- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: Sign on bonuses with no matching raise the next year
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:17 pm to HogFanfromHTown
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:17 pm to HogFanfromHTown
quote:
Don't act like you didn't phrase it that way intentionally to make me sound ridiculous. You're trying to have a "I'm smarter than you and you're entitled post"
You’re the one asking if you’re in the wrong assuming you’re entitled to the same money. I merely asked you to explain why. The fact you’re so defensive about it reveals a lot. You said you thought it was intrinsically bad that your total compensation from one year to the next, when the first year included a bonus. That implies the thought that you are entitled to said bonus amount the next year. A bonus is not a guaranteed incentive.
quote:
I don't think I'm entitled to a damn thing. I think I've EARNED to be paid more by providing savings over 4x what I'm being paid and I was given an exemplary performance review so obviously they agree I'm doing a great job. I believe I've earned the pay.
Finally. A legitimate response, now we can get somewhere.
For starters, what are the 4x savings you provided the company? If you explained that somewhere else in the thread, I apologize, I did not see it.
Secondly, now we can have a different discussion. The signing bonus is a one time incentive. It is not part of your overall compensation package. Regardless of what you believe you have or have not earned, it does not factor into your future compensation calculation. Let’s get that out of the way.
If you truly think you’re deserving of a higher than 3% raise, go talk to your boss and lay out your reasoning. You could have laid it out in your first post. However, your post was just that since you were paid a bonus of X, you deserve to get X the following year. That is just completely flawed understanding of what a bonus is, thus my original question.
1
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:18 pm to lynxcat
quote:
I’m kind of shocked at how annoyed you are over what likely amounts to a couple thousand dollars.
I'm kind of shocked you haven't realized it's more about the principle than the actual compensation.
quote:
The delta is $2,400 in compensation that is making you jaded towards your role
No it's making me jaded about my company and what it values in employees.
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:22 pm to HogFanfromHTown
quote:
This is too general of a question. Why are they traveling? What do they do? Do they do a different function when they're traveling? I have no idea what kind of value this hypothetical person is providing so there's no right way to answer that question.
How about this?
An employee is assigned a project site away from their home office. We will say 2-3 hrs away. Their company provides them a lump sum per month per diem for expenses while they are away. The following year, they are back in the office and not receiving the per diem, should the employee come to a message board and bitch because their total compensation was less than the previous year?
quote:
No it's making me jaded about my company and what it values in employees.
Obviously the company values you are they would not have offered you a raise.
This post was edited on 4/10/19 at 9:25 pm
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:23 pm to HogFanfromHTown
So follow up question. Will you think your company treats you or another employee unfairly if you receive a bonus one year but not the next?
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:24 pm to GoCrazyAuburn
quote:
That implies the thought that you are entitled to said bonus amount the next year.
Again I don't think I'm entitled to anything. YOU think that implies entitlement. What it actually implies is I perceive it to be wrong to compensate someone less than what they previously were being compensated at. It doesn't imply that I'm entitled. YOU believe that's what it means
quote:
However, your post was just that since you were paid a bonus of X, you deserve to get X the following year. That is just completely flawed understanding of what a bonus is, thus my original question.
Not at all. Your post displays a flawed understanding in total compensation and what it intrinsically means to an employee.
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:25 pm to GoCrazyAuburn
quote:
Will you think your company treats you or another employee unfairly if you receive a bonus one year but not the next?
If I or another individual has provided equal or more value to the corporation yes.
This post was edited on 4/10/19 at 9:26 pm
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:25 pm to HogFanfromHTown
If you can earn a salary greater than what your current employer is offering, then it’s a free market and you can go offer your services elsewhere.
The premise of your argument is flawed inherently but you can believe whatever you want about how your employer values it’s employees.
This entire thread is like an emotional argument with a SO who doesn’t care about rational counterpoints and only wants you to acknowledge their feelings even if they are irrational.
The premise of your argument is flawed inherently but you can believe whatever you want about how your employer values it’s employees.
This entire thread is like an emotional argument with a SO who doesn’t care about rational counterpoints and only wants you to acknowledge their feelings even if they are irrational.
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:28 pm to lynxcat
quote:
This entire thread is like an emotional argument with a SO who doesn’t care about rational counterpoints and only wants you to acknowledge their feelings even if they are irrational.
How are my opinions in anyway irrational? I have given specific, rational answers and whether you perceieve this as "feelings" is your own problem.
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:29 pm to HogFanfromHTown
quote:
Again I don't think I'm entitled to anything. YOU think that implies entitlement. What it actually implies is I perceive it to be wrong to compensate someone less than what they previously were being compensated at. It doesn't imply that I'm entitled. YOU believe that's what it means
You’re the one that claimed it’s intrinsically wrong for you to earn less in one year than another, when one year includes a one time bonus. If you are being wronged in that scenario, you believe something you are owed is being taken from you, aka it is entitled to you.
quote:
Not at all. Your post displays a flawed understanding in total compensation and what it intrinsically means to an employee.
I’ll gladly let you explain how my understanding of compensation is wrong. I’m all ears.
This post was edited on 4/10/19 at 9:36 pm
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:32 pm to rowbear1922
quote:
An employee is assigned a project site away from their home office. We will say 2-3 hrs away. Their company provides them a lump sum per month per diem for expenses while they are away. The following year, they are back in the office and not receiving the per diem, should the employee come to a message board and bitch because their total compensation was less than the previous year?
This is still extremly generalized. What happened that made the person go back to the home office? What kind of position was it? Did they accomplish whatever goal the company was having them go to an off-site office for? Again, there's no real right way to answer this question.
