- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: The official Interstellar thread (spoilers)
Posted on 12/1/14 at 12:16 pm to OMLandshark
Posted on 12/1/14 at 12:16 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
If you do even something slightly different at one point, then the changes can huge. What if a person in charge of our nuclear missiles mistake a flock of geese for a Russian warhead and decided to unleash their own missiles in freak retaliation. What if the head of admissions to an art school decided to give a kid a chance? What if you thrust slightly differently during sex, and it changes who your child is in another reality. It is really humbling to think that the mere swimming of a single microscopic cell is solely responsible for all of humanities triumphs and disasters. The chances of you existing are one in hundreds upon hundreds of trillions. Every minute step in history has led to you.
And see, I don't completely buy into all of that. If Hitler farted on his eigth birthday, it had nothing to do with me or my existence. I understand the implications of the butterfly effect, but IMO that seems like sort of an awfully selfish and conceited view of things. Some things "in history" led to me, sure. But not all things.
quote:
So if timelines can be split, why is it fair to assume that these 5th dimensional beings aren't from another reality where the Blight never took place? What if thanks to this always happening, then the fifth dimensional beings are still them from the future, but they later went on to join their alternate reality counterparts in the fifth dimension? Time is completely irrelevant for 5th dimensional beings, as is a plain of existence. I think their only priorities would to be all knowing and assist other creatures to join them in their reality.
The problem with that is that you have to buy into the whole "infinite universes" theory for any of it to work.
You're in this thread speaking in absolutes about things that are only theories. Truthbetold, nobody in the history of mankind can possibly pretend to understand everything about the universe, so these theories that certain scientists have are, in essence, from a VERY small and short-sighted perspective (some being on a random planet in the universe called Earth). I feel like that's sort of what ULSaban was getting at when he initially joined the thread (but it then devolved into back and forth attacks basically).
But the bottom line is that "we" never evolve into those beings that save "us" in the movie if that wormhole isn't put there, so the fact that it was put there by "us" doesn't make sense within the framework of the movie. Sure, if you bring in different scientific theories , then it may make sense. But IMO a movie shouldn't require all of that...it should make sense within its own framework. And that's one reason I think some people were a little let down by the last act of the film. I know I was. And then once you bring in the whole "love is tangible/quantifiable and can affect things" angle, it gets a little more ridiculous.
And again I feel the need to reiterate that I really enjoyed the movie a lot. Great movie experience, even if parts of the story and some parts of the movie fell flat for me. And I also get that this is what happens with a movie as ambitious as this one (dealing with so many scientific and fringe theories).
This post was edited on 12/1/14 at 12:22 pm
2
Posted on 12/1/14 at 12:18 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
I don't think a lot of people going out of the theaters understand what they saw
While that may be true, just because people didn't care for the ending or thought it was sort of silly doesn't mean they didn't understand it.
(not saying you're accusing me or anybody else of that, just saying in general)
Posted on 12/1/14 at 12:19 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
I don't think a lot of people going out of the theaters understand what they saw
Count me in this bunch.
Saw it twice, second time I just sat back and enjoyed the ride.
Posted on 12/1/14 at 12:31 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:and it shouldnt. the idea that the universe is infinite makes no sense as well. our human brains incapable of understanding higher dimensions.
That makes no sense to me.
Posted on 12/1/14 at 12:35 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:
The problem with that is that you have to buy into the whole "infinite universes" theory for any of it to work.
You're in this thread speaking in absolutes about things that are only theories. Truthbetold, nobody in the history of mankind can possibly pretend to understand everything about the universe, so these theories that certain scientists have are, in essence, from a VERY small and short-sighted perspective (some being on a random planet in the universe called Earth). I feel like that's sort of what ULSaban was getting at when he initially joined the thread (but it then devolved into back and forth attacks basically).
But the bottom line is that "we" never evolve into those beings that save "us" in the movie if that wormhole isn't put there, so the fact that it was put there by "us" doesn't make sense within the framework of the movie. Sure, if you bring in different scientific theories , then it may make sense. But IMO a movie shouldn't require all of that...it should make sense within its own framework. And that's one reason I think some people were a little let down by the last act of the film. I know I was. And then once you bring in the whole "love is tangible/quantifiable and can affect things" angle, it gets a little more ridiculous.
