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Message
re: The OFFICIAL Man of Steel Discussion and ***SPOILERS*** Thread
Posted on 6/17/13 at 11:11 am to Sentrius
Posted on 6/17/13 at 11:11 am to Sentrius
Better late than never. Anyway, saw it last night and I had to really think about what I saw.
First I should disclose my experience with Superman. I don't read the comics, never seen ANY of the movies (but I have heard a lot about them and even podcast reviews and discussions about behind the scenes stuff), or the show Smallville. I did see some of Lois & Clark The Adventures of Superman show when I was a kid but that was it. So I guess I'm somewhat familiar with the lore and the plot lines of the movies but this was my first Superman movie experience.
When it opened I loved the whole opening on Krypton. I loved the universe they set up and the history established. Russell Crowe was awesome as Jor-El and Michael Shannon as Zod I really liked. I almost want a prequel just focusing on them and Krypton. When Jor-El told Zod he respected the Zod he once knew I immediately wanted to know more, likewise Zod's respect for Jor-El really left me wanting to know more about their past and the politics of Krypton. I like my villains to be in the gray-black area vs painted black or white (IM3 had great potential but blew it there), so I like Zod's wanting almost the same as Jor-El but for more of a Hitler twist to him.
Glad we saw Clark's childhood in brief flashbacks instead of spending 20 minutes in it. Kevin Costner played a great father figure to Clark as well. Especially when he told Clark maybe he should have left those kids on the bus to drown, which pays off latter when he refuses to let Clark save him to hide who he really was to the world because the world wasn't ready for him yet. I thought that'd scene would play a bit differently than it did but I'm glad it turned out that way. I thought it'd be there are something's Superman cannot stop, like the tornado, and he'd have to live with the fact that no matter how hard he tries he cannot save everyone.
Amy Adams worked as Lois Lane for me but I wish they could have added a bit more depth to Perry White and company other than being brief cameos.
I enjoyed the action in this film at first but it started to get it repetitive: smash through building, then another building or a train/car, then another and so on and so forth. Would have liked to see more variety.
Final action set piece worked or me. One of my gripes with super hero movies is there has to be great stakes involved, especially for the likes of Superman. Genocide of the human race? Check. Destruction of several city blocks in a densely populated area? Check. This told me we are going for that darker tone that I love in super hero films.
I did pick up on a 9/11 vibe for a split second when that Army guy told Faora "A good death is a good reward" or something along those lines right before crashing a military plane into the ship in the DC universe equivalent of NYC. That rubbed me the wrong way. I know we are 12 years removed from 9/11 but that kinda took me out of the experience for a bit. I know it was what she said to him earlier but it didn't feel right for the situation IMO.
As for the end battle I thought it was funny the look on Clark's face when Zod learned to fly. It was like: Ah hell no! I'm the only Krytonian who can fly!
This whole movie I was wondering how Clark would deal with Zod so i was surprised when Clark broke Zod's neck. It cemented it in my mind that we are going in this darker direction for the universe.
That all said I give movie 8/10. I really enjoyed it I just wanted more Jor-El and more Krypton.
My real concerns is where do they go from here? I said earlier I'm not aware of all supes villains, and my views will differ from most here, but I don't want to see Lex Luther in this universe as a villain. Maybe I don't know a lot about him but the idea of a human villain doesn't do it for me when you have an almost God like being in superman, he needs a worthy opponent, an inhuman opponent. If someone could explain Lex Luther a bit better too me maybe I could see it but I feel a human opponent would be a step down from what we got here. I feel for the universe they've set up and the dark direction they went with it, that there is only going down from here. But I hope I'm wrong about that.
First I should disclose my experience with Superman. I don't read the comics, never seen ANY of the movies (but I have heard a lot about them and even podcast reviews and discussions about behind the scenes stuff), or the show Smallville. I did see some of Lois & Clark The Adventures of Superman show when I was a kid but that was it. So I guess I'm somewhat familiar with the lore and the plot lines of the movies but this was my first Superman movie experience.
When it opened I loved the whole opening on Krypton. I loved the universe they set up and the history established. Russell Crowe was awesome as Jor-El and Michael Shannon as Zod I really liked. I almost want a prequel just focusing on them and Krypton. When Jor-El told Zod he respected the Zod he once knew I immediately wanted to know more, likewise Zod's respect for Jor-El really left me wanting to know more about their past and the politics of Krypton. I like my villains to be in the gray-black area vs painted black or white (IM3 had great potential but blew it there), so I like Zod's wanting almost the same as Jor-El but for more of a Hitler twist to him.
