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Started By
Message
Advice/insight for fatigue, lack of progress, and perhaps modifying fitness philosophy
Posted on 8/20/23 at 6:39 am
Posted on 8/20/23 at 6:39 am
tl;dr - Squats and deadlifts make me feel depressed. I don't have the issues at all when I don't squat or deadlift. I'm considering changing routines and goals but I figured I'd look for insight before doing so.
First a few stats to know what I'm working with:
5'7 - 165 pounds
38 years old
Bench max: 225 (performed)
Squat max: ~260 (Wendler calculation)
Deadlift max: 315 (performed)
Physique: average, decent chest and glutes, kinda skinny fat everywhere else
Nutrition: I eat 150g of protein per day and tend to average 2600-2800 calories per day according to MyFitnessPal.
Sleep average: 6.5-7 hours per night
I've been lifting weights since I first started playing football 25 years ago. I've never been competition-level strong, but I've been at the 1000 lb club before. I'm not necessarily going for big levels of strength right now, but I bring that up to say that I'm not a beginner.
I've noticed the past few years some serious issues with how lifting is affecting me. Whenever I lift heavy legs (squat or deadlift), I am irritable, monotonic, "dead," fatigued, depressed - just really down in the dumps. Almost every single time.
It's not a volume issue. I hit my last straw this past Thursday when it happened after 1 set of 3 on squat. I did my mobility warm up, my warm up sets, and planned on doing a 3, 3, 3+ for my working sets on squat. It was my first lift of the morning. I did the first set of 3 and got interrupted. The workout ended and I went about my day. Even though I didn't even complete the workout, I still had the same levels of irritability, fatigue, and malaise as if I did a full workout.
I don't have these issues when I don't lift heavy legs. I run a modified Greyskull kind of program (Squat or Deadlift, Bench or OHP, Bent Over Rows or Pull Ups three days a week) and I do some light jogging on non-lifting days. I jog around 20 minutes during the week and 30-40 minutes on Saturdays. I'm certainly not doing a ton of volume.
I do have mobility issues. It's difficult for me to get parallel on squat even after a 10 minute mobility warm up borrowed from Squat University. My back is always a little rounded on deadlifts. I guess this could be an issue, but I'm not sure it really explains how destroyed I am after lifting. I spend a lot of the week feeling down, and it disappears when I don't lift heavy.
It's to the point that I'm considering giving up lifting heavy all together. Maybe focusing on a calisthenics program or full mobility program. Yoga, Knees Over Toes - something like that. Maybe getting back into running long distance instead of building strength and muscle. Or just doing some generic "middle aged guy in the gym" routine where I lift moderate weight with little linear progression involved and avoid squats and deadlifts all together.
For anyone thinking it's an issue with experience, I've had this issue for 2-3 years. I've tried to work through it. Eat more. Switching routines. It's just getting old.
Any advice or insight? Am I just getting old and becoming a Grade A wuss?
First a few stats to know what I'm working with:
5'7 - 165 pounds
38 years old
Bench max: 225 (performed)
Squat max: ~260 (Wendler calculation)
Deadlift max: 315 (performed)
Physique: average, decent chest and glutes, kinda skinny fat everywhere else
Nutrition: I eat 150g of protein per day and tend to average 2600-2800 calories per day according to MyFitnessPal.
Sleep average: 6.5-7 hours per night
I've been lifting weights since I first started playing football 25 years ago. I've never been competition-level strong, but I've been at the 1000 lb club before. I'm not necessarily going for big levels of strength right now, but I bring that up to say that I'm not a beginner.
I've noticed the past few years some serious issues with how lifting is affecting me. Whenever I lift heavy legs (squat or deadlift), I am irritable, monotonic, "dead," fatigued, depressed - just really down in the dumps. Almost every single time.
It's not a volume issue. I hit my last straw this past Thursday when it happened after 1 set of 3 on squat. I did my mobility warm up, my warm up sets, and planned on doing a 3, 3, 3+ for my working sets on squat. It was my first lift of the morning. I did the first set of 3 and got interrupted. The workout ended and I went about my day. Even though I didn't even complete the workout, I still had the same levels of irritability, fatigue, and malaise as if I did a full workout.
