re: This is why James Harden is the MVP

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it's Harden Blowhards like OP that turn the average yet knowledgeable basketball fan off about Harden with nonsense like this.

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Which part of that chart is nonsense? Is it nonsense just because you don’t like what it says?

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Greek Freak did Greek Freak things at the highest level of his career to this point. Is what it is.

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It’s not a most improved player contest. It’s not an exceeded expectations contest. It’s the most valuable player.

The season James Harden had can only be compared in the history of the NBA to seasons Michael Jordan and Wilt Chamberlain had.

Giannis had a great season, but it’s a pretty standard MVP-caliber season. Harden’s season is an all-timer.

Another way to look at it is if the Bucks finished the season in 3rd, Harden would easily have beaten Giannis in the MVP voting. And if the Rockets finished first in the West, Harden easily wins the MVP.

And I think we can both agree on that. So what that tells me is that Giannis did not have the better season. The only reason he is getting as much MVP love as he is is because his team had a better record. That’s such a lazy way to choose the MVP.

If you look at the context of their seasons, Harden taking the Rockets from the 14th seed after 25 games into the season all the way to a potential 2nd seed by the end of the season with all of the injuries is much more impressive than what Giannis has done. Harden went supernova and put up insane numbers not seen since Wilt Chamberlain to carry his team from the bottom of the West to a top-5 record in the league. It is way more impressive than even the great season Giannis had.

I didn’t have a problem with Russ winning based on his numbers.

I had a problem that the goalposts moved by all of a sudden and winning didn’t matter anymore.

It seems like the criteria changes every year in favor of the non-Harden MVP candidate.

The only reason Harden won last season is because he had the best numbers and his team had the best record in the NBA, so it was undeniable.

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Which part of that chart is nonsense? Is it nonsense just because you don’t like what it says?

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It's blowhards like y'all continuing to beat the drum for Harden and making hyperbolic claims about him when a blind man can comprehend he's enjoyed a tremendous season, gets really stale and turns people off

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It’s not a most improved player contest. It’s not an exceeded expectations contest. It’s the most valuable player.

The season James Harden had can only be compared in the history of the NBA to seasons Michael Jordan and Wilt Chamberlain had.

Giannis had a great season, but it’s a pretty standard MVP-caliber season. Harden’s season is an all-timer.

Another way to look at it is if the Bucks finished the season in 3rd, Harden would easily have beaten Giannis in the MVP voting. And if the Rockets finished first in the West, Harden easily wins the MVP.

And I think we can both agree on that. So what that tells me is that Giannis did not have the better season. The only reason he is getting as much MVP love as he is is because his team had a better record. That’s such a lazy way to choose the MVP.

If you look at the context of their seasons, Harden taking the Rockets from the 14th seed after 25 games into the season all the way to a potential 2nd seed by the end of the season with all of the injuries is much more impressive than what Giannis has done. Harden went supernova and put up insane numbers not seen since Wilt Chamberlain to carry his team from the bottom of the West to a top-5 record in the league. It is way more impressive than even the great season Giannis had.

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Way to omit where I articulated you could make great arguments on both sides. no one's denying the season Harden submitted and he improved noticeably on D as well on the other hand Greek Freak might win DPOY in addition to MVP, submitted his best season ever, literally unstoppable, led his team to the no. 1 overall seed in the playoffs and HC advantage. you cannot impeach his dominance as a player, he's got it all and displayed that consistently throughout the season, as I already said "is what it is."

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Harden is clearly creates the most value for a team

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Would you agree that Russ clearly created more value for his team 2 seasons ago than Harden?


Please note, I didn't ask whether you were "ok" with Russ winning, that's not the question.

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You want to call Iggy the equivalent of Luc.

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Luc's factually the same type of player in terms of what he offers, to contend otherwise would be completely asinine, it's universally acknowledged that Luc was integral to Houston improving as a defensive team and both play the same position

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Maybe in rankings with the respective rosters, but not even close in reality. The context is that Iggy has the ability to be the most impactful player on the court at a given moment.

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Same as Luc as has been universally acknowledged

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To say otherwise is to be ill informed.

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I'm not saying that, I'm countering your asinine take about Luc with facts and reality but considering you lack objectivity when it comes to this, maybe I shouldn't entertain you further

How do they “hide” him? They dupe the opposition into thinking they have an advantage In the post but it is anything but an advantage. He is the top post defender in the league.

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So you were on this board saying Russ SHOULD win, is that what you're saying?

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No, because at that time, the precedent had been established that winning matters. The Thunder had the 10th best record in the NBA that season. Based on that, Harden was my pick.

But then the voters completely changed their criteria they had traditionally abided by.

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Seems like exactly what you're doing with the TPA criteria.

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I’m not. My criteria has always been best stats/individual performance is #1, and the team has to be really good. Top 5 or so. Doesn’t HAVE to be the absolute top team in my opinion. But that’s my own criteria.

But I understand that the voters typically vote for the best player on one of the best teams, if not the top team. But the vote for Russ was unlike any other.

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Again, that's fine if you think that, but I'm sure you realize it's not consistent with your OP.

I don't believe Harden has led the league in TPA in any season before this one, so based on YOUR OP's logic, you are saying he should have zero MVPs to this point.

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I’m not saying TPA is the be all end all. The reason I posted it was because it wasn’t even close. Harden is such an outlier this year.

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No, because at that time, the precedent had been established that winning matters. The Thunder had the 10th best record in the NBA that season. Based on that, Harden was my pick.

But then the voters completely changed their criteria they had traditionally abided by.

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So you admit that you're essentially doing the same thing, changing the parameters to always favor Harden, right? As long as you admit it, we can be done here.

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The reason I posted it was because it wasn’t even close. Harden is such an outlier this year.

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It was an even wider gap 2 years ago with Russ vs Harden, FYI.

They don’t dupe anyone into anything, they play to their strengths which is stashing Harden in positions where he is good (the post, although claiming he is best in the league is laughable) and trying to avoid him getting in defensive matchups where he is bad (everywhere else).

Harden is a bad defender. He does something well now, and it helps Houston immensely because they CAN hide his deficiencies with scheme, but he is still a bad defender overall.