Glad we saw Clark's childhood in brief flashbacks instead of spending 20 minutes in it. Kevin Costner played a great father figure to Clark as well. Especially when he told Clark maybe he should have left those kids on the bus to drown, which pays off latter when he refuses to let Clark save him to hide who he really was to the world because the world wasn't ready for him yet. I thought that'd scene would play a bit differently than it did but I'm glad it turned out that way. I thought it'd be there are something's Superman cannot stop, like the tornado, and he'd have to live with the fact that no matter how hard he tries he cannot save everyone.
Amy Adams worked as Lois Lane for me but I wish they could have added a bit more depth to Perry White and company other than being brief cameos.
I enjoyed the action in this film at first but it started to get it repetitive: smash through building, then another building or a train/car, then another and so on and so forth. Would have liked to see more variety.
Final action set piece worked or me. One of my gripes with super hero movies is there has to be great stakes involved, especially for the likes of Superman. Genocide of the human race? Check. Destruction of several city blocks in a densely populated area? Check. This told me we are going for that darker tone that I love in super hero films.
I did pick up on a 9/11 vibe for a split second when that Army guy told Faora "A good death is a good reward" or something along those lines right before crashing a military plane into the ship in the DC universe equivalent of NYC. That rubbed me the wrong way. I know we are 12 years removed from 9/11 but that kinda took me out of the experience for a bit. I know it was what she said to him earlier but it didn't feel right for the situation IMO.
As for the end battle I thought it was funny the look on Clark's face when Zod learned to fly. It was like: Ah hell no! I'm the only Krytonian who can fly!
This whole movie I was wondering how Clark would deal with Zod so i was surprised when Clark broke Zod's neck. It cemented it in my mind that we are going in this darker direction for the universe.
That all said I give movie 8/10. I really enjoyed it I just wanted more Jor-El and more Krypton.
My real concerns is where do they go from here? I said earlier I'm not aware of all supes villains, and my views will differ from most here, but I don't want to see Lex Luther in this universe as a villain. Maybe I don't know a lot about him but the idea of a human villain doesn't do it for me when you have an almost God like being in superman, he needs a worthy opponent, an inhuman opponent. If someone could explain Lex Luther a bit better too me maybe I could see it but I feel a human opponent would be a step down from what we got here. I feel for the universe they've set up and the dark direction they went with it, that there is only going down from here. But I hope I'm wrong about that.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 11:14 am to Duzz
quote:
I would say Lex Luthor should be played by Mickey Rourke! I kid I kid!!! I think a good lux luthor could be portrayed by Bradly Cooper or Eric Bana.
uhhh....what?
Posted on 6/17/13 at 11:31 am to LE610N
quote:
I don't want to see Lex Luther in this universe as a villain
I don't understand why some say this. Lex can cause
Superman real problems. I mean, Lex can make Superman's life hell through politics. He can also build pretty much anything, including suits that are almost invulnerable to Superman and can kick his arse.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 11:34 am to LE610N
quote:
I said earlier I'm not aware of all supes villains, and my views will differ from most here, but I don't want to see Lex Luther in this universe as a villain. Maybe I don't know a lot about him but the idea of a human villain doesn't do it for me when you have an almost God like being in superman, he needs a worthy opponent, an inhuman opponent. If someone could explain Lex Luther a bit better too me maybe I could see it but I feel a human opponent would be a step down from what we got here. I feel for the universe they've set up and the dark direction they went with it, that there is only going down from here. But I hope I'm wrong about that.
This universe's Lex Luthor has a lot of potential as far as a worthy opponent goes. Both physically and mentally.
I don't know if anyone's mentioned it yet but there was a lot of Kryptonian tech to be had among the wreckage from the world engine. Goyer has mentioned that his Lex is more like a multi billionaire, Trump type. He could've easily gotten his hands on some of that advanced tech, sent it to his R&D guys and had them reverse engineer it to produce a suit of some type for him or God knows what else.
ETA:
F Machine beat me to it. I really think we'll be seeing a suit of some type in Synder's world.
This post was edited on 6/17/13 at 11:37 am
Posted on 6/17/13 at 11:35 am to F machine
It didn't look like Clark let politics get in the way of his complete disregard of the welfare for the city of Metropolis and its citizens in Man of Steel.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 11:37 am to LE610N
quote:
If someone could explain Lex Luther a bit better too me maybe I could see it
In many storylines, Lex's problem with Supes is that Superman is an outsider/non-human. Basically, how could humanity trust some alien to be its savior. It could be rooted in jealousy because Lex had to work hard for his power while Superman was simply born with them.
