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LSU basketball: Where do we go from here?
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:31 am
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:31 am
Sadly, yesterday provided us with several hard truths about the state of the program:
1. The team has quit on their coach and they will almost assuredly not live up to any of even the most minimal of expectations they had going into one of the most anticipated basketball seasons in recent memory.
2. LSU is never going to be a championship level program under Johnny Jones. He seems to be a great guy with a passion for LSU, but at some point reality has to set in.
With that being the case, why prolong the inevitable? IMO this is a critical time for LSU basketball. Even with the loss of (at least) Simmons and Hornsby, LSU still has some talent on this roster with eligibility remaining. Blakeney has had his struggles this season, but you can see he has the ability to be an All-SEC type player. Same for Victor. Quaterman also has great ability (you don't do what he did against UK and OU without it), but it's clear the relationship between he and Jones is broken. Sampson showed flashes. He can be a good player. Patterson has shown flashes. Even Epps has some ability. Now is the time to make a move to salvage the good that Jones has brought to the program, i.e. vastly improving the overall talent level from the Johnson era.
If LSU waits, then things could get much worse before they get better. Going into next season, the recruiting class doesn't look overly impressive (on paper). Couple that with the fact that (agree or not) the national narrative of Jones will be that he is a poor coach who completely underachieved with a superstar player and will never be able to win big at LSU. That perception can only hurt LSU's ability to reel in big-time talent in the future
Now is the time to right the ship. I still think LSU has enough talent on the roster to, with the right HC, compete at a high level in the SEC. My fear is that LSU prolongs the inevitable and then is forced to start from scratch again. The question then becomes who do you go with?:
Billy Donovan - While there is VERY little chance that he would leave OKC after one season, don't you at least have to make the call? Who knows, he is a life-long college guy who might be thinking maybe the NBA isn't for me. It would be a Saban-esque hire on the basketball side.
Steve Prohm - Unlikely he leaves Iowa St. after one season, but he is a young guy who has had real success (Murray St.) and knows Louisiana having coached here for 10 years as an assistant to Billy Kennedy. The worry is that maybe his success is can be attributed more to the coaches he replaced than him (Kennedy at MSU, Hoiberg at ISU)
Billy Kennedy - Would he leave one SEC school to come to another? He is a NOLA native though. Yes he went through a rough patch at A&M a few weeks ago, but he has them now competing for a SEC title and is starting to make some hay recruiting. Unlike Jones, he has a history of great success at prior stops (Southeastern and Murray St.)
Buzz Williams - Curiously left a successful Marquette program to take a seemingly lesser job at VT. Hasn't had great success yet at VT. However, if you like Bruce Pearl type showmanship, he is probably your guy. Texas native who has coached in Louisiana.
Tim Floyd - IMO he would crawl from UTEP to be LSU's head coach. He's had good success there and just about everywhere he's been. The downside is that he is 61 now and there may be a ceiling to his success. Still, LSU could do much worse.
Jerod Haase - young coach that was a long time assistant under Roy Williams both at KU and UNC. Has done a good job rebuilding the UAB program in his 4 years there. Is having a very good year this season and plays a relatively uptempo style of basketball. Kenpom numbers for UAB aren't great, so you worry if UAB's season is a result of Haase's great coaching or an incredibly weak schedule.
Kelvin Sampson - Is starting to breath life back into Houston, but you always have to worry that NCAA sanctions could be just around the corner with him. Still, the guy has won just about everywhere he's been.
Bruce Weber - May be on the way out at KSU. Still, he's had past success at power-conf. programs (including a Final Four). If you like the hires of Ben Howland and Rick Barnes, then Weber would fit that mold. You would have to think that LSU offers more advantages than Kansas St., right?
1. The team has quit on their coach and they will almost assuredly not live up to any of even the most minimal of expectations they had going into one of the most anticipated basketball seasons in recent memory.
2. LSU is never going to be a championship level program under Johnny Jones. He seems to be a great guy with a passion for LSU, but at some point reality has to set in.
With that being the case, why prolong the inevitable? IMO this is a critical time for LSU basketball. Even with the loss of (at least) Simmons and Hornsby, LSU still has some talent on this roster with eligibility remaining. Blakeney has had his struggles this season, but you can see he has the ability to be an All-SEC type player. Same for Victor. Quaterman also has great ability (you don't do what he did against UK and OU without it), but it's clear the relationship between he and Jones is broken. Sampson showed flashes. He can be a good player. Patterson has shown flashes. Even Epps has some ability. Now is the time to make a move to salvage the good that Jones has brought to the program, i.e. vastly improving the overall talent level from the Johnson era.
