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Message
re: BayouTraditions and similar NIL “collectives” are offensive.
Posted on 2/2/23 at 9:46 pm to Salviati
Posted on 2/2/23 at 9:46 pm to Salviati
You can post that list of yours over and over if you want, but it has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
NCAA athletics are not beholden to pure market forces and never have been.
As I said, NIL and free transfers were the result of lawsuits (or threatened lawsuits) and not due to the market.
The college presidents are against most of the changes that have recently taken place.
NCAA athletics are not beholden to pure market forces and never have been.
As I said, NIL and free transfers were the result of lawsuits (or threatened lawsuits) and not due to the market.
The college presidents are against most of the changes that have recently taken place.
2
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:02 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:Good because I will post it again.
You can post that list of yours over and over if you want, but it has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
quote:
NCAA athletics are not beholden to pure market forces and never have been.
Market forces have wholly shaped college football.
Market Forces
The market wants college football. The demand is in the amount of billions of dollars.
Many schools and most fans want successful college football teams. The demand is in the amount of tens of millions of dollars per school.
Successful college football teams require high-quality athletes.
The demand for high-quality athletes is very high.
High-quality athletes are in scarce supply.
Schools and fans are willing to pay for high-quality athletes. The demand is in the amount of hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars per high-quality athlete.
The Results of Market Forces
Stadium expansions, million-dollar coaches, palacial locker rooms, academic centers, dining halls, etc. are the direct result of market forces.
LSU day games, neutral site games, trivial bowl games are the direct result of market forces.
Super conferences, conference championships, and expanded playoffs are the direct result of market forces.
NIL collectives, newly created NIL programs, and multi-million dollar NIL deals are the direct result of market forces.
quote:NIL is a DIRECT result of market forces. If there was no NIL market, there would have been no NIL lawsuit.
As I said, NIL and free transfers were the result of lawsuits (or threatened lawsuits) and not due to the market.
quote:No. They're not. Or if they are, show me where that opinion is expressed. And even if presidents or professors occasionally complain about football programs, they are not going to kill the golden goose.
The college presidents are against most of the changes that have recently taken place.
This post was edited on 2/2/23 at 10:04 pm
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:07 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:
As I said, NIL and free transfers were the result of lawsuits (or threatened lawsuits) and not due to the market. The college presidents are against most of the changes that have recently taken place.
Come on, man. NIL and the transfer rules may have come about through different means, but they were absolutely driven by the same market forces.
The schools are making a lot of money and the players want a piece of the pie. Coaches make a lot of that money, have total freedom of movement (as long as schools can afford a buyout) and used to control when and if players could transfer, even if they were willing to sit for a year. Players want to be able to make a move without being held hostage (which was bullshite). The NCAA just handled the creation and implementation of the portal about as poorly as possible.
I agree that the the portal with a one time waiver and grad transfers and NIL are too much too fast and have destabilized things. But that doesn’t mean they were somehow artificial. Everything that is happening, from TV to conference expansion to NIL and the portal, are driven by the money in the sport.
All the NCAA had to do was enact their own more regulated version of NIL years ago and we wouldn’t be here. And if they locked down waivers (which it looks like they are doing now) and ended grad transfers, it would clean up the excessive use of the portal we see today.
This post was edited on 2/2/23 at 10:27 pm
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:10 pm to Salviati
The new NCAA president, hired by the university presidents, is former Massachusetts governor Charlie Baker.
He was hired specifically for his political experience to help the NCAA lobby for legislation to get around these new rules that were forced upon them.
They will be going for an antitrust exemption, which is about as far away from market forces as you can get.
If they are ok with the status quo, why are they fighting it?
He was hired specifically for his political experience to help the NCAA lobby for legislation to get around these new rules that were forced upon them.
They will be going for an antitrust exemption, which is about as far away from market forces as you can get.
If they are ok with the status quo, why are they fighting it?
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:17 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:
They will be going for an antitrust exemption, which is about as far away from market forces as you can get.
Dude, stop. Just stop.
quote:Because the status quo is not allowing the market to work properly. Anti-trust is a problem for football programs. That is precisely what I have been arguing throughout this thread. NIL is bent/broken because of market forces.
If they are ok with the status quo, why are they fighting it?
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:18 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:
If they are ok with the status quo, why are they fighting it?
