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Greyskull LP- How to add volume intelligently

Posted on 1/14/19 at 11:10 am
Posted by lsu777
Lake Charles
Member since Jan 2004
31443 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 11:10 am
So some have asked how to add volume to greyskull. I am going to lay out a few simple ways to do this. First I want to say, most should not be doing this especially if they are making progress, but i do acknowledge that certain lifts like the press, respond very well to volume.

1) if you are looking to add volume to drive numbers up I highly encourage you to give Barbell Medicines GSLP Strength Bais template a whirl. It is a mixture of Texas method laid over the gslp template. It would be considered something you should do once you have performed 2 resets on a lift and rotated the original lift back in and are stalling at the same place. LINK

I like this as it is a simple program to follow since it is already laid out for you. This option works great for those that need more volume, but don't understand exactly how to program themselves.


2) Another easy way to add Volume especially just to one lift, is to use wendlers "BIG but Strong" variation. This works extremely well for the press. So after a stall for the press we would add 10 sets of 5 @ 50% of the normal GSLP set weight. We superset these with chins. So it looks something like this:


**Notice the GSLP Press sets are not AMRAP

Could also add it in for bench like this:


You can also change out the rep scheme on the bench to 5 sets of 10 aka boring but big.

Another way to progress on the volume sets is as follows

Boring but strong-
-Day 1- 10 sets of 5
-Day 2- 10 sets of 6 @ same weight
-Day 3- 10 sets of 7 @ same weight
etc until you get to 10 sets of 10. At that point reset to 10*5 and add 10%.


Boring but Big- same as above but we add a set instead of adding reps and we only add the set on a weekly basis.

With both options the antagonist movement is the same rep scheme and we only have 20 min to complete all of the volume sets. This ensures we are working with enough density to push the lifts.



Posted by lsu777
Lake Charles
Member since Jan 2004
31443 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 11:11 am to
Another Greyskull way of doing things is using the challenges and pursuit of them to drive volume



Another easy way is to simply perform the base LP and add in bring sally up challenges. On upper body lifts you do the opposite, lower body you keep normal. I.E. on upper body days when the song says bring sally up, you lower the weight. When it says bring sally down, you raise the weight and keep it there.




As you can see we can do this pretty easily and intelligently. It allows us to get more volume but still progress.

Now with all of the above laid out, I still think it is smarter to push the bodyweight homework volume.

Challenges Ebook
This post was edited on 1/14/19 at 11:49 am
Posted by lsu777
Lake Charles
Member since Jan 2004
31443 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 11:11 am to
USING THE LCI METHOD TO ADD VOLUME

On this post I am going to show you simple and easy ways to add volume using the LCI method.



This is the Base LCI layout. We can use variations of the lifts or add bodyweight work in to simply add volume to the base layout.


This is another way of laying out the base LCI using a simple circuit.



This is a simple way to add volume using the antagonist with the main mover. We can even do this as a giant set if we are in good enough lifting shape.


In general on the above examples we are using very little rest between each round of the circuit. In general we keep each exercise to 3-5 reps.

We start with 2-3 rounds of the circuits and add a round of the circuit every week or every other week until we reach 10 rounds. We then add weight and restart again or we add reps(i.e. a double progression model). If we choose to add reps we build to 10 sets of 10 and then reset with more weight.




On the circuits below, we are focusing on strength. We will rest 90s between rounds of the circuit but only 15-20s after each exercise in the circuit. Wendler lays out something similar called "Strength Circuits" in the forever book.



Christina Thib lays out his strength circuits similar to this





On the star circuits below we are using the same movement pattern but working across the strength curve. Christian Thib popularized this program.









This post was edited on 1/14/19 at 7:34 pm
Posted by lsu777
Lake Charles
Member since Jan 2004
31443 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 11:51 am to
So the 4th way to add volume is using Giant sets similar to Brian Alshure prescibes. I will post tomorrow how wendler does this.

Below are is how you lay this out.