Well, while I think you're largely right, there is a major theme and law at play in the movie, so much so that they named a character after it and openly acknowledge it: Murphy's Law. Murphy's Law I think can be somewhat used for to support the multiple universes theory that continually and endlessly sit from one another.
Posted on 12/1/14 at 12:38 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:whose to say that in the original timeline without the wormhole that humans didnt find a way to barely survive and evolve to higher dimensional beings, and from that point manipulate the past the way they wanted. Maybe in some way that lead to some optimal level of the human population.
but the issue still remains that at the point of the present (for the movie), we aren't evolved into those beings yet...so if it truly is "us" who sent the wormhole, then that can't exist because without it,
Remember Caine's line to chastain about the gravity equation when they were running tests: "It only needs to work once."
You can apply that sort thinking to this situation in my opinion.
This post was edited on 12/1/14 at 12:41 pm
Posted on 12/1/14 at 12:42 pm to jeff5891
quote:
Remember Caine's line to chastain about the gravity equation when they were running tests: "It only needs to work once."
Nice and subtle. Plus I just made that connection with Murphy's Law in what could be a big part of the story.
Posted on 12/1/14 at 12:48 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:
The problem with that is that you have to buy into the whole "infinite universes" theory for any of it to work.
Some of the backstory of this movie is really really interesting.
If you are at all interested, read the Science of Interstellar. It doesn't answer EVERYTHING...but it gives an interesting insight of the hows and whys from the guy who basically came up with the backbone of it. (He is the same guy Sagan consulted for technical elements of Contact.)
Also explains the parts where Nolan knowingly used artistic license for the sake of the movie.
Its a little dry though...which makes sense being written by a theoretical physicist. Its not completely inaccessible to the layman though. I would read it in a physical format though. The illustrations help a lot to understand what the hell is being said, and it is frustrating to have to flip forward and back on the digital copy.
The gist I got from the ruleset of physics they used for the movie is that they didn't assume an infinite universes theory.
Could also be that all humanity didn't actually perish when push came to shove.
Just a small, beleaguered section did.....and that humanity eventually grew into 5th dimensional beings.
We don't know how it played out...and it would get too complex to even try to lock down the hows in the movie.
That is actually a recurring theme of the book....how many times Chris Nolan knowingly stepped away from truth for the sake of the fact that the vast majority of the movie going audience can't understand theoretical physics even if it is spoonfed in movie format....so shortcuts were taken.
EDIT: Seems the gist of it was already stated.
This post was edited on 12/1/14 at 12:49 pm
Posted on 12/1/14 at 1:00 pm to jeff5891
quote:
and it shouldnt. the idea that the universe is infinite makes no sense as well. our human brains incapable of understanding higher dimensions
Of course it should make sense. We're talking about a movie, not science. Sure, a lot of the actual science behind the movie wouldn't make much sense to me, because I'm not an astrophysicist. But the movie should damn well make sense to the viewer.
And to be honest, it makes sense, it just creates a paradox that is unignorable IMO, and it takes away from the movie big time for me.
quote:
whose to say that in the original timeline without the wormhole that humans didnt find a way to barely survive and evolve to higher dimensional beings, and from that point manipulate the past the way they wanted. Maybe in some way that lead to some optimal level of the human population.
The movie basically says that as clear as crystal..over and over. The crops are dying out, and the last one (corn) was dying out in another year. The whole point of the movie that was humanity (on earth) was literally going extinct. Thus the point for the missions, and the overarching point of Brand's equation being meaningless (black hole info notwithstanding). The idea was to send out 12 ships to potentially inhabitable planets and start "humanity" anew on those planets. It wasn't about saving Earth or the people on it...it was about creating a way for "humanity" to survive.
So no, I don't believe that we're supposed to be like "Well, maybe humans ended up finding a way to survive" because the whole film very clearly tells us that it's all moot.
quote:
Remember Caine's line to chastain about the gravity equation when they were running tests: "It only needs to work once." You can apply that sort thinking to this situation in my opinion.
Right, but that was based on lies so you can't apply it. He was telling her that to give her something to work toward, because had he told her that it was all bullshite and that he had solved it decades earlier and that it was useless, she wouldn't have had any initiative or incentive to keep working on it to try to find a solution.
