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Are medical errors really the third leading cause of death in this country?

Posted on 5/5/16 at 1:48 pm
Posted by cwil177
Baton Rouge
Member since Jun 2011
28470 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 1:48 pm
Background: I will be starting my residency in July, and I have to admit I find this fact to be a bit disturbing. I've heard before, based on a 1999 study, that medical errors were responsible for 100k deaths per year in the US. A new study is now claiming that number is closer to 250k, and that it's the third leading cause of death behind heart disease and cancer.

What says the OT? I'm interested to hear opinions from healthcare providers and also from people who feel that they have been impacted by preventable medical errors. I have a close family member who works in medical malpractice so I hear about this topic often, and as a student myself I have seen medical errors that led to worse outcomes for patients (although none that led to a patient's demise).

If you listen to the interview in the link below, Makary says that the aviation industry has a great system in place for analyzing errors and finding solutions. It's true, in any professional field we should try to learn from our mistakes. It would be great to see medical errors discussed more openly, but fear of litigation, I think, discourages this. Admitting one's faults is difficult (and I think that's human nature), but it's especially difficult when it affects people's health. During my last two years of clinicals, I can only remember a few times where specific medical errors were discussed openly and critically, with the insistence being that we could have, and should have, done better.

From the Washington Post:
quote:

Martin Makary, a professor of surgery at the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine who led the research, said in an interview that the category includes everything from bad doctors to more systemic issues such as communication breakdowns when patients are handed off from one department to another.
quote:

Makary’s research involves a more comprehensive analysis of four large studies, including ones by the Health and Human Services Department’s Office of the Inspector General and the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality that took place between 2000 to 2008. His calculation of 251,000 deaths equates to nearly 700 deaths a day — about 9.5 percent of all deaths annually in the United States.

Explanation from the NYT article:
quote:

Using studies published since 1999, the researchers calculated a mean rate of death from medical error. Then they applied this rate to the yearly number of hospital admissions. In this way, they estimated that an average of 251,454 deaths per year in the United States are caused by medical error. The study is in BMJ.


British Medical Journal article, including interview with lead author of the study Interestingly, he says the 250K estimate a very conservative estimate.

NYT Health Blog
USA Today
Washington Post

Posted by guedeaux
Tardis
Member since Jan 2008
13620 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 1:49 pm to
#1 cause is not searching
Posted by 777Tiger
Member since Mar 2011
73856 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 1:49 pm to
somebody comes in last in every class
Posted by Nado Jenkins83
Land of the Free
Member since Nov 2012
59891 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 1:49 pm to
and people think Im crazy when fast food messes up more order.

why do doctors make so much if they basically suck at their jobs
Posted by Artie Rome
Hwy 1
Member since Jul 2014
8757 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 1:55 pm to
Statistics say yes. So keep drinking and texting while driving.
Posted by ksayetiger
Centenary Gents
Member since Jul 2007
68429 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 1:58 pm to
What field are you in?

Congrats on the long white coat
Posted by white perch
the bright, happy side of hell
Member since Apr 2012
7160 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 1:59 pm to
Congrats on surviving Med school. Now get ready for the hard part.

Posted by MSMHater
Houston
Member since Oct 2008
22779 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 2:01 pm to
Political board thread on this topic actually stayed on point for the most part. Check it out.
Posted by jeffsdad
Member since Mar 2007
21555 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 2:13 pm to
This is really an issue that the government is setting up for more intrusion. This is how they justify it. I'm in healthcare and I can guarantee you 45% of the "work" in a medical institution is related to government intrusion already. You will regret your decision to get into healthcare sooner or later and it will be because of the government and the socialist democrat party.
Posted by jchamil
Member since Nov 2009
16596 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 2:15 pm to
I've been told by friends who are doctors that my dad's death could have been prevented (at least delayed for quite some time) had his doctor not dropped the ball. I'm actually a lawyer and was in law school at the time, but I was not interested in pursuing a malpractice suit; it's not like it would have brought him back. The more I think about it, I get really pissed because those doctor friends said that what ended up killing him was something a med school student would have known to check out.
Posted by CelticDog
Member since Apr 2015
42867 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 2:18 pm to
and there are errors of omission because you won't have time to learn all the latest things until they are mainstream and taught at your credential renewal course.