Using this layout we can layout the 4 day version pretty easily




Below is a 3 day hitting supplemental lifts for both main movers each time. You can cut this back to 1 supplemental giant set if time is an issue


This post was edited on 1/14/19 at 3:11 pm
Posted by lsu777
Lake Charles
Member since Jan 2004
31443 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 3:43 pm to
for accessory lifts you can also use Brian Alshure's finishers

Deadlift Finishers
Squat Finishers
Bench press Finishers
Overhead Press Finishers


Can also do a simple cicruit of the following daily rotating the lifts

Shoulders- Lateral raises or rear delt work
Biceps
Triceps
Abdominal
Strongman Cardio
Posted by OleWarSkuleAlum
Huntsville, AL
Member since Dec 2013
10293 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 7:25 pm to
Thanks for the insanely detailed write up... I was thinking of doing something like this...

quote:




Instead of Kroc rows what do you think about a curl variant to stay more like the strength/hypertrophy variant from the base GSLP? Also why alternate the squat / deads when the base only does deads one time per week?

Also could a setup work that looks like thisand the base GSLP but adds an additional training day...

W1D1
OHP
Chins
squat

W1D2
Bench
Curls
Dead

W1D3
OHP
Chins
Squat

W1D4
Bench
Curl
Deads

W2 just rotate OHP / Bench like base GSLP



Posted by lsu777
Lake Charles
Member since Jan 2004
31443 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 7:30 pm to
quote:

W1D1
OHP
Chins
squat

W1D2
Bench
Curls
Dead

W1D3
OHP
Chins
Squat

W1D4
Bench
Curl
Deads

W2 just rotate OHP / Bench like base GSLP



Absolutely works. Not really more volume just much greater frequency. This is the option you should go to if 4 days is possible for you. I would keep the weight the same across the week though and just shoot for rep records.


quote:

Instead of Kroc rows what do you think about a curl variant to stay more like the strength/hypertrophy variant from the base GSLP? Also why alternate the squat / deads when the base only does deads one time per week?



Yea I screwed that up. Deadlift should be just the one day. I will fix that tomorrow.

I would keep the Kroc rows and add the curls on top of that on bench days and weighted close grip bench, weighted diamond pushups or weighted dips to press days.
Posted by OleWarSkuleAlum
Huntsville, AL
Member since Dec 2013
10293 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 7:48 pm to
quote:

Absolutely works. Not really more volume just much greater frequency. This is the option you should go to if 4 days is possible for you. I would keep the weight the same across the week though and just shoot for rep records.


If I go to this is there a reason to rotate the A/B lifts?

Just do the 2.5 or 5lbs increase weekly?

I’ve rest OHP twice now and I’m about to stall again. When I reset not exactly setting rep records it’s close to the AMRAP before I reset. I’m stuck at 117.5 FTR.

My squats feel like shite not sure why. I reset and I’m back to the weight that forced me to reset and I still feel like shite.
This post was edited on 1/14/19 at 7:51 pm
Posted by lsu777
Lake Charles
Member since Jan 2004
31443 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 7:56 pm to
quote:

If I go to this is there a reason to rotate the A/B lifts?


No reason to rotate

quote:


Just do the 2.5 or 5lbs increase weekly?


2.5lbs on upper, 5lbs on lower

quote:

I’ve rest OHP twice now and I’m about to stall again. When I reset not exactly setting rep records it’s close to the AMRAP before I reset. I’m stuck at 117.5 FTR.

My squats feel like shite not sure why. I reset and I’m back to the weight that forced me to reset and I still feel like shite.


Before I recommend swapping them out, what are your current stats and macros? Are you eating in a deficit?

But in general if you are going to swap it out I suggest z press for the press and either SSB or front squats as the squat
Posted by OleWarSkuleAlum
Huntsville, AL
Member since Dec 2013
10293 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 8:03 pm to
quote:

Before I recommend swapping them out, what are your current stats and macros? Are you eating in a deficit? But in general if you are going to swap it out I suggest z press for the press and either SSB or front squats as the squat


I’m 6’2” 185lbs I eat 3000 calories on workout days and 2500 on non-workout days. 75F/24P/1C. That’s my maintenance as evidenced by the scale over a period of 4-6 months.

My current lifts are:
OHP: 117.5 for 5
Bench: 185 for 8 (this feels good still going up)
Squat: 185 for 7 (feels like shite. Might be my breathing and braceing)
Deads: 255 for 15 (feels good still going up)
This post was edited on 1/14/19 at 8:04 pm
Posted by lsu777
Lake Charles
Member since Jan 2004
31443 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 8:11 pm to
I know you eat keto as do I at times like right now. If you are ok with putting on some muscle I would try these things

1. Raise protein to 35% and see if that helps.

2. If the above doesn't help, try adding 50g, with some being fruit, carbs before the workout andaybe 50-75g.

I'm assuming your are sleeping well enough to recover.