Posted on 12/1/14 at 1:14 pm to Large Farva
quote:
So I'm not reading every page, but I saw it two days ago. First off, one of the best movies I have ever see. Hands down.
Honest question: How old are you?
Posted on 12/1/14 at 1:19 pm to OMLandshark
quote:This makes very little sense, but more importantly, isn't on point. The 5ths never had a beginning. Why? Humanity died out before we could reach that point. It was over. Done.
Yes they could. You're still thinking of time as if it were a straight line. Theoretically, it is not. It is the only way we as beings can perceive it, but we don't experience it that way either. Time for us is merely a point. Things that have happened in the past and things that will happen in the future we can only remember or anticipate.
If you do even something slightly different at one point, then the changes can huge. What if a person in charge of our nuclear missiles mistake a flock of geese for a Russian warhead and decided to unleash their own missiles in freak retaliation. What if the head of admissions to an art school decided to give a kid a chance? What if you thrust slightly differently during sex, and it changes who your child is in another reality. It is really humbling to think that the mere swimming of a single microscopic cell is solely responsible for all of humanities triumphs and disasters. The chances of you existing are one in hundreds upon hundreds of trillions. Every minute step in history has led to you.
So if timelines can be split, why is it fair to assume that these 5th dimensional beings aren't from another reality where the Blight never took place? What if thanks to this always happening, then the fifth dimensional beings are still them from the future, but they later went on to join their alternate reality counterparts in the fifth dimension? Time is completely irrelevant for 5th dimensional beings, as is a plain of existence. I think their only priorities would to be all knowing and assist other creatures to join them in their reality.
Posted on 12/1/14 at 1:24 pm to jeff5891
quote:
whose to say that in the original timeline without the wormhole that humans didnt find a way to barely survive and evolve to higher dimensional beings, and from that point manipulate the past the way they wanted.
Therefore rendering the entire movie pointless.
Posted on 12/1/14 at 1:28 pm to AlxTgr
Just a slight change of topic, but I would imagine it would have some interest to this thread, (well at least to me it does)
With access doors at Space Launch Complex 37 opened on Nov. 24, 2014, the Orion spacecraft and Delta IV Heavy stack is visible in its entirety inside the Mobile Service Tower where the vehicle is undergoing launch preparations. Orion will make its first flight test on Dec. 4 with a morning launch atop the United Launch Alliance Delta IV Heavy rocket. Orion’s crew module is underneath the Launch Abort System and nose fairing, both of which will jettison about six minutes, 20 seconds after launch. The tower will be rolled away from the rocket and spacecraft 8 hours, 15 minutes before launch to allow the rocket to be fueled and for other launch operations to proceed. The spacecraft will orbit the Earth twice, including one loop that will reach 3,600 miles above Earth. No one will be aboard Orion for this flight test, but the spacecraft is being designed and built to carry astronauts on exploration missions into deep space. Launch is scheduled for Thursday, Dec. 4 at 7:05 a.m. EST, the opening of a 2 hour, 39-minute window for the day. Image Credit: NASA/Kim Shiflett
With access doors at Space Launch Complex 37 opened on Nov. 24, 2014, the Orion spacecraft and Delta IV Heavy stack is visible in its entirety inside the Mobile Service Tower where the vehicle is undergoing launch preparations. Orion will make its first flight test on Dec. 4 with a morning launch atop the United Launch Alliance Delta IV Heavy rocket. Orion’s crew module is underneath the Launch Abort System and nose fairing, both of which will jettison about six minutes, 20 seconds after launch. The tower will be rolled away from the rocket and spacecraft 8 hours, 15 minutes before launch to allow the rocket to be fueled and for other launch operations to proceed. The spacecraft will orbit the Earth twice, including one loop that will reach 3,600 miles above Earth. No one will be aboard Orion for this flight test, but the spacecraft is being designed and built to carry astronauts on exploration missions into deep space. Launch is scheduled for Thursday, Dec. 4 at 7:05 a.m. EST, the opening of a 2 hour, 39-minute window for the day. Image Credit: NASA/Kim Shiflett
Posted on 12/1/14 at 1:40 pm to AlxTgr
quote:
This makes very little sense, but more importantly, isn't on point. The 5ths never had a beginning. Why? Humanity died out before we could reach that point. It was over. Done.
