re: The Prometheus (Major Spoiler) Discussion Thread

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then fassbender made a mistake in his performance

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Yeah, the only explanation I can think of is that David could feel emotions, but humans were so full of hubris or denial that they just wouldn't believe that David/android could have emotions even when it was evident that he could. And that's why they said over and over again that David can't have feelings.

It could have been a mistake in programming that was later corrected in newer androids, say by the time Bishop came around.

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I still don't think she was one though, if she was, she was made not to know she was. Why was she in cryosleep?

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refer to this list and make up your own mind

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Evidence against:
1) her transit in suspended animation like the other humans in the film
2) her denial to the captain (sleeping with him to prove the point)
3) her being referred to as Weyland's daughter

Evidence for:
1) her appearance, she resembles no character more than David
2) her strength, although David is much stronger than the other humans on board she man-handles him in the hallway when they are alone and she wants to threaten him
3) Weyland referring to her as a daughter? Weyland may well have craved biological children but been infertile. A man of his means would certainly have been able to have a son if he could have a daughter. The technology for that sort of thing already exists. If Weyland were outright infertile then Theron being his robot "daughter" makes sense.
4) The surgical pod in her room: It was only set to recognize and treat men - if it was not for Vickers because she was a robot and would have no need of it then it was for Weyland.
5) She and David were effective tools (refer to the myth again - much to the chagrin of Zeus Prometheus gave fire and tools to man) against the Titans and Aliens. Vickers brings home this possibility by using fire itself to dispose of a crewmember being converted into an Alien.

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A robot would certainly be capable of shutting down and coming back up if the maker desired that function. She recovered very rapidly from her sleep (unlike say the female lead)

I think points 1 thru 4 in my "evidence for" category are probably stronger than anything in the "evidence against" category

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Vickers screwed the Captain. That's emotion. A soul. Robots have no lust.

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Lust had nothing to do with it. She did it to prove that she was human (or to continue with the facade that she was human)

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I think points 1 thru 4 in my "evidence for" category are probably stronger than anything in the "evidence against" category

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Your 1 & 2 are not very convincing imo and 3 you're assuming an awful lot.

4 is the most convincing imo.

I've conceded about the emotion point because we know David was made able to express emotions.

It reads like you read without catching the context. The point i was disputing was:

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I doubt Vickers was an android. I say this simply because she showed a lot of emotion and we've never seen any androids in this universe show emotion.

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To rebut that idea (Vickers couldn't have been a robot because they never show emotion) I wrote:

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then fassbender made a mistake in his performance

and the Vickers thing is an interesting aside but not a central point to me - i don't care to argue that if people disagree. Her character probably works almost as well if she is human instead

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The point remains that whatever their intentions might have been Fassbender did reveal emotions in his David character.

If Vickers was a robot intended by Weyland to pose as human (and carry out his wishes for his company after his death) then she would have not been suited for the job unless she could at least look like she had human emotions

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But Charlize Theron was the honey of the movie, let's be real here

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She wasn't that hot to me in this. Very bland. I would have met her in her room in ten minutes though no doubt.

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The Prometheus (Major Spoiler) Discussion Thread
There's a lot to pick at as bad in the film but there are some things people don't seem to have mentioned and are probably at least worth discussing.

I think it is a mistake to try and make sense of the film using conventional logic when the film pretty much completely falls apart when you try. Man has been on Earth for something like 190,000 years and life on Earth for hundreds of millions of years - our relationships with other creatures on Earth and the length of our existence just don't match the story - so that tells us to just stop trying to apply that logic IMO.

In a couple other scenes the scientists dating things (presumably using radioisotopes to date them) never do so in a logical way. A minute or two after arriving the female lead announces with confidence the age of the cave paintings she has found in remote Great Britain... and despite knowing nothing about the isotope history of their new "planet" they feel comfortable pretty much just eyeballing a site and dating how long a body or whatever has been sitting there. You can be upset by this stuff as stupidly wrong and sign off on the movie if this bothers you or you can enjoy the show.

If I were to nerd rage on anything in particular it might be the film's timelines for space travel. Unless I missed something like a new found ability to travel through black holes a trillion dollar ship was constructed and sailed 35 light years across a galaxy in the span of only four years? I'm just saying, if you really discovered wormhole transportation or even warp speed transit that would seem like a technological innovation worth a mention.

