Member since Jul 2007
153935 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 2:40 pm to
quote:

He's a cover artist. He's not in there for good reason.
Posted by Kafka
I am the moral conscience of TD
Member since Jul 2007
153935 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 2:42 pm to
quote:

So did Linda Ronstadt. She's in.
And when she sang R&R, she did it very badly.

But she still belongs in the R&R HOF. We need to be more inclusive about these things.
Posted by hogcard1964
Alabama
Member since Jan 2017
17290 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 2:45 pm to
"And when she sang R&R, she did it very badly."

I'd have to disagree with that assessment. It wasn't her natural niche, but describing it as "bad" is a pretty far stretch.
Posted by AlxTgr
Kyre Banorg
Member since Oct 2003
86383 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 2:48 pm to
quote:

Is it a pre requisite that you only sing or play songs that you write?
No
Posted by Kafka
I am the moral conscience of TD
Member since Jul 2007
153935 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 2:53 pm to
Ronstadt was good at pop. "Long Long Time", her best track, is an excellent country-tinged ballad.

But LR's rock covers (Chuck Berry, Stones, Zevon, Costello) sucked. In fact I hated "Poor Poor Pitiful Me" until I heard Zevon's original.

She has range and technique, but no soul. There's no hillbilly white trash in her, no ghetto -- not even the wrong side of town.

I'm quite quite willing to die on this hill.
Posted by hogcard1964
Alabama
Member since Jan 2017
17290 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 2:54 pm to
"He also did a Randy Newman cover - "You Can Leave Your Hat On" which I like better than Newman's version. He sang covers. He was not a songwriter.

He had a soulful sound, I always liked it but I understand folks who don't. I also like Bob Dylan so take my opinion for what it is worth."

+1000

I have no problem with classic rock/pop performers giving their take on other artist's tunes.

It's when other acts from different genres that don't possess the same skill level, are included into that genre, that ruffles my feathers.

Hell, I also liked and appreciated Johnny Rivers, who was a masterful guitarist and wrote very, very little during his career.

Once again, Johnny Rivers and Joe Cocker are not in, but LL Cool J, Donna Summer, Madonna, The Go Gos, Public Enemy, Jay Z, Run DMC...are in.
This post was edited on 5/11/23 at 2:55 pm
Posted by hogcard1964
Alabama
Member since Jan 2017
17290 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 2:56 pm to
That's fine. We differ, it's all subjective.

I loved her rendition of Poor Poor Pitiful Me.

Great R & R backing band behind her on that album as well. Waddy Wachtel and Rick Marotta both appeared on it.
This post was edited on 5/11/23 at 3:02 pm
Posted by Kafka
I am the moral conscience of TD
Member since Jul 2007
153935 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 3:01 pm to
quote:

The most frequent criticism of the Hall of Fame is that the nomination process is controlled by a few individuals who are not themselves musicians, such as founders Jann Wenner and Suzan Evans, and writer Dave Marsh, reflecting their personal tastes rather than public opinion as a whole. A former member of the nominations board once commented that "At one point Suzan Evans lamented the choices being made because there weren't enough big names that would sell tickets to the dinner. That was quickly remedied by dropping one of the doo-wop groups being considered in favor of a 'name' artist ... I saw how certain pioneering artists of the '50s and early '60s were shunned because there needed to be more name power on the list, resulting in '70s superstars getting in before the people who made it possible for them. Some of those pioneers still aren't in today."[57][58] Sister Rosetta Tharpe is often considered "The Godmother/Grandmother of Rock & Roll", but was not chosen for induction until 2017.[59][60] Velvet Underground drummer Maureen Tucker has dismissed the Hall of Fame as the "Hall of Lame" despite the band being inducted a couple of years prior to the remark.
quote:

According to Fox News, petitions with tens of thousands of signatures have also been ignored, and some groups that were signed with certain labels or companies or were affiliated with various committee members have even been put up for nomination with no discussion at all.[58] The committee has also been accused of largely ignoring certain genres.[63] According to author Brett Milano in 2007, "entire genres get passed over, particularly progressive rock, '60s Top 40, New Orleans funk and a whole lot of black music."
quote:

On March 14, 2007, two days after that year's induction ceremony, Roger Friedman of Fox News published an article claiming that the Dave Clark Five should have been the fifth inductee, as they had more votes than inductee Grandmaster Flash and the Furious Five. The article went on to say that Jann Wenner availed himself of a technicality on the day votes were due in. In reality, The Dave Clark Five got six more votes than Grandmaster Flash. But he felt "we couldn't go another year without a rap act."[83]

The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Foundation responded "There is a format and rules and procedure. There is a specific time when the votes have to be in, and then they are counted. The bands with the top five votes got in."[84] The Dave Clark Five was subsequently nominated again and then inducted the following year.
quote:

The Monkees
In a Facebook post, the Monkees member Michael Nesmith stated that he did not know if the Monkees belonged in the Hall of Fame because he could see the impact of the Monkees only from the inside, and went on to say: "I can see the HOF (Hall of Fame) is a private enterprise. It seems to operate as a business, and the inductees are there by some action of the owners of the Enterprise. The inductees appear to be chosen at the owner's pleasure. This seems proper to me. It is their business in any case. It does not seem to me that the HOF carries a public mandate, nor should it be compelled to conform to one."[86]

Some magazines and news outlets, such as Time,[87] NPR radio,[88] The Christian Science Monitor,[89] Goldmine magazine,[90][91] Yahoo Music[92] and MSNBC[93] have argued that the Monkees belong in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.
Posted by Kafka
I am the moral conscience of TD
Member since Jul 2007
153935 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 3:02 pm to
quote:

That's fine. We differ
Posted by hogcard1964
Alabama
Member since Jan 2017
17290 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 3:04 pm to
If any rap/hip hop act is in, there's zero reason not to include main stream country artists as well.
Posted by geauxbrown
Louisiana
Member since Oct 2006
25134 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 3:13 pm to
quote:


Why the hell is Joe Cocker not in the R&R HOF?
He sang out of tune


Not nearly as often as a lot of folks who currently reside in the HOF
Posted by shutterspeed
MS Gulf Coast
Member since May 2007
70517 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 5:48 pm to
quote:

I love punk, but the Sex Pistols are in and had ONE album... and I'd say London Calling & the Ramones debut were more important and better albums


The Sex Pistols had much more of an impact on music and culture worldwide.

As far as Joe Cocker goes, I'll give him "Up Where We Belong."
Posted by 88Wildcat
Topeka, Ks
Member since Jul 2017
16443 posts
Posted on 5/11/23 at 9:47 pm to
quote:

Quick...name me one of his songs other than a Beatles cover. No Googling.


You Are So Beautiful-what do I win?

I can understand why he wasn't inducted while he was alive. Can you imagine listening and watching the acceptance speech? Everyone would have had to figure out if he was having a stroke and paramedics needed to be called or if he was just being Joe Cocker. Kind of surprised he isn't already in though. That's one I hadn't thought of. Probably because I'm not a huge fan of his voice anyway.
Posted by JumpingTheShark
America
Member since Nov 2012
24685 posts
Posted on 5/12/23 at 11:23 am to
I don’t know why people care who is or is not in the rock and roll hall of fame…it doesn’t add or take away from someone’s legacy of greatness
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