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Started By
Message
1
Posted on 4/20/23 at 2:01 pm to WB Davis
quote:
This is true only if you've got a costly system with batteries and an inverter, right?
Or are these now the norm?
It's not the norm, but it's available. Storage attachment rates are in the ~20ish% range across the country right now. Thats going to spike since all new Ca systems will have storage.
Posted on 4/20/23 at 9:39 pm to billjamin
quote:Higher than I would have guessed, though I assume the majority of that is a few hours worth rather than off-grid capability.
Storage attachment rates are in the ~20ish% range across the country right now.
Side note, what do you think of these people doing DIY storage with server rack batteries?
Posted on 4/20/23 at 10:05 pm to Korkstand
quote:
Higher than I would have guessed, though I assume the majority of that is a few hours worth rather than off-grid capability.
That number ebbs and flows depending on who you listen to, but it's my best guess from following all the big solar asset managers. Keep in mind thats including some areas with 100% storage (Hi, PR, marianas)
quote:
Side note, what do you think of these people doing DIY storage with server rack batteries?
At the end of the day, a wH is a wH and it really doesn't matter where it comes from. The difference is capacity and control. I don't think they'll last. Home storage cycles pretty hard and I think they'll get crushed by that.
Posted on 4/21/23 at 5:36 am to Randman
I have been thinking this for a while, but it is to costly right now. I can only get incentives if I pay federal taxes, which I don't being I am retired. Another negative is from what I understand the solar system is useless without power from the grid. I would want this mainly for emergency backup power if the grid goes down.
Posted on 4/21/23 at 8:27 am to billjamin
quote:Most of the ones available have lifepo4 cells and typical ratings I see are 7k cycles at 80% DoD at .5C. On-board BMS with pre-charge circuitry and temp protection, and canbus comms between units. Sounds pretty robust?
The difference is capacity and control. I don't think they'll last. Home storage cycles pretty hard and I think they'll get crushed by that.
Prices are about $300/kwh, sold in 5kwh units that you can stack and swap as needed. They use these things in data centers so they're almost a commodity.
Posted on 4/21/23 at 9:19 am to Korkstand
quote:
Most of the ones available have lifepo4 cells and typical ratings I see are 7k cycles at 80% DoD at .5C. On-board BMS with pre-charge circuitry and temp protection, and canbus comms between units. Sounds pretty robust?
Oh wow, thats more than I've seen. I was thinking some DIY string together APUs. That seems pretty stout. I think if you did something like that paired with a Span to control the load it could work well.
quote:That's a cheap $/kWh. Way better than most home ESS. That's closer to what I'm seeing used EV storage selling for.
Prices are about $300/kwh, sold in 5kwh units that you can stack and swap as needed. They use these things in data centers so they're almost a commodity.
Posted on 4/21/23 at 9:22 am to RetiredSaintsLsuFan
quote:
I have been thinking this for a while, but it is to costly right now. I can only get incentives if I pay federal taxes, which I don't being I am retired.
You can transfer the tax credit now so that should make it more attractive. Once guidance is out I would take another look at it or consider a third party owned option depending on where you are and if it works for you.
quote:
Another negative is from what I understand the solar system is useless without power from the grid. I would want this mainly for emergency backup power if the grid goes down.
Without storage this is correct. Not because the system can't function, but because they're required to shut down by NEC to protect workers upstream. You can solve this by adding storage or putting in a transfer switch and using something to simulate a grid signal that will "trick" the system into turning on.
This post was edited on 4/21/23 at 9:25 am
Posted on 4/21/23 at 2:54 pm to Randman
On a barn. Powers the barn and well out there fine. Were there before me.
Posted on 8/4/24 at 11:39 am to tigerlife36
Username at gmail.
For anyone looking there’s some new AC modules on an N-type platform coming out later this year that are amazing.
For anyone looking there’s some new AC modules on an N-type platform coming out later this year that are amazing.
This post was edited on 8/4/24 at 11:41 am
Posted on 8/4/24 at 9:04 pm to BilbeauTBaggins
quote:
It's only worth it in cities where you have constant sun. So in the southwest/desert cities, where there is rarely a cloud in the sky. I've seen some in places along the south and don't understand why because we get a lot of cloud coverage/rain.
Average lifetime savings are ~$30k, LIFETIME. So you won't be seeing the savings until you're dead.
There's also a risk of a hurricane tearing them off.
And you might want to check with the local utility. In some places you're required to be connected to the grid, and there might be a minimum monthly bill so you'd still be paying even if your net usage is 0.
Posted on 8/4/24 at 10:10 pm to Bestbank Tiger
quote:
There's also a risk of a hurricane tearing them off.
Not really if the system is properly installed. Most racking is rated for a mid cat 4 before the 1.5 safety factor and if you want bigger and badder they have 180mph rated and 5400Pa modules available. Those are all usually required in somewhere like Miami-Dade.
quote:
And you might want to check with the local utility. In some places you're required to be connected to the grid, and there might be a minimum monthly bill so you'd still be paying even if your net usage is 0.
There’s basically no way to just build a system even for self consumption without getting utility approval. There are a few places where they just don’t care, but they’re few and far between and you’d have a really small system. On the bill side, most of the design and proposal tools can account for all that and give a good comparison of your pre and post solar cost. Just make sure the sales bro uses a good tool and puts in accurate info (rates program, rate $, escalator %, etc) half the time they just make shite up and it’s probably half because they’re trying to frick you and the other half are too stupid to know how to do it right.
Posted on 8/4/24 at 10:43 pm to billjamin
Solar sucks balls. There is no gain. Just pain. No way to recover costs ever. My average 14 kw per day barely covers the cost of any large appliance.
Posted on 8/4/24 at 10:52 pm to Maillard
quote:you have a system that’s only making 14kWh?
Solar sucks balls. There is no gain. Just pain. No way to recover costs ever. My average 14 kw per day barely covers the cost of any large appliance.
Posted on 8/5/24 at 4:24 am to billjamin
Yes, twas on the home when we purchased it.
Posted on 8/5/24 at 7:49 am to Maillard
quote:
Yes, twas on the home when we purchased it.
Do you have any equipment specs?
Posted on 8/5/24 at 7:51 am to Randman
quote:
Another nice benefit is having backup power during outages.
I don't view a Solar system as a money saver or even a break even point. I view it as a way to get power when the grid is down for emergencies first and foremost. Sure there is a way to use it during peak hours therefore saving a certain amount, etc. I'm probably going to build my own soon, but I'm not thinking of making money or breaking even. I'm thinking about storms and whatever else can happen when some idiot screws up on the grid.
Basically a backup generator that will refill automatically. But I also plan on having a backup backup actual generator as well just in case.
Edited to add, I would never consider just solar panels without Lipo storage.
This post was edited on 8/5/24 at 8:07 am
Posted on 8/5/24 at 10:13 am to OU812ME2
I’ve been happy with my system
5 years and no efficiency loss so far.
No mechanical issues
The power wall or battery back up is a must.
Great to have when grid goes down.
However, I can’t run my central AC off battery if grid failure. Everything else in the house will run. And battery will charge off grid.
Make sure you know how utility reimburses you for power you sell to grid. It varies significantly by state and will be a factor in whether it is economical or not.
5 years and no efficiency loss so far.
No mechanical issues
The power wall or battery back up is a must.
Great to have when grid goes down.
However, I can’t run my central AC off battery if grid failure. Everything else in the house will run. And battery will charge off grid.
Make sure you know how utility reimburses you for power you sell to grid. It varies significantly by state and will be a factor in whether it is economical or not.
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