USA Today Article
They are more worried about things that could be coming next. Things like collective bargaining, player unionization, and suddenly having to pay all student athletes directly and equally because of Title IX. All of these things are bouncing around in current proposals and litigation.
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:18 pm to misey94
quote:
NIL and the transfer rules may have come a bit through different means, but they were absolutely driven by the same market forces.
I’m not sure you understand what “market forces” are.
We have NIL today because state legislatures passed laws forcing it.
There is no definition of “market forces” that includes government mandate.
Come on man, yourself.
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:19 pm to misey94
By your incorrect definition, are those things not “market forces?”
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:26 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:
I’m not sure you understand what “market forces” are. We have NIL today because state legislatures passed laws forcing it. There is no definition of “market forces” that includes government mandate. Come on man, yourself.
Seriously? Why do you think the O’Bannon lawsuit was filed? It was a DIRECT REACTION to the same market forces that drive everything else in the sport. It was a play for players to get a piece of the college sports money pie. It may have been a different mechanism, but the motivations are all the same, and that’s what really matters.
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:30 pm to TigerFan244
How much of an idiot are you. You do not want the NCAA dictating or getting involved in the WW fiasco, but you want them to get involve in something you do not like. Make up your mind, do you the NCAA involved in college sports or not.
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:32 pm to misey94
Government mandates and laws are not market forces.
Forcing someone to do something through a lawsuit is not the free market in action.
If we can’t get past that simple fact, then we are just whistling past each other.
Forcing someone to do something through a lawsuit is not the free market in action.
If we can’t get past that simple fact, then we are just whistling past each other.
Posted on 2/2/23 at 10:54 pm to Bjorn Cyborg
quote:
Government mandates and laws are not market forces. Forcing someone to do something through a lawsuit is not the free market in action.
Money is the primary force at work here and it doesn’t just flow though free markets unimpeded. Markets here have always been subject to regulation and litigation.
The NCAA has always operated as a virtual monopoly and the only way to force them to change course has been litigation. The free market alone doesn’t work against a monopoly. This happened to deregulate the college football in 84, which opened the door to the TV deals and money we see in the sport today, and it happened again with the O’Bannon case.
Like I said, the mechanism used may not have been the free market, but the motivation behind the lawsuit was driven by money, just the same as the rest of the world of college sports. And the aim was to open up a new free market of endorsement opportunities for the players. Whatever you and I may think of NIL, it is most definitely a purely capitalist enterprise.
This post was edited on 2/2/23 at 10:55 pm
Posted on 2/2/23 at 11:19 pm to TigerFan244
This comes down to the initial greed of a few players, that will end up killing the goose that lays the golden egg.
It was the UCLA basketball player (I forget his name) that sued, saying the NCAA was using player likenesses to profit on things like video games etc. Once that avenue was pursued, and won in court, it became inevitable. There's just too much money to leave things well enough alone, so you knew right away some boosters would weaponize it and use it to buy players. Once one school (say, A&M last year; or say, BYU getting a ton of walk-on players good money a couple years back) does it, everyone else has to respond or get left behind.
And with a lot of it out in the open, it's leaving a bad taste in the fans' mouth, and will undermine the generational loyalties that prospered for going on a century. These aren't "our Tigers", they're Gordon's mercenaries. And guys like Howard who take the money, and run to another deal if they don't get what they want immediately on the field.
It'll still be fun to watch, but not the passion we had before. Who wants to watch a freshman look good, and then move in a year to UGA or Bama so they can make more money AND win a title?
It was the UCLA basketball player (I forget his name) that sued, saying the NCAA was using player likenesses to profit on things like video games etc. Once that avenue was pursued, and won in court, it became inevitable. There's just too much money to leave things well enough alone, so you knew right away some boosters would weaponize it and use it to buy players. Once one school (say, A&M last year; or say, BYU getting a ton of walk-on players good money a couple years back) does it, everyone else has to respond or get left behind.
And with a lot of it out in the open, it's leaving a bad taste in the fans' mouth, and will undermine the generational loyalties that prospered for going on a century. These aren't "our Tigers", they're Gordon's mercenaries. And guys like Howard who take the money, and run to another deal if they don't get what they want immediately on the field.
It'll still be fun to watch, but not the passion we had before. Who wants to watch a freshman look good, and then move in a year to UGA or Bama so they can make more money AND win a title?
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