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re: We desperately need O to succeed because there are no guarantees.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 11:57 am to jgriffith
Posted on 6/13/18 at 11:57 am to jgriffith
quote:
Who could come in and be the guy that goes toe to toe for the west (and the playoff) EVERY season?
With Saban’s machine running two states over, who is going toe to toe EVERY year for the west? Auburn has challenged them the most the last few years, and while we’ve given them good games lately, we haven’t really challenged them for the division. Ole Miss gave them some fits two years in a row, but they won’t be doing that again anytime soon. Kirby is building something big at GA, but they’re in the east. Fact is, nobody is really going toe to toe with them on a yearly basis. Not until Saban leaves, or it all surprisingly crumbles to the ground. On the other hand, there were many many more MUCH better options than O out there to take a stab at it with.
1
Posted on 6/13/18 at 11:58 am to BayouBengals18
quote:
there were only a handful of coaches that wouldn’t AT LEAST consider LSU. Saban, Meyer, Dabo, Peterson, Harbaugh, and maybe 1 or 2 other coaches. Nearly any other coach would have at least had discussions with LSU.
Precisely.
Which is why the nonsense about how there were no available quality options after Jimbo and Herman is so mind blowing. Les Miles was all but fired in November of 2014, so presumably the AD's office began their coaching list white board that far back. To then fire him four games into 2015 and have nearly an entire season to go back channel searching for a replacement only to hire the god damned DL coach and his 10-25 career head coaching record is just astounding.
Essentially, they could not come up with a a better Plan C than Ed Orgeron after Jimbo and Herman in what amounted to a full year of searching for one.
Anyone REALLY buy that bullshite?
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:00 pm to BayouBengals18
agree wholeheartedly
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:01 pm to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
Les Miles was all but fired in November of 2014, so presumably the AD's office began their coaching list white board that far back. To then fire him four games into 2015
2015 and 2016, but agreed.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:04 pm to GeauxTigerTM
Alleva should've just made Aranda the head coach. I think most of us would've rather him given Aranda his shot than to give a loser a chance at redemption.
This post was edited on 6/13/18 at 12:05 pm
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:06 pm to jgriffith
quote:
Ok, fine, but who would you go for?
It doesn't really matter as only maybe 5 coaches out there would be considered 100% certain successes, and even that isn't true because it's always a crap shoot.
But...and this is VERY VERY important...there are ways to mitigate risk, right? If this were not true, football programs, both college and pro, would not bother to even TRY to hire who they feel is the best available candidate. They'd simply hire the first a-hole that walked into the facility and suggest that "Well...it's always a crap shoot so now wee need to see if this works out...so give him time."
That, I think, is a very faulty way of looking at hiring anyone, let alone the head football coach at LSU.
quote:
I cannot identify this person.
Again...admitting there is always risk in making a hire is NOT the same thing as suggesting that all risk is equal. We put the program in the hands of a man that had already shown he was bad at being a head coach in our conference and in our own division. Unless there were LITERALLY no other options, wouldn't hiring a guy that had at least not already failed once be a better risk?
I submit that this would be universally accepted if this guy's name was Frank Smith from Idaho instead of Ed Orgeron from LaRose. LSU fans would NEVER have supported the hiring of a coach with this poor a resume were it not for the spin that he's a home town boy getting his shot at his "dream job."
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:07 pm to jgriffith
quote:
think most of us would've rather him given Aranda his shot than to give a loser a shot at redemption.
Anyone with half a brain would agree, but there’s that vocal minority of the fan base that doesn’t agree because O is from Larose. Even though, when he was at USC, OM and Tenn, they said he was the dirtiest recruiter in the country and didn’t want him anywhere near LSU’s program.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:09 pm to BayouBengals18
quote:
2015 and 2016, but agreed.
I swear I have a lesion on my brain when it comes to those dates because I do that EVERY TIME!
Thanks for the correction.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:12 pm to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
LSU fans would NEVER have supported the hiring of a coach with this poor a resume were it not for the spin that he's a home town boy getting his shot at his "dream job."
I’ve brought up the Kevin Steele comparison before. Steele failed as a HC at Baylor, he went 9-36(1-31), but is a damn good DC and recruiter. Guarantee LSU fans wouldn’t want him as HC if he stepped in as an interim and went 6-2.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:12 pm to jgriffith
quote:
Alleva should've just made Aranda the head coach.
To be honest with you, there were guys I'd have preferred over DA out there who would have ABSOLUTELY taken the job. Not that I don't think DA has what it takes to one day be a great HC. Just that I'd have personally preferred we get a guy who had already done it before we go the coordinator route. Again...mitigating risk as much as possible where you can.