I don't have these issues when I don't lift heavy legs. I run a modified Greyskull kind of program (Squat or Deadlift, Bench or OHP, Bent Over Rows or Pull Ups three days a week) and I do some light jogging on non-lifting days. I jog around 20 minutes during the week and 30-40 minutes on Saturdays. I'm certainly not doing a ton of volume.
I do have mobility issues. It's difficult for me to get parallel on squat even after a 10 minute mobility warm up borrowed from Squat University. My back is always a little rounded on deadlifts. I guess this could be an issue, but I'm not sure it really explains how destroyed I am after lifting. I spend a lot of the week feeling down, and it disappears when I don't lift heavy.
It's to the point that I'm considering giving up lifting heavy all together. Maybe focusing on a calisthenics program or full mobility program. Yoga, Knees Over Toes - something like that. Maybe getting back into running long distance instead of building strength and muscle. Or just doing some generic "middle aged guy in the gym" routine where I lift moderate weight with little linear progression involved and avoid squats and deadlifts all together.
For anyone thinking it's an issue with experience, I've had this issue for 2-3 years. I've tried to work through it. Eat more. Switching routines. It's just getting old.
Any advice or insight? Am I just getting old and becoming a Grade A wuss?
Posted on 8/20/23 at 7:10 am to StringedInstruments
Have you had you test levels checked?
Posted on 8/20/23 at 7:15 am to StringedInstruments
Go get full blood panel done.
Posted on 8/20/23 at 7:52 am to Loup
quote:
Have you had you test levels checked?
That’s been a struggle. Two years in a row (I think 2019 and 2020, maybe?), my test level was around 310. My doc - who was shite - said it was within normal range.
My new GP did a full blood panel this past January and didn’t check test. She did check thyroid and everything was normal. Outside of LDL being a tad elevated, everything was in a healthy range.
I plan on emphasizing getting my testosterone checked at my next physical.
Posted on 8/20/23 at 8:37 am to StringedInstruments
It sounds to me like you’re already approaching those lifts with a negative mindset, and your mind will do whatever you tell it.
I’d start simple with practicing some mantras before and during your lifts. Something like “I enjoy deadlifting. Deadlifting makes me feel good” and variations. Tell yourself this over and over and your mind will eventually believe it.
I’d start simple with practicing some mantras before and during your lifts. Something like “I enjoy deadlifting. Deadlifting makes me feel good” and variations. Tell yourself this over and over and your mind will eventually believe it.
Posted on 8/20/23 at 8:51 am to StringedInstruments
While it could be your T levels, big compound movements like squat and deadlift at heavy weight tax the CNS and can wipe people out.
ETA: 310 is almost at the bottom of the normal range. I’m always curious on the range. Is this for the normal guy who doesn’t lift? Because someone who utilizes a consistent lifting program should have a higher level and not be sitting at 310.
If you’re in BR, the Men’s Clinic on Essen will do an in house test and have your levels within 20 minutes. If they are low, they can put you on a .5-1 CC per week of Test C; probably giving you a .5 dose that day. It isn’t cheap, about $180/month for a year plan, and they ship everything to you and you administer it yourself.
ETA: 310 is almost at the bottom of the normal range. I’m always curious on the range. Is this for the normal guy who doesn’t lift? Because someone who utilizes a consistent lifting program should have a higher level and not be sitting at 310.
If you’re in BR, the Men’s Clinic on Essen will do an in house test and have your levels within 20 minutes. If they are low, they can put you on a .5-1 CC per week of Test C; probably giving you a .5 dose that day. It isn’t cheap, about $180/month for a year plan, and they ship everything to you and you administer it yourself.
This post was edited on 8/20/23 at 8:59 am
Posted on 8/20/23 at 10:14 am to StringedInstruments
I've kind of felt what you're feeling but for different reasons. I've been lifting on a cut for the last 8 months and training was becoming a drag. I hated the first pull day of the week because it's deadlift day. Lately I've been feeling really good because of just a few changes. Lowered the volume to only two all out effort top sets. Dropped the weight to stay in the 8-10 range and for the moment quit deadlifting. I'll come back to it again when I'm in a surplus or I might not. It's just starting to feel like a lot of effort and fatigue for very little stimulus.
