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Question for Taylor/Martin guitar guys
Posted on 12/20/17 at 1:56 pm
Posted on 12/20/17 at 1:56 pm
For any of you experienced guys who have owned or played multiple Martins or Taylors, how much consistency is there in the the neck feel/action from model to model? The reason I ask is that I have a feeling I'm going to have to order online because of the limited selection at Guitar Center. I understand that there will be different body sizes and wood selections from model to model, and this will mainly affect tone/sound. I'm not as concerned about minor sound differences because I don't play a lot and only play for myself, so I'm sure I'll be happy enough with the sound from any quality guitar. Probably spending up to $2,500 or so. But will there be that much difference in the neck feel and action from, say, a Taylor 300 to 400 to 500 series? Or will the necks basically feel the same within a general price range? If I like the neck on a 400 series Grand Concert, but I want a 400 series Grand Symphony - or if they only have a 300 series Grand Concert and I want a 400 series Grand Concert - am I safe ordering one without having played that exact model?
Not starting a Martin vs. Taylor argument because I know where that will go.
ETA: I went a few days ago and played around with some Martin and Taylors but had no intention of buying, so I didn't pay any attention to particular series or models. Now I've got the buy and have done some research into the different models. I'm going back tomorrow to play a bunch and hopefully buy, just undecided on whether I should limit myself to what is in stock at the store.
Not starting a Martin vs. Taylor argument because I know where that will go.
ETA: I went a few days ago and played around with some Martin and Taylors but had no intention of buying, so I didn't pay any attention to particular series or models. Now I've got the buy and have done some research into the different models. I'm going back tomorrow to play a bunch and hopefully buy, just undecided on whether I should limit myself to what is in stock at the store.
This post was edited on 12/20/17 at 2:00 pm
5
Posted on 12/20/17 at 2:50 pm to TigrrrDad
I don't have a ton of experience here, but I recently went to Guitar Center to try out acoustics. I absolutely fell in love with a Taylor they had. I bought it online a week later from somewhere else and it was perfect. The only difference I could physically notice was on mine the strings felt completely new. The guitar center one had strings that had seen plenty of use from people trying it out. Other that that there wasn't a bit of difference in feel or sound that I could notice.
Different models is a little different though. I would suspect if the models have the same woods or finishes they will be very similar. If you pick a model that has a different wood on the body the sound may be different. If you pick a model that has a different type of fret board or finish on the neck, then that will most likely change the way it feels from model to model.
Different models is a little different though. I would suspect if the models have the same woods or finishes they will be very similar. If you pick a model that has a different wood on the body the sound may be different. If you pick a model that has a different type of fret board or finish on the neck, then that will most likely change the way it feels from model to model.
This post was edited on 12/20/17 at 2:56 pm
Posted on 12/20/17 at 4:00 pm to Ham Solo
While I said the sound isn't as important as the feel, I've spent literally hours listening to different models on the Taylor website (they have a well set up website that allows you to watch direct comparison videos of different models playing the same chords, fingerpicking, etc.). Big difference in the sound between Grand Concert vs. Grand Auditorium vs. Grand Symphony, etc. I'm actually liking the 400 series sound better than the 500, 600, even some 900 series that are double the price.
Posted on 12/20/17 at 6:53 pm to TigrrrDad
Taylor uses CNC technology to produce their neck blanks, which come off the machines insanely consistent just needing final shaping and sanding. In addition to speeding up processes, CNC speeds up high-precision tasks like cutting dovetails and fingerboard slots and inlay routs ... with a margin of error (none) that's even better than Taylor's master luthiers.
If Taylor lists specs like nut widths, fingerboard radii and neck thicknesses at their website, their use of CNC means that's exactly what you're going to get piece to piece to piece. And I'd suspect core neck production is very much across the board dimension-wise ... it's things like wood composition, ornate bindings and inlays or the lack of the ornate, that dictate what makes a 200 different from a 300 from a 600, etc.
CNC machine cutting necks at Taylor's factory
If Taylor lists specs like nut widths, fingerboard radii and neck thicknesses at their website, their use of CNC means that's exactly what you're going to get piece to piece to piece. And I'd suspect core neck production is very much across the board dimension-wise ... it's things like wood composition, ornate bindings and inlays or the lack of the ornate, that dictate what makes a 200 different from a 300 from a 600, etc.
CNC machine cutting necks at Taylor's factory
Posted on 12/20/17 at 10:28 pm to TigrrrDad
Regardless of what you decide it will not be set up to play it’s best from the factory. Take it to a good luthier. Worth every penny. FretShack is great if your in BR.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 5:51 am to The Don
quote:
Regardless of what you decide it will not be set up to play it’s best from the factory. Take it to a good luthier. Worth every penny. FretShack is great if your in BR.