1) Prometheus the Space Jockey:

When considering the Space Jockeys the audience is intended to consider the meaning of this name in the film. In light of the film's title, their massive human/god appearance, and the Prometheus myth I think we should view the "Space Jockeys" as a race of Titans from Greek Mythology. Many people seem to have heard the portion of the myth in which the Titan Prometheus gave fire to man... but it does not seem to be common knowledge that other myths credited Prometheus with creating the species of man from clay and arming man with other tools.

We should not necessarily look for consistency in motivations between the founder Titan (Prometheus) who gave rise to man and the other Titans because the Titan that gave rise to man was a probably guilty of defying the will of the other Titans and/or Gods. It could probably be argued that the Titans not in on Prometheus' plan would regard their human visitors as favorably as Zeus would have regarded a mortal climbing Mount Olympus. If we look at things in this light then we can rationalize the immediate instinct of the Titans (other than Prometheus) to kill man on sight (because they have tread upon Mount Olympus)

2) Epimetheus:

No, this is not a character name you missed - but it is a myth that seems relevant. The Titan Prometheus had a sibling named Epimetheus - while Prometheus crafted clay figures into the shape of man and he (or Athena) breathed life into them... Epimetheus crafted clay figures in the shape of beasts and he (or Athena) breathed life into those. Prometheus' creation man responded by honoring the Gods whereas the beasts Epimetheus created attacked him. Is this a accidental? Probably not - Scott seemed to be interested in doing a film that allowed him to deal with the issue of human origins and the Prometheus myth (when paired with Epimetheus) allows you to combine the elements of man, space jockey, and alien monsters.

2) David

David is an easy pick for the best character in the film (esp since the Guy Pearce speech was not in the theater release). A good part of that is probably just Fassbender's charisma but I found myself interested in the reveal of his inner desires that never came (tho he was referred to as soulless it seemed clear that he did have emotions and those motivated some of his behaviors).

Exactly what he hoped to learn or gain from intentionally infecting a Charlie with the black goo seemed hard to rationalize... especially when it was prefaced by a conversation in which he questioned Charlie on what his moral limits were in the pursuit of knowledge. I think that is just another example of where the film fell apart for the sake of moving forward the space horror tale. You can choose to view David as the spirit of thoughtless creation punishing a man who knows no limits or ethics or as another creator destroyed by his creation story (much like the Greek Gods overthrew the Titans and the Aliens could kill the space jockeys)... but I think that might credit the writer with more meaning than he deserves.

Alternatively, we could view David as Pandora. Pandora famously opened the box that held the horrors of disease, death, pestilence etc and released them upon the world because of her boundless curiosity. David could then have infected Charlie, opened doors, and aggressively talked with the Titanic Space Jockey because he was less concerned with his safety (or the safety of others) than he was with the quest for new information


Meredith Vickers (Charlize Theron):

This is just an aside consideration but in light of a couple things it is worth considering if she was a robot similar to David.

Evidence against:
1) her transit in suspended animation like the other humans in the film
2) her denial to the captain (sleeping with him to prove the point)
3) her being referred to as Weyland's daughter

Evidence for:
1) her appearance, she resembles no character more than David
2) her strength, although David is much stronger than the other humans on board she man-handles him in the hallway when they are alone and she wants to threaten him
3) Weyland referring to her as a daughter? Weyland may well have craved biological children but been infertile. A man of his means would certainly have been able to have a son if he could have a daughter. The technology for that sort of thing already exists. If Weyland were outright infertile then Theron being his robot "daughter" makes sense.
4) The surgical pod in her room: It was only set to recognize and treat men - if it was not for Vickers because she was a robot and would have no need of it then it was for Weyland.
5) She and David were effective tools (refer to the myth again - much to the chagrin of Zeus Prometheus gave fire and tools to man) against the Titans and Aliens. Vickers brings home this possibility by using fire itself to dispose of a crewmember being converted into an Alien.


20k posts - thought about doing something different but decided against a best actress babe thread thread or something along those lines.

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Dang man, was this all you?

Whoever said this movie had a Superman score to it was dead on. Might've been Leauxgan? Totally dug it. Movie was definitely much different than what I anticipated in terms of mood. Was expecting something more dark. Entertaining movie, but doesn't hold a candle to Alien or Aliens.

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2) her strength, although David is much stronger than the other humans on board she man-handles him in the hallway when they are alone and she wants to threaten him

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Is there ever any evidence in the movie that David would resist or fight back in such a situation though? It's not like he put up a fight, and he's much more of a thinker too.