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Message
re: Any Idiot Can Fire a Coach
Posted on 1/6/10 at 3:26 pm to ShortyRob
Posted on 1/6/10 at 3:26 pm to ShortyRob
There really isn't anything "obvious" at this point. A coach doesn't go from winning a NC to two years later being a total moron. Plus, heres a news flash ... money does matter. Lots of big talkers on this board who are great at spending the taxpayers' money ... fire the bum, pay his buyout!, etc. Doesn't work that way in the real world. If the TAFers of the world want to pony up the cake, that's one thing ... the wifebeater shirt brigade on here though needs to get a grip on reality.
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Posted on 1/6/10 at 3:30 pm to Stevo
I think a better argument could be made for his removal than his retention; however, there are legitimate arguments to be made on both sides of this one. Miles will be here at least through next season. I don't think anyone would dispute that.
I will say it this way .... it would be better for LSU football to remove Miles right now, than to wait for things to get worse. I believe that the longer he stays around the worse it gets. Hence, I would support his firing 100% were it to take place today. If that makes me a "ranter" than I'm fine with that. Understand, I would support his removal, not because of his record, but rather because of the way in which his team has performed in achieving that record. We are a sloppy, disorganized mess of a football team. This falls directly on Miles.
So, I pose this question to you SteveO. Do you believe Miles will be fired within the next two years?
And while I'm at it, one more question. If Miles is, in fact, fired within the next two years, would you still consider me a "ranter"?
I will say it this way .... it would be better for LSU football to remove Miles right now, than to wait for things to get worse. I believe that the longer he stays around the worse it gets. Hence, I would support his firing 100% were it to take place today. If that makes me a "ranter" than I'm fine with that. Understand, I would support his removal, not because of his record, but rather because of the way in which his team has performed in achieving that record. We are a sloppy, disorganized mess of a football team. This falls directly on Miles.
So, I pose this question to you SteveO. Do you believe Miles will be fired within the next two years?
And while I'm at it, one more question. If Miles is, in fact, fired within the next two years, would you still consider me a "ranter"?
Posted on 1/6/10 at 3:32 pm to ShortyRob
what you say is true shorty. however, the obvious to you just may not be the obvious to someone else and since you are not paid to make these decisions, i guess you're fricked. 
zook took a great team and it fell apart, miles took a 9-3 team and won a NC. by the way, by your definition, bear bryant would have been fired (twice). look it up. with something this important (and expensive), patience is the best policy. immediate action is not always the best action. maybe it will turn out that way (you, of course, are sure of it) and maybe it won't (i'm not so sure).
zook took a great team and it fell apart, miles took a 9-3 team and won a NC. by the way, by your definition, bear bryant would have been fired (twice). look it up. with something this important (and expensive), patience is the best policy. immediate action is not always the best action. maybe it will turn out that way (you, of course, are sure of it) and maybe it won't (i'm not so sure).Posted on 1/6/10 at 3:40 pm to LSU GrandDad
quote:
patience is the best policy.
Mega Dittos!!!
Posted on 1/6/10 at 3:50 pm to LJBurton
quote:
And while I'm at it, one more question. If Miles is, in fact, fired within the next two years, would you still consider me a "ranter"?
Very well could happen and I take no issue with that concern. I share it myself, though I don't want to see the program go through that. I take issue with any notion of firing him this year. It's not practical and would be unfair. He deserves the opportunity to show improvement regardless of how some believe he'll eventually fail.
Posted on 1/6/10 at 4:13 pm to Stevo
quote:
Very well could happen and I take no issue with that concern. I share it myself, though I don't want to see the program go through that. I take issue with any notion of firing him this year. It's not practical and would be unfair. He deserves the opportunity to show improvement regardless of how some believe he'll eventually fail.
I'm cool with that. Like I said, I think there are legitimate arguments on both sides right now. His record alone certainly does not merit a dismissal. At the same time, even the most ardent Miles supporters now admit there are serious problems with this football team.
Posted on 1/6/10 at 4:18 pm to just me
Sense when did u boys settle for moral victory's It was different when I went to Lsu. You all sound like Tulame.
Posted on 1/6/10 at 4:20 pm to ShortyRob
Isn't this what Florida did with Ron Zook? I don't think they waited around too long. I'd trade Miles for the Boise guy any day.
Posted on 1/6/10 at 4:55 pm to ShortyRob
quote:
After he totally collapses and has 2 or 3 six loss seasons or worse. There is nothing special about being able to discern the obvious AND it doesn't take an ounce of balls to make that call.
The real trick is spotting the obvious BEFORE the collapse and having the balls to make the decision. As the UF boss said; if you know you're going to have to do something tomorrow, you might as well do it today.
Here's the thing - if there is a "real trick" to being able to spot the collapse before it happens, then that would mean to me that it takes some insight. It's not something every one on a message board can do. Right? Not something "any idiot" can do.
But then, that would mean it's not "obvious". Unless you are limiting the "real trick" part of your post exclusively to "having the balls to make the decision". But if it's "obvious" then it shouldn't take any balls, should it?
I think its guesswork at this point? Have any coaches come back from coaching 8-5, 9-4 seasons and returned to the top? Are losses to three probable top 10 teams and one probably top 25 team evidence of an irreveresible slide? Are the "intangibles" that he can't get back to the top sufficient to pull the triger? I myself don't profess to know the answers.
Posted on 1/6/10 at 5:14 pm to Methuselah
quote:
But then, that would mean it's not "obvious". Unless you are limiting the "real trick" part of your post exclusively to "having the balls to make the decision". But if it's "obvious" then it shouldn't take any balls, should it?
Touché. If EVERYONE could see it, the decision would be easy. That's really what I meant.