If LSU waits, then things could get much worse before they get better. Going into next season, the recruiting class doesn't look overly impressive (on paper). Couple that with the fact that (agree or not) the national narrative of Jones will be that he is a poor coach who completely underachieved with a superstar player and will never be able to win big at LSU. That perception can only hurt LSU's ability to reel in big-time talent in the future
Now is the time to right the ship. I still think LSU has enough talent on the roster to, with the right HC, compete at a high level in the SEC. My fear is that LSU prolongs the inevitable and then is forced to start from scratch again. The question then becomes who do you go with?:
Billy Donovan - While there is VERY little chance that he would leave OKC after one season, don't you at least have to make the call? Who knows, he is a life-long college guy who might be thinking maybe the NBA isn't for me. It would be a Saban-esque hire on the basketball side.
Steve Prohm - Unlikely he leaves Iowa St. after one season, but he is a young guy who has had real success (Murray St.) and knows Louisiana having coached here for 10 years as an assistant to Billy Kennedy. The worry is that maybe his success is can be attributed more to the coaches he replaced than him (Kennedy at MSU, Hoiberg at ISU)
Billy Kennedy - Would he leave one SEC school to come to another? He is a NOLA native though. Yes he went through a rough patch at A&M a few weeks ago, but he has them now competing for a SEC title and is starting to make some hay recruiting. Unlike Jones, he has a history of great success at prior stops (Southeastern and Murray St.)
Buzz Williams - Curiously left a successful Marquette program to take a seemingly lesser job at VT. Hasn't had great success yet at VT. However, if you like Bruce Pearl type showmanship, he is probably your guy. Texas native who has coached in Louisiana.
Tim Floyd - IMO he would crawl from UTEP to be LSU's head coach. He's had good success there and just about everywhere he's been. The downside is that he is 61 now and there may be a ceiling to his success. Still, LSU could do much worse.
Jerod Haase - young coach that was a long time assistant under Roy Williams both at KU and UNC. Has done a good job rebuilding the UAB program in his 4 years there. Is having a very good year this season and plays a relatively uptempo style of basketball. Kenpom numbers for UAB aren't great, so you worry if UAB's season is a result of Haase's great coaching or an incredibly weak schedule.
Kelvin Sampson - Is starting to breath life back into Houston, but you always have to worry that NCAA sanctions could be just around the corner with him. Still, the guy has won just about everywhere he's been.
Bruce Weber - May be on the way out at KSU. Still, he's had past success at power-conf. programs (including a Final Four). If you like the hires of Ben Howland and Rick Barnes, then Weber would fit that mold. You would have to think that LSU offers more advantages than Kansas St., right?
14
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:34 am to Alt26
I literally want none of those candidates.
Give me Archie Miller. I would give up every penny I had to contribute to getting Archie here. He has made Dayton into a virtual powerhouse
ETA: but I agree. Johnny is done. When a team gives up, the fans give up...thus, you cannot have a program. There is no hope for him here
Give me Archie Miller. I would give up every penny I had to contribute to getting Archie here. He has made Dayton into a virtual powerhouse
ETA: but I agree. Johnny is done. When a team gives up, the fans give up...thus, you cannot have a program. There is no hope for him here
This post was edited on 2/21/16 at 10:36 am
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:36 am to Alt26
Now this is a good thread. Even though I doubt johnny is gone.
Haase
Buzz
Weber
Would rather stansbury than Kennedy from tamu.
Haase
Buzz
Weber
Would rather stansbury than Kennedy from tamu.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:36 am to Alt26
They'll go get some fricking bargain bin candidate.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:38 am to LSUButt
Archie Miller is an awesome coach and all, but (and this is the main problem with the current state of the program and relevant for most top coaches) why would he want to come to LSU? Rather than either staying where he (they) are or also rather than going somewhere else before LSU.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:39 am to Alt26
I agree with your post and in fact would nominate it as something to be sent to Alleva- that is until you started mentioning replacement candidates. They are either completely unattainable or they are not ones that would get the job done.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:39 am to Alt26
Also would there be a chance at the NBA guy? Use to coach the bulls last year I forgot his name. Thibedeaux?
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:41 am to Alt26
Politics will get in the way as usual with the hiring/firing process.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:42 am to DollaChoppa
Yeah, there is little chance Archie Miller would strongly consider Lsu. When he leaves dayton, it will be for a huge job.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:46 am to Alt26
As it stands now, the same person who hired CJJ would select and hire his replacement.
Think about that for a minute and if you understand anything about management, you'll realize the odds are stacked against Alleva suddenly becoming smart or wise and making a good decision.
Think about the shitshow that was the CLM job drama last year. That's what Alleva is.
COULD Alleva blunder into a good selection? Sure, but highly unlikely, I wouldn't want to work for someone after the CLM incident.
Think about that for a minute and if you understand anything about management, you'll realize the odds are stacked against Alleva suddenly becoming smart or wise and making a good decision.
Think about the shitshow that was the CLM job drama last year. That's what Alleva is.
