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Are my suspicion of financial fraud justified
Posted on 1/22/21 at 11:54 pm
Posted on 1/22/21 at 11:54 pm
I need some help understanding a financial matter involving my recently passed uncle. Shortly after receiving news of this week, an individual contacted my parents claiming that he owned the house and the property. He also moved very quickly to visit multiple business entities including the banks and funeral home claiming power of attorney but was quickly shut down since that power ceases upon death.
So far we have uncovered a quitclaim deed between my uncle and this individual back in 2017, but we’ve seen no evidence of any payment. Furthermore, we have also discovered a 30 or 40 thousand dollar home equity loan in my uncles name taken out the following year. How is that even possible if you’ve signed away the property?
None of what I’ve seen so far benefited my uncle. The home and the property have long since been paid for since it originally belonged to my grandparents. Secondly, if my uncle received any sort of financial compensation, why would he need to turn around and take out an equity loan a few months later??
My suspicion is that this individual convinced my uncle to deed him the property and more than likely convinced him to take out an equity loan afterwards as some form of payment. Nothing else makes sense. My uncle had a fairly nice income between his pension and social security so again I don’t see how this benefited him. Most concerning of all though is my parents. I don’t want to see them left holding the bag on a 30k dollar loan while this guy walks away with several hundred thousand dollars worth of property free and clear.
Apologies for the long post. It wasn’t easy to condense down
So far we have uncovered a quitclaim deed between my uncle and this individual back in 2017, but we’ve seen no evidence of any payment. Furthermore, we have also discovered a 30 or 40 thousand dollar home equity loan in my uncles name taken out the following year. How is that even possible if you’ve signed away the property?
None of what I’ve seen so far benefited my uncle. The home and the property have long since been paid for since it originally belonged to my grandparents. Secondly, if my uncle received any sort of financial compensation, why would he need to turn around and take out an equity loan a few months later??
My suspicion is that this individual convinced my uncle to deed him the property and more than likely convinced him to take out an equity loan afterwards as some form of payment. Nothing else makes sense. My uncle had a fairly nice income between his pension and social security so again I don’t see how this benefited him. Most concerning of all though is my parents. I don’t want to see them left holding the bag on a 30k dollar loan while this guy walks away with several hundred thousand dollars worth of property free and clear.
Apologies for the long post. It wasn’t easy to condense down
This post was edited on 1/23/21 at 12:12 am
3
Posted on 1/23/21 at 12:03 am to Blizzard of Chizz
I would contact a lawyer.
Posted on 1/23/21 at 12:10 am to James11111
My brother is in contact with local attorney. We live a thousand miles away though, so it definitely makes it a challenge.
I was just reading about quitclaim deeds and fraud and my heart just sunk. It appears they are a favorite of scammers to target the elderly. They typically involve someone close to the victim or a care giver.
I was just reading about quitclaim deeds and fraud and my heart just sunk. It appears they are a favorite of scammers to target the elderly. They typically involve someone close to the victim or a care giver.
This post was edited on 1/23/21 at 12:11 am
Posted on 1/23/21 at 12:28 am to Blizzard of Chizz
Sorry for your loss. Definitely contact a lawyer ASAP.
I’m not understanding how your parents would in any way be on the hook for anything? You mentioned your concern about them left holding the bag on a $30k loan but unless they co-signed, they wouldn’t have anything to do with your uncles’s debt.
I’m not understanding how your parents would in any way be on the hook for anything? You mentioned your concern about them left holding the bag on a $30k loan but unless they co-signed, they wouldn’t have anything to do with your uncles’s debt.
Posted on 1/23/21 at 1:06 am to Blizzard of Chizz
Contact the tax assessors office to see who has been paying taxes on the property, then have an abstractor go to the courthouse to see whose name is on the title of the house, and get the date.
Tax assessor: Verify who is paying taxes on property.
Abstract/Title Research: Verify Title owner of Property
Tax assessor: Verify who is paying taxes on property.