This all day^. For me personally though,off the rack Taylors seem to be set up closer to my tastes,while the Martins,generally have the sound that I prefer,between those two choices.
That being said,I have never owned a Taylor,and The D-28 Martin I currently have,is the only Martin that I have ever owned. I also am not one to hang out in music stores trying out new guitars. I generally buy mine at pawn shops,jam sessions,yard sales,thrift stores,friends of friends..etc..
Nowadays,my acoustic that I pick up first,( I have a house full of guitars), is my Takamine cedar top N-10,I like it better than the D-28,and even after adding a Fishman pick up,I have less than $400 in it. When other pickers play it,they are in awe.Everything about it is perfect. I recently bought a Seagull,and have set it up exactly the same as The Takamine(The fret bars are slightly smaller diameter though,hammer ons/off not quite as effective),to use as a beater. It's a great guitar too,but doesn't have the solid (warmth? Feeling?)of the N-10. I just don't want to drag the Takamine around too much,I'd rather save it for recording and playing/writing at home.
I am just suggesting,that getting caught up in certain Name Brands,isn't always the way to go. Sure,it makes other guitar players ooh and ah,when you pull out your Martin or Taylor,but I think it is more important to find a great player,No matter what it says on the head stock.
I guess it's a bit like finding the perfect girl. If you make your parameters narrow,you will probably get what you expect. If you widen your parameters,you may find new things in yourself.
This post was edited on 12/21/17 at 7:16 am
Posted on 12/21/17 at 9:12 am to TigrrrDad
I guess I qualify. I suck as a player but am guitar store guy. I go all over.
I can't find a Martin that feels right to me unless it gets over $2500. But it sounds like $2500 is where you are headed anyway. It also sounds like you are already a Taylor guy. Not a damned thing wrong with that. Don't try and talk yourself into a Martin. I sure as hell won't. This is a Mercedes or BMW argument. No wrong answer.
To what Fret Shack says, it sure seems right. If you don't like a Taylor you pick up, don't bother picking up another. Same model numbers I mean. I like their 324e. Not a full dread, but I've picked up several in many stores. They all feel the same.
Set up was mentioned. Fret Shack is too far. Not shipping a guitar for setup. I found Heights Guitar Tech in Houston. Anybody here use them or know of their work?
I called and "full setup" was $60? Sounds pretty good. Yelp and Google reviews are great.
I can't find a Martin that feels right to me unless it gets over $2500. But it sounds like $2500 is where you are headed anyway. It also sounds like you are already a Taylor guy. Not a damned thing wrong with that. Don't try and talk yourself into a Martin. I sure as hell won't. This is a Mercedes or BMW argument. No wrong answer.
To what Fret Shack says, it sure seems right. If you don't like a Taylor you pick up, don't bother picking up another. Same model numbers I mean. I like their 324e. Not a full dread, but I've picked up several in many stores. They all feel the same.
Set up was mentioned. Fret Shack is too far. Not shipping a guitar for setup. I found Heights Guitar Tech in Houston. Anybody here use them or know of their work?
I called and "full setup" was $60? Sounds pretty good. Yelp and Google reviews are great.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 9:24 am to LSU alum wannabe
You can do your own set ups. Allen wrench,scale,sandpaper and patience.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 9:28 am to auggie
quote:
You can do your own set ups
I've tinkered already.
quote:
Allen wrench
Agreed.
quote:
scale
Huh?
quote:
sandpaper
Oh the horror. quote:
and patience.
Not my strength.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 9:44 am to LSU alum wannabe
Scale: it's a little measuring device,it's got a sliding crossbar,and usually measures in small graduations.1/100ths,instead of carpenters fractions. Personally,I use machinist dial calipers(graduated in 1/1,000 of an inch),backwards by The extending tailrod.
The sandpaper,use that for the bottom of saddle or nut,that's also where the patience comes in.
At the same time,you want to keep a good relationship with your local guitar shop,give them work and be their best customer. They will steer deals your way.
The sandpaper,use that for the bottom of saddle or nut,that's also where the patience comes in.
At the same time,you want to keep a good relationship with your local guitar shop,give them work and be their best customer. They will steer deals your way.
This post was edited on 12/21/17 at 10:57 am
Posted on 12/21/17 at 10:47 am to auggie
quote:
Scale: it's a little measuring device,it's got a sliding crossbar,and usually measures in small graduations.1/100ths,instead of fractions. Personally,I use machinist dial calipers(graduated in 1/1,000 of an inch),backwards by The extending tailrod.
Oh. Like feeler guages. I'll get some eventually. That'll be an impulse buy at Tractor Supply or Harbor Freight
Posted on 12/21/17 at 11:08 am to LSU alum wannabe
It's not like feeler gauges. It's more like a ruler,but much more accurate.