They had some sort of beginning, but it's not necessarily on our timeline. They did go off of a single timeline at one point, but once they became 5th dimensional, they didn't. Plus I don't think it was a 100% guarantee that all of humanity would have died off, just almost all of them to the point where it would be nearly impossible as a species to come out of it at least initially. So maybe they came back in time and tried to save humanity of a tragic fate rather than allowing them to starve.
But how they became fifth dimensional beings isn't the point. It's THAT they became fifth dimensional being is the point and the fact that humanity is merely in its infancy of potential and understanding. This is starting to remind me of when Inception came out, we endlessly debated whether or not the top stayed up or fell, when as I think most of us here at least now realize was irrelevant to the story at large, and all that matters is that Cobb has found peace.
Posted on 12/1/14 at 1:52 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
Plus I don't think it was a 100% guarantee that all of humanity would have died off, just almost all of them to the point where it would be nearly impossible as a species to come out of it at least initially. So maybe they came back in time and tried to save humanity of a tragic fate rather than allowing them to starve.
From another poster,
quote:
The movie basically says that as clear as crystal..over and over. The crops are dying out, and the last one (corn) was dying out in another year. The whole point of the movie that was humanity (on earth) was literally going extinct. Thus the point for the missions, and the overarching point of Brand's equation being meaningless (black hole info notwithstanding). The idea was to send out 12 ships to potentially inhabitable planets and start "humanity" anew on those planets. It wasn't about saving Earth or the people on it...it was about creating a way for "humanity" to survive.
So no, I don't believe that we're supposed to be like "Well, maybe humans ended up finding a way to survive" because the whole film very clearly tells us that it's all moot.
quote:Not to me. There was an end. This is not like the top at all. This is people from the future affecting a past to get to that future.
But how they became fifth dimensional beings isn't the point. It's THAT they became fifth dimensional being is the point and the fact that humanity is merely in its infancy of potential and understanding
Posted on 12/1/14 at 1:59 pm to iwyLSUiwy
quote:
Therefore rendering the entire movie pointless.
Then you missed the entire point of the movie.
It was never about the survival of humanity.
It was about the power of aspiration, and how crippled we are without it.
If humanity was to die, it would have only been because people gave up. In ANY interpretation or multiple time line argument.
"Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage, rage, against the dying of the light."
Posted on 12/1/14 at 2:12 pm to AlxTgr
quote:
Not to me. There was an end. This is not like the top at all. This is people from the future affecting a past to get to that future.
I think if you got the concept of a 5th dimensional being, you would not be asking how they got there. It's just that they got there, and it's as simple as that. I don't care how it happened, it's just that it happened. Murphy's Law.
Posted on 12/1/14 at 2:19 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
I think if you got the concept of a 5th dimensional being, you would not be asking how they got there. It's just that they got there, and it's as simple as that. I don't care how it happened, it's just that it happened. Murphy's Law.
That's convenient. quote:Because you have no idea.
I don't care how it happened, it's just that it happened.
quote:...contains a can.
Murphy's Law.
Posted on 12/1/14 at 2:19 pm to Volvagia
quote:Ah, so it was actually, The Village.
Then you missed the entire point of the movie.
It was never about the survival of humanity.
It was about the power of aspiration, and how crippled we are without it.
If humanity was to die, it would have only been because people gave up. In ANY interpretation or multiple time line argument.
"Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage, rage, against the dying of the light."
Posted on 12/1/14 at 2:23 pm to OMLandshark
quote:
This is starting to remind me of when Inception came out, we endlessly debated whether or not the top stayed up or fell, when as I think most of us here at least now realize was irrelevant to the story at large, and all that matters is that Cobb has found peace.
Not even remotely IMO. The top is pretty irrelevant to Inception, like you said. But Interstellar is a bit deeper than Inception, so these random "fifth dimensional beings" are absolutely relevant to the entire plot of the movie. If "they/we" are end-all/be-all beings that can manipulate and access space and time infinitely, then it seems a bit unnecessary to have Cooper get on a ship and try to "save the world" when these things are clearly capable of doing just that. You, yourself, even said that they are "god-like" beings in a way. So how can you disagree that it's one of the biggest deux ex machina devices of all time?
Page 78 of 86
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News