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re: Anyone else think Nixon was treated unfairly?

Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:12 am to
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:12 am to
quote:

On important issues he operated in secret

Didn't know his asking Gorbachev to tear down that wall was done in secret. Sounded like a helluva overt statement to me - and it worked.


Again, it didn't cost him anything to do that.
Posted by BulldogXero
Member since Oct 2011
9795 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:14 am to
Not really no. People had integrity in those days. These days, politicians doing dishonest things is unfortunately business as usual. Sadly that was practically a reason people were giving to vote for Hillary over Trump
This post was edited on 2/20/17 at 10:15 am
Posted by Zach
Gizmonic Institute
Member since May 2005
112793 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:17 am to
quote:

Reagan was never mercilessly criticized by the media over anything. It did a total roll over.


OK, that's the tip off. You were in prison during the Reagan years and they didn't let you have TV or papers. Got it.
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:22 am to
"In 1985, while Iran and Iraq were at war, Iran made a secret request to buy weapons from the United States. McFarlane sought Reagan's approval, in spite of the embargo against selling arms to Iran. McFarlane explained that the sale of arms would not only improve U.S. relations with Iran, but might in turn lead to improved relations with Lebanon, increasing U.S. influence in the troubled Middle East. Reagan was driven by a different obsession. He had become frustrated at his inability to secure the release of the seven American hostages being held by Iranian terrorists in Lebanon. As president, Reagan felt that "he had the duty to bring those Americans home," and he convinced himself that he was not negotiating with terrorists. While shipping arms to Iran violated the embargo, dealing with terrorists violated Reagan's campaign promise never to do so. Reagan had always been admired for his honesty.


The arms-for-hostages proposal divided the administration. Longtime policy adversaries Secretary of Defense Caspar Weinberger and Secretary of State George Shultz opposed the deal, but Reagan, McFarlane and CIA director William Casey supported it. With the backing of the president, the plan progressed. By the time the sales were discovered, more than 1,500 missiles had been shipped to Iran. Three hostages had been released, only to be replaced with three more, in what Secretary of State George Shultz called "a hostage bazaar."

When the Lebanese newspaper "Al-Shiraa" printed an exposé on the clandestine activities in November 1986, Reagan went on television and vehemently denied that any such operation had occurred. He retracted the statement a week later, insisting that the sale of weapons had not been an arms-for-hostages deal. Despite the fact that Reagan defended the actions by virtue of their good intentions, his honesty was doubted. Polls showed that only 14 percent of Americans believed the president when he said he had not traded arms for hostages."

LINK


Reagan Caught in a Number of Lies

This is from the tape I made in 1986. Jump to the end to hear the media saying that reagan should be let off the hook.
Posted by CelticDog
Member since Apr 2015
42867 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:25 am to
Should have had his impeachment trial after we saw the 25 yr papers. He would have been shot for treason for his undermining us troops by negotiating with the vietnamese as a civilian.

You still think hes less guilty than mrs c, read more.

Watergate was mainly about nixon being insane. He led mcgovern by 25 points in polling.

Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:33 am to
quote:

Reagan was never mercilessly criticized by the media over anything. It did a total roll over.

OK, that's the tip off. You were in prison during the Reagan years and they didn't let you have TV or papers. Got it.


That is a weird thing to say. I was actually in the Marine Corps during the 1980's. But Reagan never fooled me for a second.

If you need proof that for all his big talk Reagan was weak, just note that he ran up more debt in 8 years than in the previous 200 years.




This post was edited on 2/20/17 at 10:37 am
Posted by cypressbrake3
Member since Oct 2014
3681 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:33 am to
OP, I was alive at the time and watched it going down.

Nixon got totally railroaded.

Other world leaders at the time thought the same thing. They considered Watergate a relatively minor issue and laughed at the media storm that developed over it.

But the liberals and their associates in the media HATED Nixon, going back to the Whitaker Chambers/Alger Hiss matter.

Nixon was an extremely capable guy, more so than most of those that succeeded him.
This post was edited on 2/20/17 at 10:40 am
Posted by TGFN57
Telluride
Member since Jan 2010
6975 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:36 am to
Nixon wiped his arse with the constitution. He got what he deserved. He quit rather than face impeachment and certain conviction.
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:49 am to
quote:

Nixon got totally railroaded.


Plenty of republicans were willing to kick in and remove Nixon.

[The President] shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed....

ARTICLE II, SECTION 3

Nixon, although it didn't come out for a while, actually ordered the Watergate break-in. If you think that is not a big deal don't ever ask me to loan you fifty cents.
This post was edited on 2/20/17 at 10:50 am
Posted by Zach
Gizmonic Institute
Member since May 2005
112793 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 10:52 am to
quote:

If you need proof that for all his big talk Reagan was weak, just note that he ran up more debt in 8 years than in the previous 200 years.