COULD Alleva blunder into a good selection? Sure, but highly unlikely, I wouldn't want to work for someone after the CLM incident.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:47 am to DollaChoppa
Agree dolla. LSU would have to really pony up some bucks, and likely promise dedicated improvements/funding to the basketball program to pull a Miller type.
Honestly, and we don't like to hear it, but Dayton is a better gig than LSU in basketball right now. Most P6 jobs are lateral or better jobs than LSU right now. Until we dedicate more resources to basketball, we get what we pay for.
We need to be realistic and know that a majority of that list would not take the LSU job. Hell, if you were an up and coming coach, would you see LSU as a great opportunity or a job where you lose some luster? We like to think LSU is a great destination, but in reality, today it's not. Reasons:
1. Poor admin support $$
2. Mediocre fan support
3. Shitty basketball conference
4. Basketball athletes don't grow on trees in La like football; La not a basketball state
Honestly, and we don't like to hear it, but Dayton is a better gig than LSU in basketball right now. Most P6 jobs are lateral or better jobs than LSU right now. Until we dedicate more resources to basketball, we get what we pay for.
We need to be realistic and know that a majority of that list would not take the LSU job. Hell, if you were an up and coming coach, would you see LSU as a great opportunity or a job where you lose some luster? We like to think LSU is a great destination, but in reality, today it's not. Reasons:
1. Poor admin support $$
2. Mediocre fan support
3. Shitty basketball conference
4. Basketball athletes don't grow on trees in La like football; La not a basketball state
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:47 am to Alt26
(no message)
This post was edited on 4/10/23 at 2:40 pm
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:49 am to LSUButt
Rod Barnes. I heard he has Cal State Bakersfield rolling.
Just kidding.
Just kidding.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:53 am to soccerfüt
Except Alleva didn't make the JJ hire, Collis Temple and Dale Brown did.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:57 am to DollaChoppa
Because Dayton, no matter how good they actually are, is not a household program. I've seen maybe one highlight of them all year. Money talks. Now, what are he odds LSU would pay 2.5 million? Slim to none. I know guys like Pearl, Howland, Avery were out of jobs, but they proved money talks. Howland turned down better jobs to go to Mississippi State because they paid the most.
We need some renovations in the PMAC, but our practice gym, locker room, training area is exceptionally good and way better than anything Dayton has. LSU has averaged over 10k in attendance this year, and several times drawn over 12k. Obviously that's because of Ben, but it proves if there is a reason to be excited, fans will show up.
We need some renovations in the PMAC, but our practice gym, locker room, training area is exceptionally good and way better than anything Dayton has. LSU has averaged over 10k in attendance this year, and several times drawn over 12k. Obviously that's because of Ben, but it proves if there is a reason to be excited, fans will show up.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 10:58 am to Alt26
CBI tournament
Posted on 2/21/16 at 11:02 am to Choupique19
quote:Alleva has been AD starting July 1, 2008.
Except Alleva didn't make the JJ hire, Collis Temple and Dale Brown did.
It was his responsibility, whether or not he allowed others to usurp his job.
As managers, he and Matt Millen have more in common than differences.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 11:10 am to LSUButt
I totally agree with you. Archie is a real winner and has basketball in his blood. He has done so much with so little.
Posted on 2/21/16 at 11:15 am to LSUButt
quote:
I literally want none of those candidates.
Give me Archie Miller. I would give up every penny I had to contribute to getting Archie here. He has made Dayton into a virtual powerhouse
I'm not saying any of those guys (except Donovan of course) would be home-runs, but I was just trying to be realistic. I would love to see Archie Miller come to LSU. I just don't think it's realistic for a few reasons:
1. He's in a position where he is getting paid well and having good success (albeit a bit more difficult, Butler, Wichita St. and VCU have show in recent history that a mid-major can make the Final Four). He's in a position where he can pick his next job if he wants to leave Dayton. Is LSU really more appealing than somewhere like Tennessee or Alabama?
2. It won't be discussed, but there are a lot of big money people who still want to get rid of Miles, which would be prohibitively more expensive than getting a new basketball coach. Would the boosters be willing to put up real money for a basketball coach while they are also chomping at the bit to let Miles go?
3. The university president and Governor have doubled-down on the fallacy that LSU is "broke". If the president (as reported) killed the football coach negotiations, LSU's biggest money-making sport by far, then how could anyone think he would allow the basketball program to spend money?
My list was guys that have won at other schools and would probably realistically consider the LSU job (Donovan being the outlier). Hey, I'd love to see LSU nab someone like Tom Thibadeau, Brad Stevens, or Tony Bennett from UVA. Unfortunately, I just don't think any of those guys are realistic possibilities
Posted on 2/21/16 at 11:16 am to Alt26
I believe blakeney transfers after the season then the new recruits come in and we finish with a losing record next season under CJJ
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