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re: if Baron brown situation happened at midfield, would it have been a fumble or incomplete?

Posted on 9/2/25 at 9:18 am to
Posted by 10SETiger
Member since Jul 2025
3 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 9:18 am to
THIS. The inconsistency of determining what is a catch is what is so frustrating. Why is it a catch/fumble for Sharp (who barely moved with the ball), but an incomplete pass for Brown who took two full steps, and hit the ground on the third step?

The rule of a catch should be applied consistently, regardless of where on the field the catch is made. As OP implies, I'm confident that Brown's situation would have been ruled a catch in the open field, but the zebras are obsessed with the catch "surviving the fall" in the endzone, regardless of how many steps the receiver makes after the catch.
Posted by JimTiger72
Member since Jun 2023
15393 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 9:23 am to
quote:

complete with him losing possession after hitting the ground therefore he's down right there.


This is the correct answer. The ball never touched the ground so it would have been a catch. The ball just moved once he hit the ground, but it would have been a catch.
Posted by Gonadballbarian
Member since Dec 2017
1414 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 9:38 am to
If you have control before you cross the goal line, then the play is over once you cross the goal. You don't have to survive the ground.
If there is no goal line and it's just a regular catch, then even if you do establish control you must survive the ground.
They used that second interpretation for the goal line, which was incorrect.

Edit-the only argument would be in a non-goal line scenario, and did the ball move enough to say he didn't survive the ground, or did he keep control and survive the ground with his hand underneath it. Obviously they thought the ball did move enough in the b. Brown play, so in a non-goal line scenario this would not be a catch according to that referee.
This post was edited on 9/2/25 at 12:42 pm
Posted by xraytiger
Colorado
Member since Jan 2005
708 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 9:45 am to
Incomplete
Posted by LSUBALLER
Louisiana
Member since Jul 2013
20321 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 9:52 am to
Down by contact. Ground can’t cause fumble. Was def a touch down we got hosed
Posted by tigerfoot
Alexandria
Member since Sep 2006
60496 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 9:58 am to
While I thought he scored, the refs put him in the going to the ground column, the ball can not move at all, arm under it or not. The ball did move a touch. While I think it was a score, personally. Once the determination was made that he was going to the ground, he had to have 100% secure control. The ball moved.
Posted by 33inNC
Charlotte, NC
Member since Mar 2011
6094 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 10:06 am to
Fumble? THE BALL NEVER LEFT HIS HANDS!!!
Posted by Dubaitiger
Abu Dhabi, UAE
Member since Nov 2005
5198 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 10:12 am to
quote:

Yep, and in this case once he crossed the plane with control, the play should've been over


Exactly...

Let me try and explain how it should be called.

A player should have to survive the ground when its a bang bang play, meaning they are stretching out to keep a foot inbounds while making the catch, actually thy could take a step but they are basically catching the ball while trying to maintain a foot inbounds, then they hit the ground immediately. That type of bang bang play, they should keep possession all the way to the ground or its an incomplete pass. However, if the ball slightly moves when hitting the ground, but it is still in their grip (hands or secured in the forearm) then it is still a catch.

The other way is not a bang bang play, like the Baron Brown catch, where he caught it, took 2-3 steps, crossed the plane with the ball totally secure and on the inside of the orange cone, took another step and fell out of bounds, with the ball slightly moving after him hitting the ground, but he still maintained possession. That play should have been over when he crossed the plane with possession!

I wanted to add that last year Kyren Lacy (May he RIP) had a catch like that where he took about 2-3 steps then went out of bounds and lost the ball when he hit the ground. The refs reviewed it and said he already had possession while making a football move or a move after the catch. Ruled a completion. That was the South Carolina game when we were making a comeback for the win. It was just under 2 minutes left and Lacy caught the ball around the 3 yard line took 2 steps in bounds, then 1-2 steps out of bounds where he was hit, then the ball came out when he hit the ground. The ref called it incomplete but the replay booth changed it to a catch.
This post was edited on 9/2/25 at 10:30 am
Posted by Willie Stroker
Member since Sep 2008
15519 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 11:00 am to
quote:

Ground can't cause a fumble.

I’ve stuck with thinking this is the rule for decades.

But now it turns out that the ground can cause a “not a catch” ruling. That ruling seems to be dependent on whether or not a “football move” was made, and whether or not the appearance of control was made, regardless of whether or not motion of the ball does not necessarily mean loss of control.

It doesn’t make sense to me, and every expert seems to make contradictory statements about such rulings.
Posted by Datbayoubengal
Port City
Member since Sep 2009
28786 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 11:16 am to
quote:

Also why I think Sharp's fumble wasn't a catch. He caught the ball and turned to take a step and was hit. No possession established thus no fumble. Should have been incomplete pass.
I'm gald I'm not the only one. Somehow they say Barion Brown didn't make a football move, but Sharp did? I didn't see a damn football move from Sharp.
Posted by Datbayoubengal
Port City
Member since Sep 2009
28786 posts
Posted on 9/2/25 at 11:20 am to
quote:


That is actually what I was kinda getting at...I don't think it was a deliberate, bone-head act by the review people and an utter failure to interpret a simple rule.
Disagree. 99.9% of the time, the refs would call that a TD
quote:

It is a complex deal and the loophole needs to be closed
It's not complex if it is almost never called the way they did that night.
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