Posted by jeffsdad
Member since Mar 2007
21555 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 2:42 pm to
You really should go to a doc and realize you know as much about yourself as he will ever know. The last 8 times i have been I have been initially misdiagnosed 6, and talking about 180 degree mis-diagnosed. like go home and be dead mis-diagnosed (3). Don't assume one doc has been told what the doc told you 8 hours ago, dont assume a "continium of care" - dont assume anything. Trust your doc, but dont assume everything he says is correct. Trust your RNs, if they are RNs, but dont assume they are giving you the right meds, ask them and then question them if you think they are incorrect
Posted by Hammertime
Will trade dowsing rod for titties
Member since Jan 2012
43030 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 3:08 pm to
I find it odd how many people get much more sick once they go to the hospital. I have 4 relatives in the past 5 years who have been on the brink of death because of stuff they caught in a hospital. One was hospitalized for 6 months because a doctor accidentally cut her colon open and she got a huge infection
Posted by eScott
Member since Oct 2008
11376 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 3:15 pm to
I have the wrong size stent drifting around in my arteries that'll probably kill me one day.
Posted by seawolf06
NH
Member since Oct 2007
8159 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 3:16 pm to
This is exactly like lumping in suicides, homicides and justifiable homicides all together as Gun Deaths. Not all of the "medical errors" are actual physician malpractice errors. You have to dig into the information yourself.
Posted by yallallcrazy
Member since Oct 2007
763 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 3:23 pm to
A lot of what is called 'error' really is something else, and a lot of actual errors do not lead to a patients demise but are statistically counted (IE a patient given a wrong med during a hospitalization who dies during that stay but not directly from the error). Many 'errors' are things like hospital acquired infections, which are simply not entirely preventable. Doesn't mean there shouldn't be an aggressive attempt ( there clearly should be), but if you need a ventilator for a long time you may well get pneumonia anyway. Is it an 'error'? Or is it just that whatever made you sick enough to need the vent initially just eventually won?

Also, the Monday morning QB issue is real. Many, many things of varying severity look alike initially, and the 'common things are common and rare things are rare' adage plays a role. When you already know the answer, you can look back at the trail of evidence and feel like it is idiotic that the diagnosis was missed. That said, the trail leading to a much more common problem may be exactly the same.
Posted by LSUwag
Florida man
Member since Jan 2007
17321 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 3:31 pm to
Having recently had a parent who was gravely ill, I can attest that the level of care in most hospitals is quite bad. The background if that my father is 70 years old and is a Type I diabetic. He has had a relatively healthy life but, it finally caught up with him. He got a would on his foot that was not properly diagnosed by his physician which was indeed a Staph Infection. He ended up in the hospital at Shands at the University of Florida. They were absolutely horrible in terms of the quality of care. They were incapable of doing anything other than what protocol called for in terms of managing his diabetes. They could not comprehend that the sliding scale does not work well with him. At one point, they allowed his sugar to rach 800.

Yes, it was 800 while in the hospital. It fried his brian as a result of that incident. He nearly died several times and was comatose for a few days.

Shands was a filthy hospital. While there his Staph infection turned into MRSA which resulted in an amputation of his foot at the calf. He has profound brain damage as well.

He lived through the ordeal and is basically like a child in his decision making now. He requires constant care and will never have any quality of life for whatever time he has remaining.

His malpractice involves improper diagnosis/testing because his original doctor did not order a culture and place him on antibiotics. He was not properly referred to a wound care clinic in a timely basis.

Improper care by diabetes Doctors. I stood face to face with the Doctor and told her that what she was doing was going to kill him. She said that she is following the sliding scale and would not deviate from it.

Filthy conditions. MRSA infection as result of exposure while in that damned filthy hospital.

Litigation has begun on his case but, that will never make him whole again. Additionally, my Mother's life is a nightmare because now, she has to nurse my father 24/7. That is all she does is provide care for him. Not much of a life for her.
Posted by OweO
Plaquemine, La
Member since Sep 2009
114111 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 4:02 pm to
You tell us.. frick! You are the one who will be starting your residency in July. I wouldn't be surprised if it's up there. Part of the reason is advancement in medicine, but people do not stay nearly as long in a hospital, after any type of surgery today, as they did.. 25 years ago. I remember reading something awhile back about how people are likely to heal faster at home opposed to staying in the hospital. Plus, like anything else you have human error. I would have no clue as to how many people go to the hospital to receive treatment in the US, every year, but even if 2 or 3% of that number die due to medical error.. I can only assume it would be a relatively high number.
Posted by WaWaWeeWa
Member since Oct 2015
15714 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 4:10 pm to
I'm guessing alot of the negative comments in here are from some who have never experienced what it is like to work in healthcare.

You really should understand what is happening in the average ED. The vast majority of patients coming in are misrepresenting their symptoms, exaggerating their symptoms, high, drunk, don't know their medications, don't know their medical history, misrepresent their drug allergies, lying for secondary gain, etc. For every ten of those patients their is the little old lady sent from the nursing home with an upset stomach who is the only one of the bunch who is actually having a heart attack. Somehow you have to sift through all of that bullshite. It's not as cut and dry as you think. Should we order MRIs and EKGs on everyone?

No. You use your clinical judgement to allocate the resources we have. When this is the case, statistically, bad outcomes will always happen. Please direct me to the moment that anyone has claimed MDs to be perfect, tests to be 100% accurate, etc.

But yet somehow you are all appalled by a study citing medical errors using extrapolated data and "death estimations". Wake up, medicine is difficult and complicated, but it's getting better everyday.
Posted by FelicianaTigerfan
Comanche County
Member since Aug 2009
26059 posts
Posted on 5/5/16 at 4:28 pm to
Impossible. Uneducated cops are the real threat
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