But...I think DA would have been on my short list for sure and would almost certainly been the first coordinator I had on the board.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:12 pm to GeauxTigerTM
You make very good points here, and I agree with you. This is why folks are so disgruntled with Alleva. It is his job to identify the "right guy." Oh well, I put that on the LSU Board. They'll soon be running Alleva's arse off IF a bad moon arises, and then we'll have to see if those jackasses can hire a quality AD that can hire a quality head coach.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:15 pm to BayouBengals18
quote:
Even though, when he was at USC, OM and Tenn, they said he was the dirtiest recruiter in the country and didn’t want him anywhere near LSU’s program.
This. I was really pissed at Miles for even bringing him in as I've read enough of Meat Market to know I can't trust this guy so I wanted him nowhere NEAR LSU's sideline.
When he was named Interim I started to squirm.
When they lazily named him Head Coach I nearly threw up.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:18 pm to GeauxTigerTM
Yep, the guy is a thug. We're rootin for him, of course, as we have no choice, but he's definitely a rough one.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:21 pm to BayouBengals18
quote:
I’ve brought up the Kevin Steele comparison before. Steele failed as a HC at Baylor, he went 9-36(1-31), but is a damn good DC and recruiter. Guarantee LSU fans wouldn’t want him as HC if he stepped in as an interim and went 6-2.
LSU fans didn't even want him as the DC because of his former HC resume for god's sake! And you're right, they'd have rightfully lost their shite had the AD tried to foist him on them as a replacement for Miles.
Honestly...while I can't live this way myself, I do understand LSU fans who both hated the hire of Orgeron AND don't think he'll succeed but have just resigned themselves to the fact that they're stuck with him so they are just going to accept it and quietly hope for the best. You know, more power to the guys that can do this...really.
But...I'll NEVER understand how anyone can, with a straight face, attempt to spin this hire in a positive light. No amount of retrofitting will ever change the fact that Joe Alleva CHOSE to replace a National Championship winning coach who himself had replaced a National Championship winning coach with a guy with a career head coaching record of 10-25.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:29 pm to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
don't think he'll succeed but have just resigned themselves to the fact that they're stuck with him so they are just going to accept it and quietly hope for the best
A poster here, and a good friend of mine, is like this. He knows O is terrible, but is hoping our talent and the good coaches we have on staff can outweigh that. It’s not going to be easy when they know they’re setting their guys up for failure, but they are just following the HC’s wishes.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:33 pm to BayouBengals18
Well, I do feel somewhat encouraged that Mr. Burrow trusted O and Ensminger with his son. I realize Busch was the real connection there, but the Burrows did spend a lot of time with O and Ensminger during the initial visit. Maybe just MAYBE some how some way Ensminger will do great things.
This post was edited on 6/13/18 at 12:35 pm
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:34 pm to GeauxTigerTM
quote:
Somewhere between Saban/Belechick and #100 you will run into a guy with a solid pedigree as either a head coach at a major program/smaller program who is looking for a bigger payday or step up into a top 10 program, or an up and comer who is looking for the same, or a high profile coordinator who is looking to make that big step into being a head coach.
I've thrown Matt Campbell's name out a few times on this board. Second winningest coach in Toledo's history. Then turned Iowa State around from a 3-9 to an 8-5 record. Turned down job offers from Belichick and Urban Meyer to be a HC. He's one of many examples that fits the above profile. However, in order to hire a coach like Campbell you have to do some work. You know, some actual research, send feelers out to multiple coaches who fit the profile, interview candidates, etc. Alleva wasn't interested in doing any of that. He just wanted to get back to the golf course as soon as possible.
This post was edited on 6/13/18 at 12:35 pm
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:34 pm to jgriffith
I bet used car salesmen love you.....
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:40 pm to jgriffith
quote:
Maybe just MAYBE some how some way Ensminger will do great things.
Two things.
I have no interest in bashing Steve Ensminger, who from all accounts is a good guy AND an actual Tiger, unlike Orgeron. Nothing I ever say about him is personal in any way.
But...he's like Orgeron in that he's a guy that no one else wanted and yet who we hired. Like someone said in either this thread or another today...programs with outstanding coaches get used to having to fend off rival suitors. Who is suiting either Ed Orgeron as their head coach or Steve Ensminger as their OC? On the other hand, didn't we just have to break open the Piggy Bank to pay Dave Arranda to stick around and not go to A&M?
We are in the same boat with both, hoping they perform better than they ever have in order to be at least as good as the regime we fired to get them.
Posted on 6/13/18 at 12:41 pm to BayouBengals18
I understand; I get what you're saying. Folks like the Burrows and I are gullible and easily duped. It is not the case regarding me. With LSU Football, I'm expecting the worst but hoping for the best. And no, interesting you brought it up, though, I know going into a dealer pretty much what that dealer paid for the vehicle and what he has in the vehicle after prep costs, if any to speak of. Granted, I'm fortunate that I have a dear friend who is a dealer, so he provides me with the LOAN value on the unit, an average of what other dealers across the country have paid for similar units, and his best hunch at what this particular dealer paid for the unit. I'll say this TRADE-IN value is a freaging joke!
This post was edited on 6/13/18 at 12:46 pm
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