Wrong. Reagan doubled revenues with the tax cut which was opposed by the Dems. The Dems ran up the debt. Your knowledge of the period is pathetic.
Posted by WildTchoupitoulas
Member since Jan 2010
44071 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 11:14 am to
quote:

Reagan doubled revenues with the tax cut



I don't think you understand how our system works, Zach.

But more to the point, the economy was in recovery mainly due to the tight money policy of the Fed Chairman, Paul Volcker (who was appointed by Carter).

quote:

The Dems ran up the debt

Reagan signed the budget bill.

In the previous administration, Carter refused to sign a budget bill because it ran up too much debt - he was vilified by the press for closing down the government.

In spite of the opinions to the contrary, Carter was the last conservative Democrat in office.
Posted by cypressbrake3
Member since Oct 2014
3681 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 11:18 am to
I doubt if you have fifty cents, bubba.

Nixon was a great man.
Posted by WildTchoupitoulas
Member since Jan 2010
44071 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 11:25 am to
quote:

Nixon was a great man.

No he wasn't.



David Frost: "Were there no limits to what a president can do, even if the president wants to do something plainly illegal? Could he do anything despite the law? Burglary? Forgery? Even murder?"

Richard Nixon: "If the president does it, that means it’s not illegal".

April 6, 1977
Posted by GurleyGirl
Georgia
Member since Nov 2015
13185 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 11:28 am to
quote:

Anyone else think Nixon was treated unfairly?


In present day context, yes. What the Nixon administration was mild compared to blatant compromise of national security under the Obama admin.
Posted by WhiskeyPapa
Member since Aug 2016
9277 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 12:12 pm to
quote:

I doubt if you have fifty cents, bubba.

Nixon was a great man.


Nixon was so great a man that even though McGovern was one of the worst and most clueless presidential candidates ever, and Nixon couldn't fail to win in 1972 -- Nixon was so paranoid that he ordered a B&E of the Dem National Headquarters.




Posted by cypressbrake3
Member since Oct 2014
3681 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 12:30 pm to
All great men still have flaws and quirks, bubba.

But I still doubt you and the other guy are deep enough to get this.

An example of greatness....

The '60 election was stolen from Nixon.

Nixon was advised to contest the results, as there was ample evidence of what went down in TX, Illinois, and elsewhere. But because he had greatness, Nixon felt that it would be best to put his own interests aside and not contest for the good of the country. JFK was visibly relieved when Nixon told him he would not contest the result when they met shortly after the election. JFK knew what had gone down.

Compare that act to the midgets we have masquerading as leaders today.

But again, I doubt you are astute enough to get it.

But do keep your 50 cents, bubba.
This post was edited on 2/20/17 at 12:32 pm
Posted by Loserman
Member since Sep 2007
22027 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 4:02 pm to
No he broke the law and should have been ousted.
Posted by cypressbrake3
Member since Oct 2014
3681 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 4:08 pm to
Carter a "conservative"?



Read his acceptance speech at the '76 convention. The guy was wanting national health insurance boondoggle even way back then.
Posted by TBoy
Kalamazoo
Member since Dec 2007
24007 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 4:08 pm to
quote:

what he did just really doesn't seem like a big deal


What he did was send people into Democratic headquarters as burglars to steal strategy papers in the run up to the election. That's bad. He's a farking thief and a burglar.

I can see why a young person might be confused. In the run up to this election, electronic thieves broke into Democratic computers to steal strategy papers. Yet as of this point, no one has been outed as the thief.

Just wait and watch. This will ultimately be found to be very similar.
Posted by WildTchoupitoulas
Member since Jan 2010
44071 posts
Posted on 2/20/17 at 4:13 pm to
quote:

Compare that act to the midgets we have masquerading as leaders today.

Why not compare some of his actual policies, such as the Nixon Shock to what's going on today.

Can you imagine if Obama signed an EO stating:

quote:

Executive Order 11615 of August 15, 1971

Section 1.?

(a) ? Prices, rents, wages, and salaries shall be stabilized for a period of 90 days from the date hereof at levels not greater than the highest of those pertaining to a substantial volume of actual transactions by each individual, business, firm or other entity of any kind during the 30-day period ending August 14, 1971, for like or similar commodities or services. If no transactions occurred in that period, the ceiling will be the highest price, rent, salary or wage in the nearest preceding 30-day period in which transactions did occur. No person shall charge, assess, or receive, directly or indirectly in any transaction prices or rents in any form higher than those permitted hereunder, and no person shall, directly or indirectly, pay or agree to pay in any transaction wages or salaries in any form, or to use any means to obtain payment of wages and salaries in any form, higher than those permitted hereunder, whether by retroactive increase or otherwise.
(b) ? Each person engaged in the business of selling or providing commodities or services shall maintain available for public inspection a record of the highest prices or rents charged for such or similar commodities or services during the 30-day period ending August 14, 1971.
(c) ? The provision of section 1 and 2 hereof shall not apply to the prices charged for raw agricultural products.

And single-handedly moved the US to a fiat currency with the unilateral dissolution of Bretton-Woods.

I just can't imagine how apeshit this board would've been had Obama done that shite.


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