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Started By
Message
1
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:22 pm to SlowFlowPro
quote:
They have a moving target based on emotions.
There is no way to know this. They might have an agenda, and likely do. They have an opinion. Opinion doesn't necessarily = emotion ESPECIALLY IN A PURELY SUBJECTIVE EXERCISE.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:23 pm to shel311
Lol then editorialized it in other posts. You’re either incredibly stupid or dishonest.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:24 pm to therick711
quote:
There is no way to know this
This thread shows that "moving target based on emotions"
Shel and I aren't even making arguments about the players anymore. It's about getting Thanos and Madking to admit their set criteria so we can have that argument. They keep refusing to answer and hiding behind non-answers.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:24 pm to Madking
quote:
Quoting me by leaving out the bulk of the post
quote:
Lol then editorialized it in other posts.
Which is it?
It can't be both, try to keep up here. Tell me which of your 2 statements you want me to go with and which one you now realize was wrong.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:24 pm to shel311
And how is that a different logic? You’re argument against was proportionally it’s not the same which doesn’t mean anything because it’s the same standards, proportion doesn’t matter.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:25 pm to shel311
Are you really suggesting that you didn’t type different things In several different posts? My god man.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:26 pm to Madking
quote:Stafford, Montana, Lebron, Kobe
And how is that a different logic?
1 of these is not like the other...
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:27 pm to Madking
quote:it's ok to admit you were wrong and didn't realize when you literally said I left out the bulk of your post that I quoted your exact post.
Are you really suggesting that you didn’t type different things In several different posts? My god man.
It'll all be fine that you were wrong. Pretending it didn't happen, that's where you'll get folks pointing and laughing at you. That won't happen if you just concede you were wrong when everyone can see the posts where you contradicted yourself.
Your choice
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:28 pm to SlowFlowPro
Another moving goalpost. Nobody set criteria, it’s been a point, counter point discussion but of course now you add in a straw man that conveniently only applies to one side.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:28 pm to shel311
Again you deflect
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:29 pm to Madking
quote:
Again you deflect
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:29 pm to SlowFlowPro
Well wait, I thought it was answers based on emotion. Now it is non-answers. I understand what is being argued on both sides. It boils down to subjectively they don't like Lebron and you and shel do.
For shel, he wanted an answer about where to rank Russell because if he isn't number 1 then winning doesn't matter as much as the other side thinks. Thanos cited Chamberlain. All of this is pretty standard.
For you, you started by arguing they said winning was all that matters. You did this by taking the argument to the extreme with Cousey or whatever. They stayed dug in that they like other players more than Lebron largely on the back of winning.
When they didn't yield, you called them "emotional" which apparently is the worst thing in the world on the internet. The sole problem here is subjective rankings aren't subject to objective measurement and emotion is allowed to play a part in that.
For shel, he wanted an answer about where to rank Russell because if he isn't number 1 then winning doesn't matter as much as the other side thinks. Thanos cited Chamberlain. All of this is pretty standard.
For you, you started by arguing they said winning was all that matters. You did this by taking the argument to the extreme with Cousey or whatever. They stayed dug in that they like other players more than Lebron largely on the back of winning.
When they didn't yield, you called them "emotional" which apparently is the worst thing in the world on the internet. The sole problem here is subjective rankings aren't subject to objective measurement and emotion is allowed to play a part in that.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:29 pm to shel311
Pretending you only made one post about the mirror held up to your logic is blatantly dishonest.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:38 pm to shel311
quote:
Russell’s combo of stats and winning falls only a hair short.
I saw Russell.
he was the difference.
he owned the paint.
he blocked wilt over and over with the series on the line.
its silly to compare with shooters. he was a piece operated by Red Auerbach.
they had everything.
artist point guard.
great outside shooter 6 8.
his skill mattered then and matters now.
there's no one like him right now.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:40 pm to therick711
quote:But objectively, they've demonstrated contradictions in their ratings based on their actual words, not SFP and my opinions.