You can get chinese junk dial calipers,which will be good enough for guitar work, at harbor freight for about 10 bucks. I think they will give you a pocket scale for free.
Just remember,for guitar,you aren't using the pinchers,you want to use that little rod coming out of the arse end,kind of like a depth gauge,then subtract/add the thickness of your strings
You can get chinese junk dial calipers,which will be good enough for guitar work, at harbor freight for about 10 bucks. I think they will give you a pocket scale for free.
Just remember,for guitar,you aren't using the pinchers,you want to use that little rod coming out of the arse end,kind of like a depth gauge,then subtract/add the thickness of your strings
This post was edited on 12/21/17 at 11:13 am
Posted on 12/21/17 at 11:17 am to auggie
If you are in Baton Rouge, Ziegler will probably have a much better selection of Martin's if you want to try them out. All of the Martin's are setup by their tech there and he will adjust it to your preferences when you buy.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 11:25 am to TigrrrDad
I have a few of both. I’d say martins are better for sound in your house and stuff but I prefer Taylor’s when I play live.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 11:50 am to olddawg26
If you are going to attempt your own set-up for the first time (which I don't recommend with any guitar of reasonable monetary or sentimental/heirloom value), I strongly encourage you to watch a ton of videos on YouTube, practice on any beater guitars you may have or can put your hands on as learning tools (this is a GREAT time to buy an under-$100 pawn shop guinea pig) and no matter what, use the right tools for the task, especially for the truss rod - DO NOT IMPROVISE.
Taylor truss rods use a 1/4" bucket wrench. Post-2007 Martins use a 5mm Allen wrench with 4-5 inches of workable extension - the wrench's length has to penetrate a TR access hole in a top soundboard brace and extend to the body/neck block.
Taylor truss rods use a 1/4" bucket wrench. Post-2007 Martins use a 5mm Allen wrench with 4-5 inches of workable extension - the wrench's length has to penetrate a TR access hole in a top soundboard brace and extend to the body/neck block.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 6:24 pm to TigrrrDad
I must have spent 2 hours playing almost every guitar in the room at Guitar Center at Elmwood. I kind of went in wanting the Taylor 712ce, but the closest thing they had was an 814. Very similar though, and I would have felt comfortable ordering the 712 based on the difference between the 800 series and the 500 & lower series they had there. I wasn't really familiar with Martin's lineup as far as relative quality other than looking at the price tags. Taylor has a better website for comparisons between models.
After playing everything and narrowing it down to one particular Martin and the 814 Taylor, I kept switching back and forth between those two forever. I would have been happy with either, but the Taylor sounded a bit too twangy. I started digging the Martin sound, though I will say that there were two copies of the same model there, but they sounded a bit different due to different strings. Likewise, there was a bit of difference in the wood stain. I almost went with the Taylor because I liked the abalone inlays and rosette. However, I liked the wood a little better on the Martin. Really a tossup on the neck feel.
Ended up getting the Martin GPC-MMVE for around $2,400 (and it came with a nice hard case). Sitka spruce top, East Indian Rosewood back and sides, Mahogany neck, ebony fingerboard and bridge.
Thanks for all of the replies and info.
After playing everything and narrowing it down to one particular Martin and the 814 Taylor, I kept switching back and forth between those two forever. I would have been happy with either, but the Taylor sounded a bit too twangy. I started digging the Martin sound, though I will say that there were two copies of the same model there, but they sounded a bit different due to different strings. Likewise, there was a bit of difference in the wood stain. I almost went with the Taylor because I liked the abalone inlays and rosette. However, I liked the wood a little better on the Martin. Really a tossup on the neck feel.
Ended up getting the Martin GPC-MMVE for around $2,400 (and it came with a nice hard case). Sitka spruce top, East Indian Rosewood back and sides, Mahogany neck, ebony fingerboard and bridge.
Thanks for all of the replies and info.
This post was edited on 12/21/17 at 6:29 pm
Posted on 12/21/17 at 6:33 pm to TigrrrDad
You made a great choice! Congrats!
Posted on 12/21/17 at 7:41 pm to TigrrrDad
quote:
hanks for all of the replies and info.
You went in a Taylor guy and walked out with a Martin????
Just jacking with you. Its a BMW vs. Mercedes argument. Enjoy your BMW.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 7:54 pm to TigrrrDad
Damn,the back of that guitar looks incredible.
I would have to learn to play behind my back,so I could turn around and everybody can see that shite.
I would have to learn to play behind my back,so I could turn around and everybody can see that shite.
Posted on 12/21/17 at 8:31 pm to auggie
quote:
Damn,the back of that guitar looks incredible
That’s one of the things I really liked about this one. The other Martin there that was the exact same model as this one (as well as the Taylor I liked) had a more brown tint to it, whereas this particular one had more of a reddish hue, kind of a cherrywood look to it. It really looks nice.
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