Abstract/Title Research: Verify Title owner of Property
Posted on 1/23/21 at 1:11 am to Lightning
Naturally I’m concerned. My parents are elderly and obviously my dad is overwhelmed with grief. I don’t want them stuck in the middle of a battle with a guy claiming ownership, and the bank. With my dad now in control of his bank accounts, I can see where it’s gonna lead. The bank is going to be very curious to find out how they approved a home equity loan to an individual who no longer owned the property if the quit claim deed is indeed legit. It’s not just a financial bag I’m worried about, but the emotional bag of dealing with this mess
Posted on 1/23/21 at 1:17 am to obdobd918
quote:
Contact the tax assessors office to see who has been paying taxes on the property, then have an abstractor go to the courthouse to see whose name is on the title of the house, and get the date.
Tax assessor: Verify who is paying taxes on property.
Abstract/Title Research: Verify Title owner of Property
What happens if these don’t match up? From what we’ve uncovered, he was still paying the property taxes.
Posted on 1/23/21 at 1:29 am to Blizzard of Chizz
A title company does all of this, and a lawyer will know which title company to work with.
Posted on 1/23/21 at 7:28 am to James11111
They could have executed a quit claim but not recorded it until after the HELOC.
Posted on 1/23/21 at 10:42 am to Blizzard of Chizz
like others have said in this thread.
- Contact an attorney
- Call a title company and pay for a full abstract/title search on the property. This will tell you who is on the title and if a quitclaim deed has indeed come into play. I don't know if the tax assessor will tell you who is making the tax payments, but you can try.
- In the mean time, I don't know what state you're in, but in Louisiana, you can go to the parish/county sheriff's office website and pull a copy of the tax statement (paid or not) and 99.9% of the time, the person on the tax statement, is the person on the title.
- Contact an attorney
- Call a title company and pay for a full abstract/title search on the property. This will tell you who is on the title and if a quitclaim deed has indeed come into play. I don't know if the tax assessor will tell you who is making the tax payments, but you can try.
- In the mean time, I don't know what state you're in, but in Louisiana, you can go to the parish/county sheriff's office website and pull a copy of the tax statement (paid or not) and 99.9% of the time, the person on the tax statement, is the person on the title.
This post was edited on 1/23/21 at 10:46 am
Posted on 1/23/21 at 1:12 pm to bubbz
Thanks for all the information guys. I just got back to Birmingham. The property is in Peoria, Illinois. My brother is the one taking the lead on this mess, but he seems as overwhelmed as my parents right now.
Posted on 1/24/21 at 10:49 am to Lightning
quote:
I’m not understanding how your parents would in any way be on the hook for anything? You mentioned your concern about them left holding the bag on a $30k loan but unless they co-signed, they wouldn’t have anything to do with your uncles’s debt.
Wouldn’t the debt be taken out of the assets in the estate???
Thus the heirs would get $30k less.
Posted on 1/24/21 at 12:58 pm to MikeBRLA
quote:
Wouldn’t the debt be taken out of the assets in the estate???
That’s kind of the problem. There is x amount in his accounts but you have to subtract out all his debts that need to be satisfied including the home equity loan. Where the home and property would be typically sold if need be to satisfy those obligations, this suspect quitclaim on the house and property that’s been in the family for 70+ years complicates things. Honestly, my gut tells me that once the bank learns that they issued a home equity loan to someone that potentially didn’t own the property it’s going to get really interesting.
Posted on 1/24/21 at 11:33 pm to Blizzard of Chizz
Ok, here is what I’ve learned using the advice given so far. In 2017 there was a split of the parent parcel of the land, creating two child parcels. There is also a record of sale by my uncle to this individual for 30,000 dollars. This property also has my uncle’s address (the property it was subdivided from) and a new address for the property that was sold. As for my uncle, he is still listed as the owner of the parcel of land in question. He also paid the property taxes totaling 2917.60 as of October of 2020. That would seem to explain how my uncle was able to get a home equity loan. Would this support mine and my brothers position that he still owned the house and property at the time of his death?
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