This post was edited on 4/10/19 at 9:33 pm
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:35 pm to HogFanfromHTown
quote:
If I or another individual has provided equal or more value to the corporation yes.
Unless you have a set measurable bonus format that isn’t discretionary, this is part of your issue. A bonus is not a guaranteed benefit.
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:35 pm to HogFanfromHTown
I said you sounded whiny, thats not belittling you.
Welcome to the world of variable comp, like i said at least twice. There isn't a single person working in business with variable comp that hasn't been paid less than a previous year with the same role.
It's perfectly realistic to think you are being under paid for the work you do. The beauty is you can go find someone to pay you more if you are correct. But thinking that you shouldn't be paid less in variable comp from year to year is flat out wrong in the business world.
quote:
What it actually implies is I perceive it to be wrong to compensate someone less than what they previously were being compensated at.
Welcome to the world of variable comp, like i said at least twice. There isn't a single person working in business with variable comp that hasn't been paid less than a previous year with the same role.
It's perfectly realistic to think you are being under paid for the work you do. The beauty is you can go find someone to pay you more if you are correct. But thinking that you shouldn't be paid less in variable comp from year to year is flat out wrong in the business world.
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:37 pm to HogFanfromHTown
Compensation generally has three potential components: base, short term variable, long term incentive.
Base is you paycheck. This is “guaranteed”
Short term variable consists of a performance related bonus based of your individual performance and the company’s performance. This is not guaranteed.
Long term is incentives typically come in the form of RSUs (restricted stock units) with a vesting schedule over 3-5 years. These are typically granted each year and are an incentive for management (typically Director+) to stay with a firm for the long-term. This is sometimes referred to as “golden handcuffs”. This is generally guaranteed in number of shares but value will vary based on the current share price (in the case of a public company).
You cannot take variable forms of compensation that are not guaranteed (by definition) and include them when comparing total compensation over time.
Base is you paycheck. This is “guaranteed”
Short term variable consists of a performance related bonus based of your individual performance and the company’s performance. This is not guaranteed.
Long term is incentives typically come in the form of RSUs (restricted stock units) with a vesting schedule over 3-5 years. These are typically granted each year and are an incentive for management (typically Director+) to stay with a firm for the long-term. This is sometimes referred to as “golden handcuffs”. This is generally guaranteed in number of shares but value will vary based on the current share price (in the case of a public company).
You cannot take variable forms of compensation that are not guaranteed (by definition) and include them when comparing total compensation over time.
This post was edited on 4/10/19 at 9:38 pm
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:37 pm to HogFanfromHTown
quote:
What happened that made the person go back to the home office?
Project ends; back at the office to begin work on a new project.
quote:
What kind of position was it?
Staff position. All staffers are paid the same per diem.
quote:
Di they accomplish whatever goal the comoany was having them go to an off-site office for?
Yes, project is complete.
quote:
Again, there's no real right way to answer this question.
You can't answer it because it directly goes against your flawed premise. The employee would make DRASTICALLY less in total compensation. Btw, this isn't just a hypothetical but real life.
This post was edited on 4/10/19 at 9:40 pm
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:39 pm to HogFanfromHTown
quote:
If I or another individual has provided equal or more value to the corporation yes.
you weren't given a performance bonus, you were given a hiring bonus. It had ZERO to do with your performance.
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:40 pm to HogFanfromHTown
You are a freaking idiot. Reading this is like it’s like trying to make sense of something to a goddamn woman! You got a bonus before you started for going to the company. Over and done with it. Congrats! Then your yearly compensation started with your salary and then you got a freaking raise for the next year because you did such a great job. That’s how it works! Quit being a little bitch getting you’re feelings hurt about how your company values you.
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:40 pm to barry
quote:
you weren't given a performance bonus, you were given a hiring bonus. It had ZERO to do with your performance.
Eh, he was answering my general question more. I probably worded it poorly. I should have said it was a discretionary bonus.
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:42 pm to GoCrazyAuburn
quote:
You’re the one that claimed it’s intrinsically wrong for you to earn less in one year than an other, when one year includes a one time bonus. If you are being wronged in that scenario, you believe something you are owed is being taken from you, aka it is entitled to you.
Nothing is owed. Everything is earned. I believe I'm being wronged in that scenario not because I feel like I am owed something but because I have earned something. Language means a lot. Saying someone is entitled means they believe they are inherrentitly deserving of special treatment or privleges for doing nothing different, which is not what I am suggesting. I am suggesting that if your total compensation decreases from one year to the next that your company in insuaiting you are worth less and have not earned the same pay as you did previously. Far, far from "entitled"
This post was edited on 4/10/19 at 9:43 pm
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:43 pm to HogFanfromHTown
As you have not yet delivered the work product for the upcoming year on which your compensation is based, you have not yet “earned” anything.
Posted on 4/10/19 at 9:47 pm to HogFanfromHTown
quote:
Nothing is owed. Everything is earned. I believe I'm being wronged in that scenario not because I feel like I am owed something but because I have earned something
Then you probably should have laid this out in your first post instead of claiming your company is treating you unfairly because they didn’t match your sign on bonus in year 2.
quote:
Language means a lot.
We know. Most here have been trying to point this out to you for a few pages now.
quote:
am suggesting that if your total compensation decreases from one year to the next that your company in insuaiting you are worth less and have not earned the same pay as you did previously. Far, far from "entitled"
Your total compensation included a one time discretionary bonus. Why are you using that value in calculating your future compensation?
Page 6 of 18
Popular
Back to top
Follow TigerDroppings for LSU Football News