But, If you expect to be a premier program, you have to be able to make the tough call. In my view, it is a near certainty that Miles will not be the coach at LSU in 2012 and his departure will not be as a result of a move up.
I'll go one further. In my view, this will be the last significant HC job miles ever has.
I'm not alone on this and it isn't just "rantards" that think it.
Posted on 1/6/10 at 5:26 pm to ShortyRob
LSU has never been decisive in hiring and firing of it's HCs. I am not a Miles fan, never was from the time Jimmy Ott announced him on his show prior to the 2005 Cap-One kickoff.
Think he cost LSU their 2006 BCS Championship shot at Auburn(and arguably the Florida loss was a slight knock upon on the staff too, despite the players blowing that one). But, at this point Miles deserves 2010 at minimum, despite me personally viewing 2009 as only marginally any better than 2008. Maybe, Miles gets even(pains me to say)2011 depending upon what the bar is set at for 2010, and the methodology of how it plays out.
And no, longterm, I don't think he can or will best Saban with regularity, thus agree with a more proactive approach, and a stern raised bar to hurdle in 2010, with no wiggle-room alibis.
But, outside of Loren Seagrave's and Pokey Chatman's player-coach relations, LSU isn't one to make lightning quick decisions..Jeremy Foley-esque they aren't and never have been!
Think he cost LSU their 2006 BCS Championship shot at Auburn(and arguably the Florida loss was a slight knock upon on the staff too, despite the players blowing that one). But, at this point Miles deserves 2010 at minimum, despite me personally viewing 2009 as only marginally any better than 2008. Maybe, Miles gets even(pains me to say)2011 depending upon what the bar is set at for 2010, and the methodology of how it plays out.
And no, longterm, I don't think he can or will best Saban with regularity, thus agree with a more proactive approach, and a stern raised bar to hurdle in 2010, with no wiggle-room alibis.
But, outside of Loren Seagrave's and Pokey Chatman's player-coach relations, LSU isn't one to make lightning quick decisions..Jeremy Foley-esque they aren't and never have been!
Posted on 1/6/10 at 6:10 pm to ShortyRob
quote:
In my view, it is a near certainty that Miles will not be the coach at LSU in 2012 and his departure will not be as a result of a move up.
I'll go one further. In my view, this will be the last significant HC job miles ever has.
You may well be right. Probably are. Hopefully if that comes to pass the replacement will mirror the Maneri follows Smoke trajectory and not the "wander in the wilderness for awhile" situations like LSU after Mac or Bama after Stallings, or the recent Nebraska situation, etc.
Posted on 1/6/10 at 6:19 pm to ShortyRob
quote:
But, If you expect to be a premier program, you have to be able to make the tough call. In my view, it is a near certainty that Miles will not be the coach at LSU in 2012 and his departure will not be as a result of a move up.
Clearly, that is a prevailing opinion on this board. But the possibility exists that Miles will rebound and win the close ones that got away (especially this year). While not as apparent, Oklahoma under Stoops struggled in 2005, including losses to TCU and UCLA. Yes, two years removed from playing for a national championship. Yet, three years later, there was Oklahoma again playing for a national championship. So it can be done.
quote:
I'll go one further. In my view, this will be the last significant HC job miles ever has.
Hardly going out on a limb there. Most fired college coaches do not get another shot at the top of the heap. That happens a lot in the NFL, but not in college.
Posted on 1/6/10 at 7:04 pm to Choctaw
quote:
The real trick is spotting the obvious BEFORE the collapse and having the balls to make the decision
UGA and Uf approve this message, see Richt replacing Donnan and Meyer replacing Zook. Eat some of that CHOCTAW you kool aiod drinker. Yep. shame on us for not being happy with TWO STRAIGHT mediocre seasons. One more and leslie is gone just like zook was at UF.
Posted on 1/6/10 at 7:40 pm to Fat Bastard
Where Choctaw and others use Nebraska as an example, is always a convenient example, as Solich was a better than Coker HC, but only to a moderate degree, and kept it going OK for a small period(like Miles at LSU or Coker at Miami), but it was clearly sliding from elite, to Top 20ish, to..
Dr.Tom was able to keep a WASPy rural Nebraska in 4 and 5 star national talent, something nobody since has, and even if Nebraska wins their northern division by default many years, it will not challenge Texas for Big-12 supremacy longterm..the elite talent just isn't there in Longhorn numbers, and rarely will without rare senior-laden seasons.
I'll be surprised if Pelini is able to stock the cupboard to the degree Mack and Stoops do(OU a defacto Texas school)..not to mention Pinkel has Mizzou a solid program again.
Dr.Tom was able to keep a WASPy rural Nebraska in 4 and 5 star national talent, something nobody since has, and even if Nebraska wins their northern division by default many years, it will not challenge Texas for Big-12 supremacy longterm..the elite talent just isn't there in Longhorn numbers, and rarely will without rare senior-laden seasons.
I'll be surprised if Pelini is able to stock the cupboard to the degree Mack and Stoops do(OU a defacto Texas school)..not to mention Pinkel has Mizzou a solid program again.
This post was edited on 1/7/10 at 2:15 am
Posted on 1/6/10 at 8:12 pm to ShortyRob
Shorty. well written and your responses down the way well spoken as well. I hope that the youth on this website would take the time to read, not only what you have said, but as well, several others. I don't proclaim to know the "ropes" , but your thought process on MILES is definitily in line. Thanks for good posting.
Posted on 1/6/10 at 8:43 pm to ShortyRob
quote:And any idiot can call time outs.
Any Idiot Can Fire a Coach
Posted on 1/6/10 at 8:44 pm to ShortyRob
quote:Negatigers HAVE BEEN saying it but the dorks would counter with season totals, a National Title, etc.
The real trick is spotting the obvious BEFORE the collapse
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