re: Looks like Disney might be coming to grips with what they have done to the SW franchise

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Not to mention the toxicity of the fanbase


I have to agree with this. Whether you have a legitimate reason for liking or disliking the recent star wars films, there's just no denying there are so many toxic fans out there. I know the people who disliked TLJ aren't the only ones who are toxic. There's many who liked it who are part of that toxicity.

But I've got to say many people who disliked TLJ for legitimate reasons are kind of freaking me out. The Lord of the Rings holds a much closer place in my heart than Star Wars ever will. I loved the books and the films just as much as any Star Wars fan loved the original trilogy. But FFS as much as I hated the hobbit for it's complete bastardization of Tolkien's work (and the previous films), I still NEVER freaked out as much as Star Wars fans who hated TLJ have.

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Ya, i have to say the reaction has been over the top. Its not like Star Wars has put out consistently great movies and its not like TFA was some great reboot and enthralling movie IMO.

TLJ had tons of problems, was way too long but i feel like the main issue i've seen most people have was the way Luke was handled (i know there were tons of other problems but this seems to be the biggest sticking point).

To me at least, it seems like a lot of people are upset it wasnt' the Luke they had in mind and the direction they took him, they feel some sort of ownership of the character. That is why i say its not good to have a ton of expectations, it wasn't a great story but its the story they told and it has merit - i can see how Luke could have gotten to where he was as seen in TLJ.

Star Wars as a franchise is really one with incredibly potential but has fallen flat outside of the original trilogy and I personally enjoyed Rogue One a lot.

ETA: haven't seen Solo, not boycotting - just been busy.
Its probably my next movie to see if I have time to make it to the theaters soon.

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I don’t disagree with their conclusion as a broad point, but I would like to see broader numbers of disc sales as streaming is growing.

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The gap between TFA disc sales and TLJ disc sales is a much higher ratio than the overall decline in physical media sales since both releases. The difference in sales cannot be explained sufficiently by a decline in format popularity.

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Or maybe they had shite to do because it was the end of the school year. Or maybe they decided that they already watched two movies in as many weeks and decided to spend the holiday doing something outdoors with their families.

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None of this explains why the second weekend drop was 65% (almost but not quite as bad as TLJ's record 150 million drop of 67%) or why by the middle of week 3 Deadpool will be pulling in a higher daily gross.

We also haven't addressed the even worse foreign totals which are affected even less by the things you mentioned, if at all.

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Or maybe it's a combination of all of it

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I'm certainly not saying it's a single thing.

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extremely small percentage of that coming from the four people who have melted the most about TLJ

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You live and die off the anecdote and exaggeration. The melt was pretty wide spread and fueled by a condescending, defensive tone from both Disney and critics. I said last year that I don't think TLJ gets nearly the backlash (that's what this is) had reviewers not claimed it was the best SW ever. TFA and RO were really good and promising so on top of the reviews, hype was through the roof. And many people (casual and hardcore fans) saw through that and disliked it. Hardcore fans were certainly the loudest, but the casual ones (like me) came out with negative (and valid) opinions, too. Yet we get lumped in with the extreme psychos who tell an Asian actress she's better off dead. (Jordan Peterson explains this phenomenon well)

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Yes it does. Businesses financially plan around the end of the school year and beginning of summer for a reason.

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By its second weekend, most HSs and Colleges were done. This usually signifies an uptick in theater sales which is why May crosses the billion dollar mark more than any other month. So not only did it relatively "bomb" in its first week going from a 150 mill projection to 103 (4 day), the second week was arguably worse with literally nothing else being released in theaters because

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Businesses financially plan

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This^^^. Studios had planned for Solo to be huge and hurt any movie released in its first or second week. Even the 3rd week saw nothing (Ocean's 8 isn't a direct competitor).

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Are you claiming the foreign totals were influenced by TLJ. If not, this point is irrelevant. If so, feel free to explain that.

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TLJ's foreign gross was over 700 mill alone. Solo won't cross 200. Typically, a SW movie will see the foreign gross exceed the domestic. Rogue One was under by only 8 mill. Solo is looking like it will finish at a 205/160 split. And it's not a timing thing either. Best performing foreign grosses have come from multiple months: December (Avatar/Titanic/TFA), November (Harry Potters), April (Furious), June (Jurassic World), and yes May (Avengers).

So yeah, I think TLJ being a bad movie played a role. With more and more data being released about TLJ, it's obvious many people that like TFA didn't like TLJ and it has hurt Solo certainly to a larger extent than Disney will admit.

Again I would just like to see the actual comparison. I’m not disagreeing that TLJ underperformed on Blu-Ry because I didn’t think the movie was good for a number of reasons.

I'm actually optimistic that the backlash will eventually lead to Kennedy's demise. The more things are coming out about it the more it appears that all of this may be worth it to get the bad seeds out of there. Now if that happens, the question remains, will they then promote or hire the right person to put it all back on track?

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Its second weekend wasn't in May, and I'd say that depends on your area anyway. Most schools here go through the first week of June (Solo's third weekend).

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Eh. That was my point. Schools are releasing throughout May and most are out by early June.

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Comparing Solo to TLJ and Rogue one isn't apples to apples.

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Very few films are apples to apples. But it's the closest comparison we have because it's the same franchise with many of the same characters all happening in the same world. That's significant and can't be ignored. People have always gone to see SW simply because it's SW ever since the prequels.

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It was a 'new' story and a different type of film, with better marketing, and a better release date.

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1 for 4. Solo was a "new" story in the same world. I won't beat the release date argument to death anymore. The horse is dead. I've made my points; you've made yours (none). Marketing was bad, but that doesn't account for a 600 mill worldwide difference when, again, most people would see star wars no matter what. That's simply not the case with Solo and I think TLJ is mostly to blame.

I've got him in an actual discussion; I don't see the problem.

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Eh. That was my point. Schools are releasing throughout May and most are out by early June.

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Right, and my point was that the end of the school year is a busy time. Obviously the timing supports my point on that.

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Very few films are apples to apples.

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That's why it's odd to try to force the comparison.

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People have always gone to see SW simply because it's SW ever since the prequels.

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We've only had one other film that could even remotely compare to Solo, and it doesn't for the reasons I already pointed out.

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I won't beat the release date argument to death anymore.

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It's about time. I accept your concession.

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Marketing was bad, but that doesn't account for a 600 mill worldwide difference when, again, most people would see star wars no matter what.

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Obviously not.

I don't see why it's so difficult to admit that TLJ is only partially responsible for Solo's box office. There are several other factors that weight more heavily than a loud minority losing their shite about TLJ.

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I quit reading either of your posts.

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Obviously not.

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Have you covered A/S/L yet?

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No. But I can tell you're old af.