It's just eventually you are going to have to eat to fuel your goals. If it's to continue to get stronger you will have to do one of the two above.

This doesn't mean you have to become a fat frick like some many dumbasses do.
Posted by OleWarSkuleAlum
Huntsville, AL
Member since Dec 2013
10293 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 8:14 pm to
Yeah I know I could bump up my calories to 3500 and see what happens for a month or two. Honestly not really interested in getting too huge just want to get stronger.

I’m on week 21 of the base GSLP I’m thinking of going to the 4 day routine to see how I like it.
Posted by Tornado Alley
Member since Mar 2012
26606 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 8:17 pm to
I wanna do the boring but big add-on for bench and press here after I hit a plateau. That may be a while though
Posted by lsu777
Lake Charles
Member since Jan 2004
31443 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 8:32 pm to
I actually suggest boring but strong(10 sets of 5) for the press and the boring but big(5 sets of 10) for the bench. For some reason it tends to work better for the lifts like this both for hypertrophy and strength.

Tons of guys on wendlers forum run 531 like that and many do a single Widowmaker 20 rep breathing squat and the supplemental to squats.
Posted by OleWarSkuleAlum
Huntsville, AL
Member since Dec 2013
10293 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 8:38 pm to
quote:

I actually suggest boring but strong(10 sets of 5) for the press and the boring but big(5 sets of 10) for the bench. For some reason it tends to work better for the lifts like this both for hypertrophy and strength.


For the 5x10 what weight are you using? I see for the 10x5 scheme it’s 50% of your GSLP weight.
Posted by Tornado Alley
Member since Mar 2012
26606 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 8:41 pm to
Boring but strong for my current press would have me doing 10x5x the bar

I’ll finish out week 12 and then probably add something like that, in addition to some incline bench and varied curls.
Posted by Tornado Alley
Member since Mar 2012
26606 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 8:50 pm to
777, how long can I realistically progress? Haven’t hit a plateau in 6 weeks thus far. Is it possible to do it for 12?

That would have me at (all 5 rep working weights):

Bench: 95 to 145
Press: 60 to 105
Deadlift: 95 to 205 (assuming I hit 10 reps every time as I have done thus far)
Squat: 95 to 240

Am I just getting stronger? This feels weird
Posted by lsu777
Lake Charles
Member since Jan 2004
31443 posts
Posted on 1/14/19 at 9:02 pm to
Honestly so long as you are eating 300g protein you could go for 24 weeks without a reset.

As far as how long you can progress using the resets and rotating lifts out...usually for years just using intensity techniques as I laid out. Usually 2-3 years

When you talk about adding volume as I have laid out here and using double progression, realistically another 2 years.

But at some point you will have to move to weekly progression instead of every session. From there bi weekly and then monthly to a certain extent.

Or you move like most greyskull trainee's do and move to one max set then you move to an dependent rest pause methods for a while. Then move to rest pause and other intensity techniques.

I'll out it this way, there are less than 5 on this board that couldn't get more out of the greyskull lp. Go look at the weights deafjam is putting up using the methods. I personally will be elite in the 198 weight class according to the starting strength charts by the end of the year or damn close to it in every lift but the deadlift and clean. I am already advanced in pretty much every lift mainly using the greyskull methods or methods similar.

5/3/1, gzcl, DC training, true conjugate, reverse pyramid and greyskull are the only systems I feel like you can continue to make progress on for years. Madcow is pretty awesome too.
Posted by Tornado Alley
Member since Mar 2012
26606 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 12:57 pm to
Boring But Strong seems like a whole heck of a lot of sets.

Think about it: if you run base Greyskull, and do BBS for press, your day might look like this:

Press, 2x5, 1xAMRAP at working set weight
Press, 10x5 at 50% working weight
Squats, 2x5, 1xAMRAP at working weight

That’s 16 sets, whereas BBB is only 11. Are you supposed to do BBS at 50% of the working weight? Can I do it even though I haven’t plateaued?

Posted by Tornado Alley
Member since Mar 2012
26606 posts
Posted on 1/15/19 at 2:19 pm to
It kind of seems silly to do BBB or BBS for me unless my BBB or BBS sets are 70%+ of my Greyskull working set.

Maybe I ought to just wait and progress like usual haha.
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