Well wait, I thought it was answers based on emotion. Now it is non-answers. I understand what is being argued on both sides. It boils down to subjectively they don't like Lebron and you and shel do.
Also, 1 dude will only argue Lebron as having 3 titles, so that is a big wrench in your argument. I know you're playing mediator, and I like it, it's a different perspective in here. But that one point alone kinda kills any ability to state the other side is being rational or logical or whatever.
And to SFP's point earlier, if they said Kobe over LEbron then gave a list of reasons, fine. We may not agree, we certainly would not, but they would have given a list of reasons. The only reason given was Kobe has 5 and Lebron 4(or 3) but nothing else was given. So if that is the only or at the very least, the overwhelming reason, then logic would dictate Russell HAS to be your #1 and if he's not, then you have very contradictory reasonings that simply can' be argued with logic.
quote:The sole problem is a moving goalpost stating rings have to matter but then clearly admitting that they don't ALWAYS have to matter, just when it fits their narrative. I mean, that's kinda exactly what happened, right?
The sole problem here is subjective rankings aren't subject to objective measurement and emotion is allowed to play a part in that.
This post was edited on 5/23/23 at 3:42 pm
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:42 pm to shel311
LeBron at 38 dragged a below average team to the Western Conference Finals and played great doing it. He is a marvel if you ask me. I don't like him that much as a person, but you can't let that cloud your judgement of him as a player.
Posted on 5/23/23 at 3:49 pm to shel311
quote:
And to SFP's point earlier, if they said Kobe over LEbron then gave a list of reasons, fine. We may not agree, we certainly would not, but they would have given a list of reasons. The only reason given was Kobe has 5 and Lebron 4(or 3) but nothing else was given. So if that is the only or at the very least, the overwhelming reason, then logic would dictate Russell HAS to be your #1 and if he's not, then you have very contradictory reasonings that simply can' be argued with logic.
That's all fair. It largely remains subjective though. I could, for instance, argue that Kobe played in the West his entire career and the West was far and away the better conference for his entire career. Lebron, on the other hand, shopped super teams in the East for most of his career and orchestrated teams that bent the competitive balance of the league by securing agreeements for players to take less than they would get in the open market to title chase. When that strategy reached its logical end, he then went to a team with young pieces where he could get the max to shop some more.
Lebron's wins were just as much about gaming league rules as they were about basketball mastery. We'll never know how good he really would have been during his prime because he shared the floor with 2 other top ten players who required heavy usage.
Kobe is better because he built with one team, didn't try to game league competitive balance controls, and performed on teams where he was the unquestioned alpha during his prime.
This post was edited on 5/23/23 at 3:50 pm
Posted on 5/23/23 at 4:15 pm to therick711
quote:
I thought it was answers based on emotion
Answers? No. Arguments.
This is the statement of mine you quoted.
quote:
The problem is you're not using any actual criteria. You're using your feelings to make emotional arguments without factual or logical structure.
quote:
Now it is non-answers.
No. Arguments.
quote:
It boils down to subjectively they don't like Lebron and you and shel do.
I don't particularly like Lebron. He's just the elite of the elite when it comes to the NBA. And clearly better than Kobe.
quote:
When they didn't yield, you called them "emotional"
Because they are using moving standards due to disliking Lebron and/or liking Kobe (not sure where the weights fall on the measure)
quote:
which apparently is the worst thing in the world on the internet.
Because logic is extremely valuable online, especially in online discussions. Emotional thinking negates logical thinking.
quote:
The sole problem here is subjective rankings aren't subject to objective measurement and emotion is allowed to play a part in that.
But the point I was making is we can't even have those rankings until people like Thanos and MK actually state their criteria and stop changing it for guys they like/don't like.
This post was edited on 5/23/23 at 4:17 pm
Posted on 5/23/23 at 4:26 pm to SlowFlowPro
Wow, your lack of self awareness and ability to invert reality is incredible.
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