Posted on 8/20/23 at 10:33 am to Blutarsky
quote:
about $180/month for a year plan, and they ship everything to you and you administer it yourself.
Gosh dang they're fleecing folks.
Price for depo test through the Amazon pharmacy is $83 per 10 ml vial.
I was in the same boat as the OP. Went from making gains and being pumped about the gym to slowly getting weaker, losing muscle tone, and dreading it. Heavy compound lifts would leave me sore for a week. My T was at ~250. I was hesitant to get on TRT but I'm glad I did. I haven't felt this good since my early 20s.
This post was edited on 8/20/23 at 10:43 am
Posted on 8/20/23 at 11:41 am to Loup
quote:
I haven't felt this good since my early 20s.
How old are you now?
I’m concerned about starting test or going full TRT at 38.
Posted on 8/20/23 at 12:33 pm to StringedInstruments
quote:
How old are you now?
35
quote:
I’m concerned about starting test or going full TRT at 38
What are your concerns?
Posted on 8/20/23 at 12:59 pm to Loup
quote:
What are your concerns?
Side effects. Long term impacts.
Posted on 8/20/23 at 1:22 pm to StringedInstruments
quote:
Side effects. Long term impacts.
Find a good Endocrinologist and try to find a reason why you’re low in the range.
A GP or a normal family Doctor won’t be much help.
Posted on 8/20/23 at 1:23 pm to Loup
quote:
Gosh dang they're fleecing folks.
That’s the cost via a Clinic like that.
It does include bloodwork to check everything else every 2-3 months.
Posted on 8/20/23 at 3:29 pm to StringedInstruments
Stay within range and there aren’t any really
I started younger than you due to fertility treatment.
If you can’t find good doc locally, try elevate wellness out of New Jersey. Can find them on tictok, they are really good
And with good rx 10ml should be less than 50. Order pins from gpz sevices
I started younger than you due to fertility treatment.
If you can’t find good doc locally, try elevate wellness out of New Jersey. Can find them on tictok, they are really good
And with good rx 10ml should be less than 50. Order pins from gpz sevices
Posted on 8/21/23 at 6:31 am to StringedInstruments
oh btw try switching the squats for ssb or a machine at the gym like pendulum or hack squats and switch the deads out completely.
Posted on 8/21/23 at 7:37 am to StringedInstruments
I would start with T levels and see. 310 is on the low end. Almost low enough for insurance to cover TRT. You should be in the 800-1,100 range.
Other than the mentioned issues, how is our overall energy/sleep/libido?
Other than the mentioned issues, how is our overall energy/sleep/libido?
Posted on 8/21/23 at 3:10 pm to RocketTiger
quote:
Other than the mentioned issues, how is our overall energy/sleep/libido?
Energy: depends. I’m super energetic in the mornings. I’m a very busy person. I do crash on good days by the evening, but if I listed all I do between 5am and 6pm (9pm some days), it’d be an extensive list. Energy is zapped when I squat or deadlift.
Sleep: it’s okay. I’ve struggled with insomnia since I was in middle school. I have a routine that helps me get 6.5-7 hours a night. My dietary choices are key, and those aren’t always the best.
Libido: Could be higher, but I’m still interested in sex all the time. I have noticed that I’m a bit irritable and low after sex.
Posted on 8/22/23 at 6:07 am to StringedInstruments
Yeah, based on that, I would look at TRT. I'm 40 and have been on it since February and feel the best I've ever felt. With your level at 310, this can definitely be the cause.
Posted on 8/22/23 at 8:30 am to StringedInstruments
What is your alcohol consumption like?
Do you do any cardio?
Do you do any cardio?
Posted on 8/22/23 at 3:24 pm to Tornado Alley
quote:
What is your alcohol consumption like?
Do you do any cardio?
I drink maybe one or two drinks a year.
I run 3-4 days a week. 20 minutes is about all I have time for 2-3 days a week. I try to get in a "long" run on Saturdays, but it's like 45 minutes at the most. I ran a marathon in 2018.
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