If done right, the sequel could be excellent. I doubt we'll see the level of destruction that we saw in Man of Steel. Based on the hidden LuthorCorp stuff in MoS, Lex is probably going to be the billionaire CEO instead of the Gene Hackman version where he was some underground scientist. Lex could hold a grudge against Superman for the destruction in Metropolis and make it where the public turns on Superman.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 11:44 am to Murray
quote:
F Machine beat me to it. I really think we'll be seeing a suit of some type in Synder's world.
I really hope they don't do this. It sounds too much like ever Iron Man plot.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 11:45 am to TK421
quote:
I really hope they don't do this. It sounds too much like ever Iron Man plot.
It makes more sense here though. I would rather only see it as a last ditch effort on Luthors part at the end. Maybe a 5-10 battle. I don't want the whole sequel to revolve around the building of a suit.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 11:50 am to Murray
quote:
I don't want the whole sequel to revolve around the building of a suit.
I think that would be a great idea.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 12:17 pm to Tactical1
quote:
It didn't look like Clark let politics get in the way of his complete disregard of the welfare for the city of Metropolis and its citizens in Man of Steel.
quote:
I also had a problem with Lois and to a lesser extent Zod being at any location the film needed them to be for the sake of the story. Zod I can understand, but Lois on the other hand seemed to teleport from location to location.
Exact comments made by my wife and me after the movie. I think with time people will see this movie for the mess it really is. Guess emotions are just running high right now.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 12:38 pm to shutterspeed
quote:
It didn't look like Clark let politics get in the way of his complete disregard of the welfare for the city of Metropolis and its citizens in Man of Steel.
Because he was protecting the entire world. Why is this so hard to understand? It would not have stopped at Metropolis, the entire world was hanging in the balance. How else to say it except with geekanese... "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few".
This post was edited on 6/17/13 at 12:38 pm
Posted on 6/17/13 at 12:42 pm to shutterspeed
Any lasers from Supermans eyes, cold breath freezing things, or the most important single bad arse power of all
This post was edited on 6/17/13 at 12:43 pm
Posted on 6/17/13 at 1:08 pm to Crawdaddy
quote:
the most important single bad arse power of all
That gif doesn't look like Superman wiping Lois' memory by kissing her.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 1:13 pm to Crawdaddy
Even the actors are like "ummm wait is this really gonna be in the movie?"
Posted on 6/17/13 at 1:19 pm to BigAppleTiger
quote:
Because he was protecting the entire world. Why is this so hard to understand? It would not have stopped at Metropolis, the entire world was hanging in the balance.
I would have accepted this if we hadn't already seen Clark drag General Zod to a less populated area earlier in the film.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 1:23 pm to shutterspeed
quote:
It didn't look like Clark let politics get in the way of his complete disregard of the welfare for the city of Metropolis and its citizens in Man of Steel.
Not sure what some of y'all wanted him to do in those situations. For the most part the ones putting citizens in danger were the other Kryptonians or the government. He was trying to get rid of the threat, and sometimes that involved putting some people in danger. It was either that or the Kryptonians blow up the entire Earth.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 1:30 pm to Tactical1
quote:
I would have accepted this if we hadn't already seen Clark drag General Zod to a less populated area earlier in the film.
Yeah, this is a good point. Reeve's Superman showed genuine concern for humans and was willing to look like a coward to the whole world if it meant luring Zod from the human population and protecting them.
This is one part in the second half of the movie where the writers missed the mark.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 1:33 pm to F machine
quote:
It was either that or the Kryptonians blow up the entire Earth.
But the slugfest with General Zod began after the machine was destroyed.
I know it's a film but I kinda thinking that this may have something to do with it.
2011 - Transformers Dark of the moon has full scale destruction of Chicago for about 45 minutes. Over a billion dollars.
2012 - The Avengers has a the complete leveling of nearly all of New York. Over a billion dollars
2013 - Man of Steel has the more destruction than both of the previous films....... Money
This post was edited on 6/17/13 at 1:37 pm
Posted on 6/17/13 at 1:35 pm to Tactical1
quote:
But the slugfest with General Zod began after the machine was destroyed.
yep. bad writing.
Posted on 6/17/13 at 1:36 pm to Murray
quote:I think the tech will be Braniac, something Lex attempts to control even though he doesn't understand it. Braniac will be the villain in MoS2 though Lex will have a part. I agree that Lex will be a billionaire. Bloomberg type, who blames Superman for bringing the Kryptonians to Earth. Eventually, Lex and Braniac combine to be the ultimate enemy of Superman.
I don't know if anyone's mentioned it yet but there was a lot of Kryptonian tech to be had among the wreckage from the world engine. Goyer has mentioned that his Lex is more like a multi billionaire, Trump type. He could've easily gotten his hands on some of that advanced tech, sent it to his R&D guys and had them reverse engineer it to produce a suit of some type for him or God knows what else.
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